# Largest City W/o Pro Team **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 12, 2005, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589 "2005-05-12T19:18:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/1 "2005-05-12T19:18:18Z")
What is the largest Metropolitan Area without a team in one of the four major leagues? My WAG is Rochester, NY, but I am not sure where the data is. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Kenneth\_Noisewater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@Dr.Kenneth\_Noisewater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Kenneth_Noisewater)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/2 "2005-05-12T19:23:33Z")
I would be inclined to say Austin, TX merely out of prejudice. But AFAIK San Jose, CA\* or Columbus OH don’t have teams \*unless your four major leagues include the NHL - you weren’t specific and hockey isn’t that big ---
**Author:** ![BwanaBob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bwanabob/32/2985_2.png) [@BwanaBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BwanaBob)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/3 "2005-05-12T19:24:59Z")
Norfolk, VA - population is around 1.5 million if you include Newport News and Virginia Beach. Next up would be Las Vegas. I’m not counting Arena Football or minor leagues ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/4 "2005-05-12T19:25:39Z")
The largest metropolitan area without a pro team (assuming you mean a pro-team from the Big 4 sports leagues) is Portland. ---
**Author:** ![BwanaBob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bwanabob/32/2985_2.png) [@BwanaBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BwanaBob)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/5 "2005-05-12T19:27:35Z")
> [@Dr. Kenneth Noisewater](#): > > I would be inclined to say Austin, TX merely out of prejudice. But AFAIK San Jose, CA\* or Columbus OH don’t have teams > > \*unless your four major leagues include the NHL - you weren’t specific and hockey isn’t that big Hockey is considered to be the fourth sport behind NFL/MLB/NBA. It might not be big where you’re from but don’t dismiss it. ---
**Author:** ![capybara](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/capybara/32/202_2.png) [@capybara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/capybara)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/6 "2005-05-12T19:27:42Z")
Neurotik–Portland Oregon (Trailblazers?) or Maine? ---
**Author:** ![BwanaBob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bwanabob/32/2985_2.png) [@BwanaBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BwanaBob)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/7 "2005-05-12T19:28:41Z")
> [@Neurotik](#): > > The largest metropolitan area without a pro team (assuming you mean a pro-team from the Big 4 sports leagues) is Portland. What happened to the Trailblazers of the NBA? ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/8 "2005-05-12T19:29:07Z")
> [@capybara](#): > > Neurotik–Portland Oregon (Trailblazers?) or Maine? ARGH!!! I forgot about the Jailblazers. My bad. ---
**Author:** ![treis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bc79bd/32.png) [@treis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/treis)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/9 "2005-05-12T19:46:05Z")
Assuming we are talking about NBA/MLB/NFL/NHL it is indeed Austin, Texas at the 16th largest city in the nation. > **[Top 50 Cities in the U.S. by Population and Rank](https://www.infoplease.com/us/cities/top-50-cities-us-population-and-rank)** > > See the top 50 cities in the United States by population and rank. Observe how cities such as Houston, Texas and Jacksonville, Florida have increased in population. Learn which city is the most populous. ---
**Author:** ![StephenH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@StephenH](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StephenH)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/10 "2005-05-12T20:06:15Z")
> [@treis](#): > > Assuming we are talking about NBA/MLB/NFL/NHL it is indeed Austin, Texas at the 16th largest city in the nation. > > [http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763098.html](http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763098.html) Your answer may be right, but the OP mentioned we were talking about Metropolitan Areas, and I would hazard a guess that Austin is nowhere near the 16 largest metropolitan area in the country. Many cities in TX seems to have very inclusive city limits that make them appear larger than they really are. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/11 "2005-05-12T20:20:32Z")
I finally found a site with [2004 estimates for metropolitan areas](http://www.demographia.com/db-2004metro.htm). The largest metro area with no major teams is #29 Columbus. [Ohio State fanatics may differ. 😉] The smallest metro area with such a team is #46 Jacksonville. ---
**Author:** ![StephenH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@StephenH](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StephenH)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/12 "2005-05-12T20:20:46Z")
Actually, here is a good list of the largest metropolitan areas published by the census in ascii format. [http://www.census.gov/population/cen2000/phc-t3/tab03.txt](http://www.census.gov/population/cen2000/phc-t3/tab03.txt) I am not good at sports enough to know which city has which teams. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/13 "2005-05-12T20:22:38Z")
P.S. Green Bay doesn’t count. Sue me. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![JerH](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bb73d2/32.png) [@JerH](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerH)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/14 "2005-05-12T20:23:13Z")
List o’ metro area sizes [here](http://www.demographia.com/db-usmet2000.htm). Looking down the list, **BwanaBob** ’s answer of Norfolk seems to be right - 30th largest metro area, not major league teams. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/15 "2005-05-12T20:22:59Z")
> [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > The largest metro area with no major teams is #29 Columbus. [Ohio State fanatics may differ. 😉 Columbus has an NHL franchise. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/16 "2005-05-12T20:32:41Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > Columbus has an NHL franchise. OK, then with 2004 estimates, it’s #32 Las Vegas, which is now larger than #33 Virginia Beach-Norfolk-Newport News. Rochester, per the OP, is a miserable #52. How is it possible that Albany snuck ahead of it? And since when was Batavia included in the Rochester metro area? They must have redefined the boundaries in the 2003 revision. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/17 "2005-05-12T20:38:32Z")
Good info. It has been 10 years since I moved from ROchester, NY and it doesn’t surprise me that it has fallen off so much. ---
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/18 "2005-05-12T21:26:19Z")
::points and laughs at LA’s football team:: 😃 ---
**Author:** ![anson2995](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c77e96/32.png) [@anson2995](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anson2995)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/19 "2005-05-12T21:31:24Z")
> [@Exapno Mapcase](#): > > Rochester, per the OP, is a miserable #52. How is it possible that Albany snuck ahead of it? And since when was Batavia included in the Rochester metro area? They must have redefined the boundaries in the 2003 revision. Like other areas, people are fleeing the city, and the suburbs keep moving further and further out. Rochester has also lost population because of the massive numebrs of layoffs from the two biggest employers – Kodak and Xerox – over the last 15 years. I’m still here, though. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2005, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589/20 "2005-05-12T21:39:49Z")
While that’s true about Rochester, I think the Albany area is in even worse shape. But look at those 2000 census numbers from **StephenH’s** link. Albany was at #57 with only 875,583, not at #51 with 1,118,095. It didn’t grow larger; it got redefined to be larger retroactively. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/largest-city-w-o-pro-team/303589.md?page=2)