# Las Vegas police are never accountable **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 13, 2013, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585 "2013-04-13T08:35:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/1 "2013-04-13T08:35:49Z")
[ > [@](#): > > Stanley Gibson didn’t have a gun and he posed no threat. > > But that doesn’t matter in the eyes of the law. > > “The Nevada Supreme Court makes it perfectly clear that the mere perception of danger, as opposed to actual danger, is sufficient to warrant a killing in self-defense,” Clark County prosecutors wrote in their final report on the police shooting of the mentally ill Gulf War veteran. > > District Attorney Steve Wolfson said Thursday that the Las Vegas police officers involved in Gibson’s death would not face criminal charges, a decision that was expected but had been looming since his death on Dec. 12, 2011. > > Gibson, 43, was shot and killed when officer Jesus Arevalo fired seven shots from his AR-15 rifle into Gibson’s Cadillac during a standoff that began with a mistaken report of an attempted burglary at the Alondra apartments at 2451 N. Rainbow Blvd., near Smoke Ranch Road. ]([Las Vegas News | Breaking News & Headlines | Las Vegas Review-Journal](http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/crime-courts/criminal-charges-wont-be-filed-police-shooting-veteran)) No police shooting has resulted in criminal charges in Las Vegas, ever. Handcuffed guy running away and shot in the back? Justified. An unarmed man clad only in a pair of shorts, handcuffed and on the ground, surrounded by police with weapons aimed at him? Justified. Unarmed man with a basketball? Justified. As long as they kill and don’t merely wound, Las Vegas police know that they will never be prosecuted. Visitors to Las Vegas: be warned. ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/2 "2013-04-13T11:59:35Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > [url=[Las Vegas News | Breaking News & Headlines | Las Vegas Review-Journal](http://www.reviewjournal.com/news/crime-courts/criminal-charges-wont-be-filed-police-shooting-veteran)] > > No police shooting has resulted in criminal charges in Las Vegas, ever. > > Handcuffed guy running away and shot in the back? Justified. An unarmed man clad only in a pair of shorts, handcuffed and on the ground, surrounded by police with weapons aimed at him? Justified. Unarmed man with a basketball? Justified. > > As long as they kill and don’t merely wound, Las Vegas police know that they will never be prosecuted. Visitors to Las Vegas: be warned. No comment with regard to the other items you list, but in the story you linked to I’m not seeing any criminal intent, just a bunch of incompetence. ---
**Author:** ![Hung\_Mung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a88e4f/32.png) [@Hung\_Mung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hung_Mung)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/3 "2013-04-13T13:19:07Z")
This why I have a hard time trusting cops. Catch the wrong guy on the wrong day and he can beat the living shit out of you with no consequences. The local drug task force harassed my wife and her boss recently over seizing an account. Because the cops fucked up the paperwork, the suspect was able to get a bunch of his money out over a weekend and my wife gets threatened with getting arrested. Her branch had to pay out the money the cops claimed was missing and take it as a loss. It’s let’s go throw stuff in the quarry’d up. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/4 "2013-04-13T13:25:40Z")
Does the ruling not cut both ways? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/5 "2013-04-13T17:34:31Z")
Tell you what, **Quartz** : come to Vegas and set up a sniper position in a hotel on the Strip. When you see a cop car come to deal with a drunk or a speeding car or something, go ahead and kill the civilian and then claim that you were afraid that there was some danger to the cop, so you killed the guy he was dealing with. See if DA lets you walk. This being Vegas and all, what do you think the odds would be that you’d not be prosecuted at all? The Stanley Gibson case was even more egregious than that. He was literally, actually, trapped in his vehicle, penned in by cops cars on all sides. Watch the video. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/6 "2013-04-13T18:43:13Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Tell you what, **Quartz** : come to Vegas and set up a sniper position in a hotel on the Strip. When you see a cop car come to deal with a drunk or a speeding car or something, go ahead and kill the civilian and then claim that you were afraid that there was some danger to the cop, so you killed the guy he was dealing with. See if DA lets you walk. This being Vegas and all, what do you think the odds would be that you’d not be prosecuted at all? I know you’re upset about this incident and all, but that’s an intensely stupid analogy. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/7 "2013-04-13T18:49:28Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > I know you’re upset about this incident and all, but that’s an intensely stupid analogy. It’s pretty much what happened to Mr. Gibson, except the sniper was a police officer not a regular citizen. **Quartz** , please allow me to apologize for the tone of my reply to you. It was unnecessarily snarky. ---
**Author:** ![voltaire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voltaire/32/313_2.png) [@voltaire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/voltaire)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/8 "2013-04-13T19:39:02Z")
A Grand Jury declined to pass down any indictments. If you feel like your local law enforcement are not held accountable, it doesn’t seem it’s because of a rigged system with prosecutors protecting them, it’s because of your fellow citizens who were seated on the GJ. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/9 "2013-04-13T19:45:17Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > It’s pretty much what happened to Mr. Gibson, except the sniper was a police officer not a regular citizen. > > **Quartz** , please allow me to apologize for the tone of my reply to you. It was unnecessarily snarky. No problem. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/10 "2013-04-13T20:02:51Z")
> [@voltaire](#): > > A Grand Jury declined to pass down any indictments. If you feel like your local law enforcement are not held accountable, it doesn’t seem it’s because of a rigged system with prosecutors protecting them, it’s because of your fellow citizens who were seated on the GJ. Actually a federal DOJ investigation found that the system was rigged. From the police procedures to the Coroner’s Inquest to the laws on the books, the system is rigged in favor of the police. ([A Review of Officer-Involved Shootings in the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department](http://www.lvmpd.com/Portals/0/OIO/Collaborative%20Reform%20Process_FINAL.pdf) - WARNING! Very large .pdf file!) Here in Nevada, Grand Juries follow the recommendation of the prosecutor like 99.98% of the time. The Gibson GJ was no different; it followed the recommendation of the prosecutor, DA Steve Wolfson who was using it for cover so that he doesn’t have to take responsibility for not indicting Officer Arevalo. The Las Vegas Review-Journal did a huge story on Las Vegas police shootings starting in December of 2011. It’s available on [amazon.com](http://amazon.com) as a Kindle book ( [Amazon.com](http://www.amazon.com/Deadly-Force-Vegas-Police-ebook/dp/B006EV0WR0) ); the LVRJ seems to have taken it down from their website, unfortunately. In nearly 400 officer-involved shootings, not once has an officer been found to have acted improperly. To be clear, it’s not just Las Vegas police. Henderson, NV has had similar incidents as have other municipalities. No officer has ever, according to the law, shot and killed anyone improperly. And this valley has the highest use of force incidence of any place in the entire country. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/11 "2013-04-13T20:18:58Z")
> [@voltaire](#): > > A Grand Jury declined to pass down any indictments. If you feel like your local law enforcement are not held accountable, it doesn’t seem it’s because of a rigged system with prosecutors protecting them, it’s because of your fellow citizens who were seated on the GJ. The grand jury system is a joke. Any minimally competent prosecutor can get one to indict a ham sandwich. It’s just a rubber stamp. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/12 "2013-04-13T21:17:40Z")
So the prosecutor was not minimally competent in this case? ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/13 "2013-04-13T21:25:29Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > So the prosecutor was not minimally competent in this case? Either that, or this was all for show. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/14 "2013-04-13T21:56:38Z")
These things didn’t happen when Gil Grissom was on the job. But just look what happened when Cowboy Curtis and Sam the Bartender take over? I mean, they had no experience in cop work and they are bosses of the most famous crime scene investigating departments in the country? I’m just saying that those cops wouldn’t have walked if Grissom was still on the job. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/15 "2013-04-13T22:01:37Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > So the prosecutor was not minimally competent in this case? I covered that, and **alphaboi** reiterated: > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Here in Nevada, Grand Juries follow the recommendation of the prosecutor like 99.98% of the time. The Gibson GJ was no different; it followed the recommendation of the prosecutor, DA Steve Wolfson who was using it for cover so that he doesn’t have to take responsibility for not indicting Officer Arevalo. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-police-are-never-accountable/655585/16 "2013-04-13T22:16:18Z")
As someone who had a family member almost killed by a cop (in an otherwise-harmless little Midwest town), I’d like to say “It ain’t only Vegas”.