# Las Vegas: What happened is, in many ways, a miracle **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 4, 2017, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913 "2017-10-04T03:29:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Lucas\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lucas_jackson/32/303_2.png) [@Lucas\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucas_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/1 "2017-10-04T03:29:31Z")
[Or so says Trump.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/10/03/trump-on-response-to-las-vegas-shooting-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/?utm_term=.2f4a780366e8) I put this in this forum because everything he says is pointless. Asshole. ---
**Author:** ![jtur88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e9c0ed/32.png) [@jtur88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jtur88)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/2 "2017-10-04T06:17:23Z")
paywall ---
**Author:** ![Sunny\_Daze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunny_daze/32/438_2.png) [@Sunny\_Daze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunny_Daze)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/3 "2017-10-04T06:27:23Z")
> [@Lucas\_Jackson](#): > > [Or so says Trump.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/10/03/trump-on-response-to-las-vegas-shooting-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/?utm_term=.2f4a780366e8) > > I put this in this forum because everything he says is pointless. Asshole. Trump bumbled with the whole word thing again: > [@](#): > > From the President of the Poorlly Spoken > “Look, we have a tragedy. What happened is, in many ways, a miracle,” He did manage to clarify, if you’re patient, that he means that the police were able to act quickly and it’s a miracle that it wasn’t even worse. The police did a good job. I think the WaPo article made him seem more articulate than he came across when he was actually speaking, but I’m sure you’re familiar with his style. A little rambling, starts and stops, and jumps around. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 9:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/4 "2017-10-04T09:45:50Z")
Maybe “fortunate” would work better. It was fortunate that the police were able to put a stop to the attack. Or: It was the result of thorough training that the police were able to stop the attack. Not a miracle. Trump describing something accurately would be a miracle. A cynic might even see “miracle” as a sort of rallying dogwhistle to Christians. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/5 "2017-10-04T11:39:00Z")
It’s better than the snarky shit he’s been saying about Puerto Rico. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/6 "2017-10-04T13:23:42Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Maybe “fortunate” would work better. It was fortunate that the police were able to put a stop to the attack. Or: It was the result of thorough training that the police were able to stop the attack. Not a miracle. Trump describing something accurately would be a miracle. A cynic might even see “miracle” as a sort of rallying dogwhistle to Christians. I’m not 100% sure what the police are getting credit for here? The guy killed himself (apparently once his camera’s showed him that there were a lot of people outside his door (or maybe once he knew his location was known)). So the Manadaly security processes (identifying the room with a ‘fire’, etc.) seem to be the heroes (using the word in the modern loose meaning here). ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/7 "2017-10-04T13:27:43Z")
Many? In how MANY ways, exactly, was it a miracle? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/8 "2017-10-04T13:56:57Z")
> [@Isamu](#): > > Many? In how MANY ways, exactly, was it a miracle? There were good people, _very_ good people, on both sides. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/9 "2017-10-04T14:02:33Z")
_“Terrible tragedy in Las Vegas! So many victims! Look at that ugly carpet and drapes! Wouldn’t happen in a Trump property, I promise. The best, classiest furnishings, ever. Sad!”_ ---
**Author:** ![Lucas\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lucas_jackson/32/303_2.png) [@Lucas\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucas_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/10 "2017-10-04T15:16:18Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > There were good people, _very_ good people, on both sides. Ok, that’s funny. ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/11 "2017-10-04T17:16:19Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > Trump bumbled with the whole word thing again: > > He did manage to clarify, if you’re patient, that he means that the police were able to act quickly and it’s a miracle that it wasn’t even worse. The police did a good job. > > I think the WaPo article made him seem more articulate than he came across when he was actually speaking, but I’m sure you’re familiar with his style. A little rambling, starts and stops, and jumps around. GodDAMN but I miss Obama. ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/12 "2017-10-04T17:39:59Z")
> [@Lightnin](#): > > GodDAMN but I miss Obama. I even miss Bush at this point. ---
**Author:** ![Lucas\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lucas_jackson/32/303_2.png) [@Lucas\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lucas_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/13 "2017-10-04T17:50:18Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > He did manage to clarify, if you’re patient, that he means that the police were able to act quickly and it’s a miracle that it wasn’t even worse. The police did a good job. I have no comment on how well the police did their job but Trump has repeatedly claimed how fast they were able to stop the gunman. Trump: _“The Las Vegas Metropolitan Police were able to find the demented shooter and stop him from even more killing!”_ By my reading of the reports it was neither fast nor did they get him. \*Clark County Sheriff Joseph Lombardo said, “We believe the individual killed himself prior to our entry,” \* Apparently they entered his room between 2 and 2 1/2 hours after arriving. And again, I’m not criticizing law personnel only Trumps interpretation of events. If I had a loved one hurt or killed in that attack I’m not sure “miracle” is the way I would want to hear it described. He is a stupid, insensitive buffoon. And a lying, self-serving asshole. . ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/14 "2017-10-04T17:52:45Z")
> [@Lucas\_Jackson](#): > > I have no comment on how well the police did their job but Trump has repeatedly claimed how fast they were able to stop the gunman. > > Trump: _“The Las Vegas Metropolitan Police were able to find the demented shooter and stop him from even more killing!”_ > > By my reading of the reports it was neither fast nor did they get him. > > \*Clark County Sheriff Joseph Lombardo said, “We believe the individual killed himself prior to our entry,” \* > . To be fair, the individual killed himself because cops were coming. Without cops coming, he had no reason to off himself…yet. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/15 "2017-10-04T20:11:14Z")
> [@Isamu](#): > > Many? In how MANY ways, exactly, was it a miracle? Let me count the ways… ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/16 "2017-10-04T20:27:46Z")
> [@Sunny\_Daze](#): > > He did manage to clarify, if you’re patient, that he means that the police were able to act quickly and it’s a miracle that it wasn’t even worse. The police did a good job. How is someone doing a good job miraculous? It sounds like what you would expect from a well trained police force in a large urban area. The reason you hire people and train them is to they do a good job. It’s not “miraculous,” **even in the figurative sense.** I would think the President of a large country would know the meaning of common words. If a cop had taken a Hail Mary shot from the street and hit him, that would, figuratively speaking, have been “miraculous.” It’s not literally a miracle but would be such an unlikely and fortunate thing I’d see how the word would make sense. But just rushing the room quickly is what cops do. ---
**Author:** ![Buttercup\_Smith](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buttercup_smith/32/473_2.png) [@Buttercup\_Smith](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buttercup_Smith)\ **Post date:** [October 4, 2017, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/17 "2017-10-04T22:54:40Z")
The Big Cheese is just so not articulate. A national embarrassment. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2017, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/18 "2017-10-05T00:05:19Z")
It would have maybe been a miracle if the police were able to break down the door and take him out without any of them getting hurt. But that’s not what happened. Obviously the guy was planning to kill himself the moment the cops came. And it was not a miracle that the cops were around. Anyone who has ever been near the strip knows there is more than one or two cops around, and for very good reason. This in not Stinking Desert, Nevada after all. The cops seemed to have done a good and professional job. The miracle. That Trump, who is to quote his own SecState a moron, isn’t too stupid to breath. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2017, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/19 "2017-10-05T01:20:16Z")
He needs to quickly get out of this recently acquired habit of downplaying tragedies by talking about how amazing and miraculous they really are. No one needs to be reminded that things could be a lot worse. Things can ALWAYS be a lot worse. But it does matter one bit if you’ve lost a loved one. It’s obvious to me that Trump has never been in the position of providing comfort to someone, and he doesn’t have enough empathy to wing it convincingly. I really hope he gets better at this. My face muscles can only take so much cringing. ---
**Author:** ![si\_blakely](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d9b06d/32.png) [@si\_blakely](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/si_blakely)\ **Post date:** [October 5, 2017, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913/20 "2017-10-05T01:24:16Z")
As I understand it, the Las Vegas police executed a response strategy that differs significantly from prior active shooter situations, and probably saved lives as they did so. Traditionally, there would have been a perimeter established and cleared, and then SWAT would have moved in slowly and cautiously. Evidence from other active shooter events indicate that one victim dies every 15 seconds, so the response has to be faster. Las Vegas police officers in the vicinity formed an ad-hoc squad, and searched directly for the shooter without waiting for the SWAT team. Either their presence or the presence of a hotel security guard who was wounded through the door triggered the suicide of the shooter. While the room itself was not breached for another hour, no further shooting was occurring during that period, and care did need to be taken to ensure that there were no explosives present. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/las-vegas-what-happened-is-in-many-ways-a-miracle/797913.md?page=2)