# Latin phrase question **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 24, 2013, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812 "2013-03-24T12:58:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/21 "2013-03-24T19:14:33Z")
I believe that should be “wassamatta for you?” Cite: Chico Marx. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/22 "2013-03-24T19:17:38Z")
> [@\_Quiubo\_vato](#): > > Meae felis est vester felis. Why the genitive _meae_? Why the genitive _felis_? And why the masculine nominative _vester_, when \*feles \*is feminine? ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/23 "2013-03-24T19:55:02Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > … “_sigh_ Okay, I’ll take one for the team. What’s a matta-u?” … > [@\_Quiubo\_vato](#): > > Nothin’s matta me, whasa matta-u?.. > [@Polycarp](#): > > As I recall, Bullwinkle J. Moose is a graduate of Wassamatta U. > [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > I believe that should be “wassamatta _for_ you?” Cite: Chico Marx. Italics added. Two more cites: Bugs Bunny, mid-50s, as Italian chef, singing the "[Wassamatta for you" song](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FOTlNOZB4Zo&feature=youtube_gdata_player) The Cellos, mid-50s, their doo-wop rock song "[What’s the Matter for You"](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0v7I2MlEnM&feature=youtube_gdata_player) Both cites are to YouTube. Man, is this a slow Sunday morning at the Bloom house. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/24 "2013-03-24T20:12:59Z")
The Latin for which, by the way, is “Quid res tibi?” ---
**Author:** ![Vaevictis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f04885/32.png) [@Vaevictis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vaevictis)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/25 "2013-03-24T20:57:52Z")
If you mean ‘I have a cat and you are welcome to treat it as your own’ I’d go with, “Mea feles est tua” or “Tua est mea feles”. Use feles for a classical tone, cattus for a late antique feel. Definitely do not say: Meae felis est vester felis. Also, no accusatives here, ‘est’ is intransitive and predicate nouns generally go in the nominative anyway. Standard word order of subject-object-verb doesn’t apply when sum is used as a copula because Latin treats copulative sum as a throw away word. The form of sum can go basically before or after any discrete word or word groupings with two qualifications. First, it might often sound wrong if it comes first because that is a common location for sum in its existential rather than copulative use. ‘Est feles…’ would tend to sound like ‘There is the/a/my cat.’ Having just the right context would mitigate this, but I’d bet most of the time it would be awkward sounding. Secondly, there is is a tendency (but not necessity) to throw the form of sum into the wake of whatever word(s) are being most emphasized. This point is not important here because our sentence is so short that any position for est will put it in the wake of important words. Here’s my logic for the order ‘Mea feles est tua’ or ‘Tua est mea feles’. 1. As already stated, we don’t want copulative est first. 2. We do not want mea/feles/tua to run together in a way that makes them look like a single word grouping. ‘Tua mea feles’ and the like sounds awkward because in ‘noster’ Latin already has a word for a run-together tua+mea. Heavy punctuation could avoid this impression but that would be awkward in its own right too. 3. Given #2, we need to use ‘est’ to separate tua from mea. So we lose what would otherwise be the option to put est at the end of the sentence. We also lose what would be Latin’s first tendency, omission of any form of sum that is not receiving special emphasis. 4. So we need tua and mea each on other sides of est. But should feles go with tua or mea? If it is all equal and either is fine, then the sentence is wordy and tua and mea should be replaced by nostra. Otherwise, observe Roman desire for economy of expression and put feles with whoever owns the cat most. Thus: Tua feles est mea. 'You own a cat that I get to consider as mine". Mea feles est tua. “I own a cat that you get to consider as yours.” Mi casa es su casa and translated equivalents have penetrated English enough that anyone saying ‘My cat is your cat’ will probably be taken to mean “I own a cat that you get to consider as yours” so we’ll go with mea feles. Tua feles est mea feles and the like prompt the audience to think, ‘Gosh, that is an awfully wordy way to say nostra feles. Maybe we are looking at an example of style making a fetish of repetition – perhaps this is a grave, archaic and even religious sounding statement.’ 1. Finally, does the tua or mea part go first in the sentence? Let whichever should receive the most emphasis go first. Tua est mea feles: My cat is YOUR cat. Mea feles est tua: MY cat is your cat. ---
**Author:** ![Vaevictis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f04885/32.png) [@Vaevictis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vaevictis)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/26 "2013-03-24T21:05:28Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > The Latin for which, by the way, is “Quid res tibi?” Quae res tibi? for the feminine res. ---
**Author:** ![FuzzyOgre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@FuzzyOgre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FuzzyOgre)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/27 "2013-03-25T06:41:53Z")
Wow! Thanks everyone. I thought my lightweight question would disappear from sight, but it seems people love latin around here. Thanks for letting me study at Wassamatta U. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/28 "2013-03-25T08:37:45Z")
So who’s better, **Fuzzy** , **Vaevictis** or Google Translate? ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/29 "2013-03-25T14:35:39Z")
> [@Svejk\_1](#): > > Why the genitive _meae_? Why the genitive _felis_? And why the masculine nominative _vester_, when \*feles \*is feminine? A pussy is implicitly female? Whodathunk? ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/30 "2013-03-25T20:31:33Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > A pussy is implicitly female? Whodathunk? Only if it’s “feles” – if it’s “cattus”, then it’s masculine. Linguistic gender is not necessarily connected with sex. In French, I would be “un homme” (a man – masculine) or “une personne” (a person – feminine). In German, my wife would be “eine Frau” (a woman – feminine) or “ein Weib” (a wife – neuter). ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/31 "2013-03-25T21:48:30Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > That would be **VERY** late Iberian dialect! 😃 > > **Giles** , any particular reason for choosing _cattus_ over _felis_? I know they’re both valid usages (which surprises people who think “cattus” is pseudo-Latin). you mean “dog-Latin”. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/32 "2013-03-25T22:06:59Z")
Icisneday atinamlay orcorumpay? ---
**Author:** ![FuzzyOgre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@FuzzyOgre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FuzzyOgre)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2013, 6:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812/33 "2013-03-26T06:41:55Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > So who’s better, **Fuzzy** , **Vaevictis** or Google Translate? Vae, I would say. Any answer with an explanation holds a lot more weight in my books. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-phrase-question/653812.md?page=1)