# Latin translation request: "The black dog does not ride me" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 5, 2013, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184 "2013-11-05T21:52:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/1 "2013-11-05T21:52:20Z")
Anyone want to help me with an English to Latin translation? Barring that, is anyone \*willing \*to help? I would like to translate “The black dog does not ride me.” It’s for a piece of artwork - I don’t plan on using this phrase in everyday conversation. Google translate gives me “Nigra canis non me equitare.” However, when I feed it back in, I get “I do not ride a black dog,” which makes me think that Google’s original translation may be somewhat lacking in accuracy. Many thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/2 "2013-11-05T21:54:11Z")
In Soviet Rome, Canis equitare TU! ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/3 "2013-11-05T21:58:10Z")
The back translation is definitely wrong - in your Latin phrase, “canis” is in the subject case (nominative) and “me” is in the object case (accusative), so there’s no way that “I” am riding “the dog”. The only real criticisms are: - The verb infinitive is given, whereas the third person present indicative active is wanted. No problem, that’s just “equitat”. - The colour adjective appears feminine to me, whereas “canis” is not, so it should be “Canis niger non me equitat” and we’re going home happy. (“Canis niger” because you normally put the qualifying adjective after the substantive noun, just like in “Ursa major”, the Great Bear) ---
**Author:** ![CJJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecc23a/32.png) [@CJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CJJ)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/4 "2013-11-05T22:02:30Z")
> [@cwthree](#): > > Anyone want to help me with an English to Latin translation? Barring that, is anyone \*willing \*to help? > > I would like to translate “The black dog does not ride me.” It’s for a piece of artwork - I don’t plan on using this phrase in everyday conversation. > > Google translate gives me “Nigra canis non me equitare.” However, when I feed it back in, I get “I do not ride a black dog,” which makes me think that Google’s original translation may be somewhat lacking in accuracy. > > Many thanks. _Niger canis non me equitat_. Some points to consider: 1. If the gender of the dog is unimportant, this is OK. But if you specifically mean a bitch dog, use _Nigra_ in place of _Niger_. 2. If you want “black” here to have a more sisnster connotation, use _Ater/Atra_ in place of _Niger/Nigra_ 3. _equitat_ specifically means “ride like a horse”. If you want this to be more abstract like “drive” or “control”, _agit_ or _agitat_ is probably better (the latter has a frequentative sense, like “drive over and over”). ETA: **Malacandra** ’s suggestion of _Canis niger_ is fine as well, and more in line with the schoolbooks. I’ve found in my reading that the “rule” requiring adjectives of quality follow their noun is more like a guideline. ---
**Author:** ![bibliophage](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bibliophage/32/7615_2.png) [@bibliophage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bibliophage)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/5 "2013-11-05T22:37:02Z")
_Equitare_ is normally intransitive. When it takes a accusative object it refers, as far as I can tell, to the place through which one is riding, not the animal on which one is riding. Maybe _Cane atro non vehor_ (“I am not ridden by the black dog”). _Ater_ means “dull black.” If you prefer _niger_ (“shiny black”), the correct form is _cane nigro_. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/6 "2013-11-05T22:57:03Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **CJJ** \*: > > ETA: Malacandra’s suggestion of Canis niger is fine as well, and more in line with the schoolbooks. I’ve found in my reading that the “rule” requiring adjectives of quality follow their noun is more like a guideline. It can go either way; Latin’s not picky about word order. As a rule of thumb, the word you put first is the one you want to emphasize more, and a noun is usually more important than the adjectives modifying it, so you usually go noun-first. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/7 "2013-11-05T23:00:02Z")
Is ‘black dog’ a euphemism for depression? (q.v. Winston Churchill.) ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2013, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/8 "2013-11-05T23:53:43Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > The back translation is definitely wrong - in your Latin phrase, “canis” is in the subject case (nominative) and “me” is in the object case (accusative), so there’s no way that “I” am riding “the dog”. The only real criticisms are: > … > [@Chronos](#): > > It can go either way; Latin’s not picky about word order… This is correct. Latin word order is very flexible, and subjects and objects (noun case) are identified by their endings, not by their positioning in the sentence. Modern English almost exclusively uses word order to distinguish case. One of the classic first-semester Latin example sets goes something like this: Puella puerum amat. The girl loves the boy. \<3 Puer puellam amat. The boy loves the girl. \<3 In both of these cases, it doesn’t matter what order you put the words in, so “Puer puellam amat” means the same thing as “Puellam puer amat”, which means the same as “Amat puellam puer”, etc. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2013, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/9 "2013-11-06T01:19:12Z")
I think you need to explain the context a bit more. Do you mean “ride” as in ride a bicycle? Or are you using it in some figurative or analogical sense, e.g. to support, to guide, to control, to oppress, to provoke, to have sexual intercourse with, to have money staked on? Because, if you intend anything other than riding in the primary sitting-astride sense, the figurative sense you intend may not carry over in a strictly literal translation. And it strikes me as improbable that you intend to say that the black dog does not sit astride you while you carry it. ---
**Author:** ![CJJ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecc23a/32.png) [@CJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CJJ)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2013, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/10 "2013-11-06T01:20:16Z")
> [@bibliophage](#): > > _Equitare_ is normally intransitive. When it takes a accusative object it refers, as far as I can tell, to the place through which one is riding, not the animal on which one is riding. Maybe _Cane atro non vehor_ (“I am not ridden by the black dog”). _Ater_ means “dull black.” If you prefer _niger_ (“shiny black”), the correct form is _cane nigro_. I agree _equitare_ is normally intransitive in CL, so if we want to use it we should probably have _super me_ instead of a bare _me_. But that might be a bit pedantic… I don’t agree with _Cane atro non vehor_; that’s literally “I am not carried by means of a black dog.” Better is _Canis ater non (a) me vehitur_. I’m not sure about the preposition _a_ here–for Latinists its the difference between agency and means–but I think it should be omitted despite the fact that _me_ refers to a person. ANother pedantic point, but that’s what happens when you get a few Latinists together 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2013, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/11 "2013-11-06T14:27:56Z")
Thank you, Latinists of the Straight Dope! > [@Quartz](#): > > Is ‘black dog’ a euphemism for depression? (q.v. Winston Churchill.) Yes, “black dog” in this instance is a reference to Churchill’s euphemism. So, I suppose I need a more sinister meaning of “black” than _niger_, as **CJJ** \* suggested. > [@UDS](#): > > I think you need to explain the context a bit more. Do you mean “ride” as in ride a bicycle? Or are you using it in some figurative or analogical sense, e.g. to support, to guide, to control, to oppress, to provoke, to have sexual intercourse with, to have money staked on? Because, if you intend anything other than riding in the primary sitting-astride sense, the figurative sense you intend may not carry over in a strictly literal translation. And it strikes me as improbable that you intend to say that the black dog does not sit astride you while you carry it. I’m using “ride” to mean guided or controlled by, although being sat upon like a horse would not be inappropriate (Similar to “the monkey on your back” to describe addiction). > [@CJJ](#): > > _Niger canis non me equitat_. > 2. If you want “black” here to have a more sisnster connotation, use _Ater/Atra_ in place of _Niger/Nigra_ > > 1. _equitat_ specifically means “ride like a horse”. If you want this to be more abstract like “drive” or “control”, _agit_ or _agitat_ is probably better (the latter has a frequentative sense, like “drive over and over”). I agree, _ater/atra_ and _agit/agitat_ or \*vehit \*is more appropriate in this context. > [@CJJ](#): > > I agree _equitare_ is normally intransitive in CL, so if we want to use it we should probably have _super me_ instead of a bare _me_. But that might be a bit pedantic… > I don’t agree with _Cane atro non vehor_; that’s literally “I am not carried by means of a black dog.” Better is _Canis ater non (a) me vehitur_. _Canis ater non me vehitur_ sounds like the best way to express the sentiment I’m trying to convey: “The sinisterly-dark dog does not control where I go/what I do”. Am I understanding all this correctly? Again, many thanks to you all. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2013, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/12 "2013-11-06T15:35:27Z")
I think [_agitat_](http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=agito&fromdoc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0059) was a much better suggestion for the OP’s meaning. _Canis ater non me agitat_ or, with emphasis on _me_, _Non me agitat canis ater_. ---
**Author:** ![cwthree](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9de0a6/32.png) [@cwthree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cwthree)\ **Post date:** [November 6, 2013, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/13 "2013-11-06T17:46:13Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > I think [_agitat_](http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=agito&fromdoc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.04.0059) was a much better suggestion for the OP’s meaning. > > _Canis ater non me agitat_ > > or, with emphasis on _me_, > > _Non me agitat canis ater_. After reading the discussion of \*agito \*at the link, I’m inclined to agree. The discussions of _vehor_ [here](http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus:text:1999.04.0060:entry=veho)and [here](http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/hopper/text?doc=Perseus:text:1999.04.0059:entry=veho) make it sound like \*vehitur \*connotes carrying rather than urging forward. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Angel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d26b3c/32.png) [@Johnny\_Angel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Angel)\ **Post date:** [November 7, 2013, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/latin-translation-request-the-black-dog-does-not-ride-me/673184/14 "2013-11-07T08:29:16Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > - The colour adjective appears feminine to me, whereas “canis” is not, _Canis_ may be masculine or feminine. So sayeth the OLD.