# Legality of Columbo's trick with the cigar box **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** tv-shows-scripted\ **Created:** [January 23, 2025, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310 "2025-01-23T22:24:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/161 "2025-01-26T17:12:31Z")
> [@Mighty\_Mouse](#): > > I come to your house with my toddler. You have prepared poisoned cookies to feed my toddler. I try to share those cookies with YOUR toddler. Am I guilty of assault? What is your intent? I’m not asking what anyone else in the hypothetical _thinks_ your intent is while you’re doing it, because AFAICT that’s irrelevant. I’m asking: what’s your intent when you try to share those cookies with a toddler? Are you trying to cause fear? ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/162 "2025-01-26T17:44:04Z")
I am trying to determine if they are safe to eat. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/163 "2025-01-26T17:45:46Z")
I don’t think that’s correct. Possibly the suspect can sue Columbo in civil court but a criminal assault will require intent. Then in civil court the case will be dismissed because the suspect does not have ‘clean hands’. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/164 "2025-01-26T17:51:29Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Possibly the suspect can sue Columbo in civil court but a criminal assault will require intent. I agree that criminal assault would require intent from Person A, but I don’t believe that Person B needs to think, at that time, that Person A has that intent. And I believe Columbo had that intent, but that — if he doesn’t admit to it while he’s under oath — yeah, he could pretend that he _didn’t_ expect what he presumably expected, and that he didn’t intend what he presumably intended. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/165 "2025-01-26T18:02:37Z")
Yes they do have to think at the time that there was an intent to harm them. If you put a bomb in a box that will go off if the box is opened but you don’t tell someone about the bomb and they attempt to open the box they aren’t assaulting you. They are merely attempting to open a box, they have no intent to harm you, you don’t think they intend to harm you, and there’s no assault of any kind. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/166 "2025-01-26T18:08:19Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > If you put a bomb in a box that will go off if the box is opened but you don’t tell someone about the bomb and they attempt to open the box they aren’t assaulting you. They are merely attempting to open a box, they have no intent to harm you, you don’t think they intend to harm you, and there’s no assault of any kind. I think you’re mixing up two things, here. As I understand it, the question is whether the person opening the box has an intent to _cause fear_ — not whether they have an intent to _harm_ anyone, and not whether the other person thinks they have an intent to cause harm, and not whether the other person thinks they have an intent to cause fear. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/167 "2025-01-26T18:22:40Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > He suspected the perp might be frightened by the box, but this is what he was trying to find out. I am reminded of a Criminal Intent where Goren was trying to elicit a spontaneous confession out of a suspect who not only had killed the victim of the week, but Goren suspects may have in fact murdered several others that were classed as muggings. After getting the suspect worked up and in an excited emotional state, he shows a bit of evidence, a license plate number of a previous victim that the suspect had written down. The suspect says, “that’s no evidence”, grabs it, and yells “it isn’t even the right plate number!” Oops! Since Columbo had to manufacture the case, as the real one did in fact explode, it would have been better (?) if Roddy had yelled at Lt that “that isn’t even the same case I rigged!” ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/168 "2025-01-26T18:31:13Z")
[quote=“The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper, post:166, topic:1013310, full:true”] > [@TriPolar](#): > > I think you’re mixing up two things, here. > > As I understand it, the question is whether the person opening the box has an intent to _cause fear_ — not whether they have an intent to _harm_ anyone, and not whether the other person thinks they have an intent to cause harm, and not whether the other person thinks they have an intent to cause fear. I’m not sure what you’re trying to say there. An assault is something that happens in the mind of a victim. It doesn’t become an assault because of something in the mind of the perpetrator discovered after the fact. No fear of harm from an assailant and there’s no assault. The suspect in this case did not believe Columbo was an assailant, did not believe Colombo intended to harm him. He was not assaulted. ---
**Author:** ![Nars\_Glinley](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nars_glinley/32/8177_2.png) [@Nars\_Glinley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nars_Glinley)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/169 "2025-01-26T18:34:56Z")
Without taking sides, I doubt that any Columbo episode has ever been discussed this much. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/170 "2025-01-26T18:35:54Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > After getting the suspect worked up and in an excited emotional state, he shows a bit of evidence, a license plate number of a previous victim that the suspect had written down. The suspect says, “that’s no evidence”, grabs it, and yells “it isn’t even the right plate number!” Oops! Coming back around, in another episode, Columbo got the win against Dick Van Dyke by yammering on and on about how he’d personally blown up the kidnapper’s instant-camera photo, albeit while clumsily destroying the original in the process, and this here image of the no-numbers analog clock proves the crime happened when (a) the guy you blamed has an ironclad alibi, but (b) you, sir, have no alibi. Dick Van Dyke — who of course realizes that Columbo has, while blowing it up, reversed the image — grabs the instant camera that would still have a negative that’ll reveal the truth, and says so. Which is to say: grabbing _that_ camera, and not, y’know, one of the other ones that were _right next to it._ ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/171 "2025-01-26T18:39:34Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I’m not sure what you’re trying to say there. An assault is something that happens in the mind of a victim. It doesn’t become an assault because of something in the mind of the perpetrator discovered after the fact. No fear of harm from an assailant and there’s no assault But my point is, he has fear of harm from Columbo: no, he doesn’t have fear that Columbo is about to intentionally harm him; but, yes, he does have fear that Columbo is about to harm him. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/172 "2025-01-26T18:40:27Z")
Considering the number of people who discuss episodes of Columbo I’m sure that it has. Possibly not in so lengthy a discussion by a small group of people, but certainly in the entirety of all people discussing a particular episode. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/173 "2025-01-26T18:43:17Z")
And again, not an assault. He feared unintentional harm from Columbo’s actions. And the suspect was perfectly capable of eliminating that fear by revealing what he had done, which is what he did. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/174 "2025-01-26T18:49:08Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > And again, not an assault. He feared unintentional harm from Columbo’s actions. You’re saying he feared harm from Columbo’s actions. Yes, you’re saying he feared _unintentional_ harm, but you and I agree that _he feared harm from Columbo’s actions._ I’d add that, if Columbo intended to cause that effect, AFAICT, that can satisfy the requirements of it being a crime. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/175 "2025-01-26T18:49:52Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > But my point is, he has fear of harm from Columbo He has fear of harm from his own actions, from his bomb that he made. If I served you wine from a bottle that you secretly poisoned it is comical that you could blame me for your fear, that I am somehow the cause of your discomfort. You caused your own problems, not me. He’s not scared because Columbo opened a box, he’s scared of the bomb that he himself put in the box. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/176 "2025-01-26T18:50:43Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > grabs the instant camera that would still have a negative that’ll reveal the truth, and says so. > > Which is to say: grabbing _that_ camera, and not, y’know, one of the other ones that were _right next to it._ Which is both Columbo’s strength as an investigator, and the reason I can’t take the show in large doses. He annoys people so much and gets them flustered so much they make mistakes. But in the aggregate, there aren’t that many people that commit foolproof crimes, are arrogant enough to go against Columbo, and have someone as smart as Columbo working the case. And in real life Columbo’s trick depends on precise timing. It’s often an all-or-nothing play. I guess, like Hamilton Burger, we just don’t see the 15 cases where Columbo tries the same tricks, but the perp is too smart or clever or just lucky. No convictions don’t make for good TV! > [@Nars\_Glinley](#): > > Without taking sides, I doubt that any Columbo episode has ever been discussed this much. I’d enjoy as long a discussion of The Most Dangerous Match, or Swan Song, but mostly because I wanted Johnny Cash to murder Columbo and leave his body in the desert. It was a stupid play by Columbo to trust him to not do that. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/177 "2025-01-26T18:58:06Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > He has fear of harm from his own actions, from his bomb that he made. > > If I served you wine from a bottle that you secretly poisoned it is comical that you could blame me for your fear, that I am somehow the cause of your discomfort. You caused your own problems, not me. > > He’s not scared because Columbo opened a box, he’s scared of the bomb that he himself put in the box I disagree. I think it’s entirely accurate to say that he’s scared because Columbo opened the box. Yes, it’s also accurate to say that he’s scared because of his own actions, but it’s _also_ also accurate to say he’s scared because of Columbo’s actions. Look, if there’s a gun in front of us that we both know is unloaded, and you load it, and I pick it up and point it at you and start to pull the trigger, I believe there’s a sense in which someone could say you’re scared of the bullets that you put in the gun, but I believe it’s also accurate ro say that you’re scared that I’m going to pull the trigger. And I don’t see what changes if you don’t know the real thing secretly got swapped out for a fake, or if you don’t know that I know you loaded the real thing: you _can_ still be scared that I’m going to pull the trigger. ---
**Author:** ![HMS\_Irruncible](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hms_irruncible/32/7394_2.png) [@HMS\_Irruncible](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HMS_Irruncible)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/178 "2025-01-26T19:05:29Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > As I understand it, _“an assault is ordinarily held to be committed merely by putting another in apprehension of harm, whether or not the actor actually intends to inflict or is capable of inflicting that harm.”_ It doesn’t, AFAIK, involve Person B needing to think that Person A has the intent to cause harm — which is why I’ve been genuinely mystified every time that point has been raised. It absolutely does depend on this, though. Assault isn’t _actual_ injury, it’s about threatening injury. so its definition rests _entirely_ on what both parties believe about conduct that could lead to an injury. Let’s say you’re a pedestrian crossing the road, maybe with a convenient policeman standing around. I’m rolling down the road in my SUV and I come dangerously close to running you down. You yell out, the policeman’s attention is aroused, and very shortly I’m in cuffs. But what am I charged with? It very much depends on what you & the police feel my intent was. If they feel that I intended to hurt you, then it’s assault (and they have to prove that intent). If they can’t prove intent, then it’s some flavor of reckless endangerment. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/179 "2025-01-26T19:05:49Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > And in real life Columbo’s trick depends on precise timing. It’s often an all-or-nothing play. I guess, like Hamilton Burger, we just don’t see the 15 cases where Columbo tries the same tricks, but the perp is too smart or clever or just lucky. No convictions don’t make for good TV! Off the top of my head, we do get to see him fail, partway through the episode, against Robert Culp: he’s been pestering Culp about one murder all this time, and Culp has just committed _another_ murder to cover up the first one, and, well, when word comes in that one of Culp’s employees has been found dead, the scruffy lieutenant with a beat-up car that sometimes works asks Culp for a ride over to the scene of the crime. Culp obliges, and once they’re in his much fancier car and preparing to get on the road, Culp innocuously asks which way he should go, and Columbo pretends to have no idea what he’s talking about, and Culp smugly explains that he wouldn’t know where they’re going, would he? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2025, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310/180 "2025-01-26T19:07:44Z")
> [@HMS\_Irruncible](#): > > The charge very much depends on what you & the police feel my intent was. If they feel that I intended to hurt you, then it’s assault (and they have to prove that intent). If they can’t prove intent, then it’s some flavor of reckless endangerment Right, but: in that scenario, AFAIK I don’t need to believe, at the time, that you intended to harm me, or that you intended to cause fear; just that you were about to harm me. I can later learn that you intended to harm me, or intense to cause fear. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/legality-of-columbos-trick-with-the-cigar-box/1013310.md?page=10)