# lemons and livers **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [January 5, 2013, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170 "2013-01-05T16:28:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![lazybratsche](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ba8739/32.png) [@lazybratsche](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lazybratsche)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2013, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/21 "2013-01-05T22:41:33Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > I’m not sure what you mean by that. Are you taking issue with what I said in the post you quoted or was there something else on your mind? I think he was just pointing out an (apparently inadvertent) pun: you referred to the pH of lemon juice as a “basic point”. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2013, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/22 "2013-01-05T22:49:04Z")
I eat whole lemons, maybe two or three a week. I also eat at least part of the rinds. I must have a cast iron liver by now. Tastes damn good. I like them better than oranges. ---
**Author:** ![bot3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/41988e/32.png) [@bot3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bot3)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2013, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/23 "2013-01-05T23:13:02Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > I eat whole lemons, maybe two or three a week. I also eat at least part of the rinds. I must have a cast iron liver by now. > > Tastes damn good. I like them better than oranges. I will also eat the rind and skin of lemons and oranges. Very refreshing and makes the mouth and breath smell nice. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2013, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/24 "2013-01-05T23:15:16Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > I eat whole lemons, maybe two or three a week. I also eat at least part of the rinds. I must have a cast iron …_stomach_ by now. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/25 "2013-01-06T00:04:43Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > When I once pointed out that lemon juice was acidic, not alkaline, I was told that while it’s acidic in the glass, it makes your \*body \*more alkaline through…some alchemy that was not explained to me. > > I used to hang out with lots of these people. They made my head hurt. I think it was from doing this all the time: :smack: I’ve heard stuff like that - lemon juice as a remedy for acid indigestion because the citric acid ‘counteracts the stomach acid’. Never any explanation how that might be. Chemistry by magic. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/26 "2013-01-06T00:37:42Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > Lemon is not alkaline, for a start. It’s quite acidic. This. Lemons, limes, oranges, and grapefruit are full of acid. In fact, the sour receptors on the tongue pretty much work by detecting acid. Lemon or orange juice would turn any litmus paper red. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/27 "2013-01-06T00:40:54Z")
> [@saje](#): > > Lemons contain … ascorbic acid… Also known as “Vitamin C”. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/28 "2013-01-06T00:59:13Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > I eat whole lemons, maybe two or three a week. I also eat at least part of the rinds. I must have a cast iron liver by now. > > Tastes damn good. I like them better than oranges. I do too, but that doesn’t mean anything other than you and I like sour stuff. ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/29 "2013-01-06T03:31:39Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > I’ve heard stuff like that - lemon juice as a remedy for acid indigestion because the citric acid ‘counteracts the stomach acid’. Never any explanation how that might be. Chemistry by magic. OH! Now that one, I actually can help with. Obviously, it doesn’t “counteract” the stomach acid. But it can \*sometimes \*work out that drinking acidic stuff will help prevent or relieve acid indigestion/heartburn. It turns out that some people who feel that burning icky sensation in their throat/chest aren’t hyperacidic (too much acid in their stomach) but \*hypoacidic \*- called [hypochlorhydria](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achlorhydria). Without quite enough stomach acid, things don’t break down on schedule, the stomach gets overfull with half digested food and bacteria, and urps start coming up through the esophageal sphincter, or stomach contents sit on the stomach wall too long and cause inflammation - called hypoacidic gastritis. While not quite enough acid to digest food well, it’s enough acid to burn your innards. Fun times. So adding a little acid can help in those particular cases. MDs prescribe an acid called betaine hydrochloride to be taken at meals. I tend to reach for pickle juice myself, 'cause it’s cheap and non-prescription, but lemon juice will work, too. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/30 "2013-01-06T13:02:29Z")
Sine the OP has been debunked, how about this one. Earlier up this thread someone stated that no matter the pH level of what you eat, this does not change the body levels, OK, so why does my cat have to have a specialise diet to counter the formation of Struvite crystals in his bladder? I was told by the vet that by providing a prescription diet, the urine’s acidity is increased and this prevent the production of these irritant crystals. Seems to me that changing diet can change the pH levels in at least one part of the body, and since urine is extracted from blood it appears to me that some sort of change is going on. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/31 "2013-01-06T13:20:48Z")
> [@dmdrew](#): > > I found this on a site called ‘Young and Raw’ for vegans. I am interested to know if this is true or not, “Lemon is so cleansing for the body, it also happens to be very alkaline, bringing your body into a friendly and harmonious state. Drinking one cup of lemon juice for 90 days straight will heal any liver problems.” Probably a “me too” post but the big warning flag here is the claim lemon is “alkaline”. It’s not, it’s acidic. And if drinking one cup of lemon juice a day for 90 days will heal any liver problems was true we wouldn’t have people dying of cirrhosis and no need for liver transplants. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGrenze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dbc845/32.png) [@KarlGrenze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGrenze)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/32 "2013-01-06T15:32:38Z")
> [@casdave](#): > > Sine the OP has been debunked, how about this one. > > Earlier up this thread someone stated that no matter the pH level of what you eat, this does not change the body levels, > > OK, so why does my cat have to have a specialise diet to counter the formation of Struvite crystals in his bladder? I was told by the vet that by providing a prescription diet, the urine’s acidity is increased and this prevent the production of these irritant crystals. > > Seems to me that changing diet can change the pH levels in at least one part of the body, and since urine is extracted from blood it appears to me that some sort of change is going on. The blood pH amongst species varies less than the urine pH across species, with herbivores having more alkaline urine and carnivores more acidic urine (and it can be truly acidic, less than 7 pH). Yes, there is a change going on. It has been mentioned in this thread before that the blood is buffered and kept at a constant pH. Well, the kidneys are part of that system that keeps the blood in a tight stable state, and part of what they do is filter the blood, take all the electrolytes from it, and dump back to the blood the electrolytes and other molecules the blood needs. Anything in excess or not needed is excreted. Constantly. That is the job of the kidneys, 24/7 and until they fail or you die. Hopefully the later. So it doesn’t matter if you acidify your diet, your blood pH will be constant. What will change is the urine, which will become more acidic because all the excess acid you’re adding is being dumped outside. Now, this is when it is important in dogs, cats, or other animals with stones. The stones are aggregates of various mineral crystals. Those crystals only form in supersaturated solutions with the correct pH. Struvites do not form in less basic, more acidic environments. The crystals dissolve and they have no way of aggregating to form stones. That is the basis of the anti-crystals/anti-stones prescription diets for cats and dogs. Now, all this crystal formation and such occurs in the bladder, which is, in a way “outside” of the body. The bladder is basically the waste reservoir before being flushed outside. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/33 "2013-01-06T17:22:39Z")
Thanks for the answer ---
**Author:** ![VOW](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/vow/32/3043_2.png) [@VOW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VOW)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/34 "2013-01-06T18:09:08Z")
The very WORST “Lemon and Liver” story I’ve ever heard was a practice recommended on a naturopathic forum. At bedtime, take a double dose of Epsom salts, the juice of one lemon, and a half cup of olive oil. SUPPOSEDLY, in the morning you will pass a large number of round objects. According to the naturopath, those objects are gallstones. The purge is prescribed on a monthly basis, to keep your liver and gallbladder clear. In truth, the ingested ingredients form themselves into something extremely gross called “fecal soap balls.” Those round objects are simply encapsulated feces. ~VOW ---
**Author:** ![Seanette](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/seanette/32/9139_2.png) [@Seanette](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Seanette)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/35 "2013-01-06T18:31:14Z")
I would have thought ingesting Epsom salts would be possibly toxic. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/36 "2013-01-06T18:56:11Z")
> [@Seanette](#): > > I would have thought ingesting Epsom salts would be possibly toxic. It is a common OTC laxative, and has quite a few medicinal uses besides this – it’s just magnesium sulfate. I use it as a bath salt and it’s great on dormant roses . . . Of course I’m sure there is a dosage level which would kill you. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGrenze](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/dbc845/32.png) [@KarlGrenze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGrenze)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/37 "2013-01-06T19:01:43Z")
> [@casdave](#): > > Thanks for the answer You’re welcome. As an aside, here is a link with [more information about struvites and kitties.](http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&A=3306&S=2&SourceID=42) ---
**Author:** ![WhyNot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c77e96/32.png) [@WhyNot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WhyNot)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/38 "2013-01-06T19:19:25Z")
> [@Seanette](#): > > I would have thought ingesting Epsom salts would be possibly toxic. Nope. Not a good idea if you have a kidney condition (too much magnesium), but otherwise a time honored laxative. ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/39 "2013-01-06T20:53:37Z")
> [@VOW](#): > > In truth, the ingested ingredients form themselves into something extremely gross called “fecal soap balls.” Those round objects are simply encapsulated feces. What is so seriously wrong with me that I want to try that? ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2013, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170/40 "2013-01-06T21:19:30Z")
> [@VOW](#): > > The very WORST “Lemon and Liver” story I’ve ever heard was a practice recommended on a naturopathic forum. > > At bedtime, take a double dose of Epsom salts, the juice of one lemon, and a half cup of olive oil. > > SUPPOSEDLY, in the morning you will pass a large number of round objects. According to the naturopath, those objects are gallstones. The purge is prescribed on a monthly basis, to keep your liver and gallbladder clear. > > In truth, the ingested ingredients form themselves into something extremely gross called “fecal soap balls.” Those round objects are simply encapsulated feces. > ~VOW [Bezoars?](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bezoar) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lemons-and-livers/646170.md?page=3)