# Lesser of two evils: jail or psych-ward? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 11, 2008, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988 "2008-03-11T17:12:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Squarebubble1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Squarebubble1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squarebubble1)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/1 "2008-03-11T17:12:25Z")
My brother, essentially unemployable (don’t ask), is about to have his unemployment benefits expire. Since nobody, including myself, can afford to support him, and Welfare in this area is limited pretty much to single women/kids, he is contemplating either jail or the psychiatric ward for his 3-hots-and-a-cot. His arguments for each: In jail, you get free medical/dental/employment training; as long as you play crazy there, you’ll be put in isolation with a nice supply of sedatives to pass the day; and when you get out, no employer can legally deny you a job. (Of course the downside is both keeping up the act and having to stay as long as the sentence is.) In the psych ward, you only have to stay in until someone (presumably me) vouches to watch over them; as long as he can ride out the system, the State has to foot his basic needs; and, again, employers would be hard put to legally deny him a job. (He looks at this as the lesser of the two; myself, I really don’t like either alternative Comments? ---
**Author:** ![Squarebubble1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Squarebubble1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squarebubble1)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/2 "2008-03-11T17:12:51Z")
My brother, essentially unemployable (don’t ask), is about to have his unemployment benefits expire. Since nobody, including myself, can afford to support him, and Welfare in this area is limited pretty much to single women/kids, he is contemplating either jail or the psychiatric ward for his 3-hots-and-a-cot. His arguments for each: In jail, you get free medical/dental/employment training; as long as you play crazy there, you’ll be put in isolation with a nice supply of sedatives to pass the day; and when you get out, no employer can legally deny you a job. (Of course the downside is both keeping up the act and having to stay as long as the sentence is.) In the psych ward, you only have to stay in until someone (presumably me) vouches to watch over them; as long as he can ride out the system, the State has to foot his basic needs; and, again, employers would be hard put to legally deny him a job. (He looks at this as the lesser of the two; myself, I really don’t like either alternative). Comments? ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/3 "2008-03-11T17:34:07Z")
Glad to know our hard earned taxpayer money is being well spent on someone trying to ride the system. If he goes to jail: Are you saying he will willingly commit a crime to get himself there? It won’t involve harming anyone I hope. Psych ward: Do you think your brother is a good enough actor to get past the host of nurses, psychiatrists, councelors and therapists that work with people who have real issues daily? Good luck trying to convince the state you need to be locked up by trying to play schizo-affective or suicidal for long. Sounds like a freeloading junkie to me. Why not try to get him some help by staying on the side of the law that keeps him out of jail and a psych ward. Otherwise you’d be perpetuating a criminal. ---
**Author:** ![Missy2U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@Missy2U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Missy2U)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/4 "2008-03-11T17:45:45Z")
The whole thing won’t work. It’s idiotic. 1. Jail - what kind of “crime” is he going to do? If he hasn’t been in trouble before, they’ll probably I-Bond him once he’s arrested - and it could take forever for court, sentencing, etc. So he’s effectively on the street, and now with a record. Sounds like a plan. :rolleyes: 2. Psych ward - how in the world does he think he’s going to get in one? You can’t just knock on the door and say, “Hi, I’m nuts! Gotta bed?” Why would the state be responsible for him? Won’t work either. Can’t help it - gotta :rolleyes: again. ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/5 "2008-03-11T17:50:26Z")
Three hots and a cot? It barely qualifies as food and the cot will likely be a metal slab. It’s loud, degrading, dangerous and hell on Earth while you’re in. They intentionally make it so unpleasant you’ll never want to come back, you know? Why would anyone prefer _that_ to civilization and a paycheck? Why the notion he’s unemployable? ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/6 "2008-03-11T18:02:07Z")
Trust me. Prisons are not good places to be mentally. Nor are they good places to pretend to be mentally ill. QtM, dealing with mentally ill felons for nearly 6 years now. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/7 "2008-03-11T18:09:49Z")
To the OP, is your brother homeless? I bet \*\*QtM \*\* has seen homeless people wanting to stay in prison over the winters. I know we had a thread about it not too long ago. Either way you swing it, there muct be a better arrangement. ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/8 "2008-03-11T18:13:42Z")
[QUOTE=Squarebubble1] In jail, you get free medical/dental/employment training; as long as you play crazy there, you’ll be put in isolation with a nice supply of sedatives to pass the day; and when you get out, no employer can legally deny you a job. (Of course the downside is both keeping up the act and having to stay as long as the sentence is.) [/QUOTE] Where are you from? No employer can legally deny you a job for having a criminal record? ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/9 "2008-03-11T18:17:53Z")
[QUOTE=Squarebubble1] My brother, **essentially unemployable** … and when you get out, no employer can legally deny you a job. In the psych ward, .. again, employers would be hard put to legally deny him a job. [/QUOTE] umm…may I ask a silly question? If he is unemployable now, why will he be so easy to hire after being in jail/psych ward? If employers cannot legally deny you a job because of jail time, they can still deny you a job because you aren’t qualified for the job. And being a bum with no previous experience and no good references makes you unqualified for most jobs. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/10 "2008-03-11T18:25:20Z")
[QUOTE=Squarebubble1] and when you get out, no employer can legally deny you a job. [/QUOTE] :dubious: -FrL- ---
**Author:** ![Omegaman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/e480ec/32.png) [@Omegaman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omegaman)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/11 "2008-03-11T18:35:09Z")
Maybe he could get a job like the rest of us. If he is counting on somebody giving him a job when he gets out why couldn’t he get one now? ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/12 "2008-03-11T18:40:12Z")
Even if it is true that an employer can’t deny you a job because of jail time, they can still deny you a job because you’re unqualified . And your brother sounds very,very unqualified… ---
**Author:** ![ZebraShaSha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/eada6e/32.png) [@ZebraShaSha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZebraShaSha)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/13 "2008-03-11T18:47:11Z")
I think the lesser of all evils is to grow the fuck up. ---
**Author:** ![nd\_n8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/439d5e/32.png) [@nd\_n8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nd_n8)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/14 "2008-03-11T18:56:19Z")
Having recently sampled both I would say, hands down, take the psych-ward. The food’s better, the meds are better, fewer fights, the only drawback is keeping up the act that one is either depressed or addicted (in my case the depressed was not an act, on meds and feeling much better now). In jail playing the psycho card is a lot more difficult, access to med care (contrary to popular belief) is a lot more difficult, and the roommates are usually a lot more difficult. On day one of my 14 day sentence I requested a visit to the nurse to have her give me something for my gout (it started acting up in the tank while waiting to be dressed out) and on day 14 I was still limping around. They kept up with my psych meds though. Of course there is a much easier way to deal with this choice. Get a job, temp services are great at finding jobs for the “unemployable”. The Looney Bin and The Pokey should always be avoided at all costs. N8 ---
**Author:** ![Missy2U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@Missy2U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Missy2U)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/15 "2008-03-11T18:57:36Z")
[We’re doing this over here too.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=459346) ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/16 "2008-03-11T19:07:12Z")
I sent it to the mods to merge or close one. ---
**Author:** ![Gaudere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e495f1/32.png) [@Gaudere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gaudere)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/17 "2008-03-11T20:08:17Z")
[Moderator Hat ON] Merged threads with same title. [Moderator Hat OFF] ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/18 "2008-03-11T21:27:25Z")
I can’t speak for Psych Wards because I’ve never been there. But if that is what you and your brother think jail is like, you had better pray that you never end up there. Summary: 1. Free medical and dental: They will give you enough free medical and dental, so that you don’t die, or have enough evidence for a lawsuit. 2. Three hots (barely edible moldy nasty shit) and a cot (a metal slab with a paper thin mattress and blanket where it is kept climate controlled at 53 degrees year round for your comfort) 3. Sedatives because you act crazy. LOL. Try three or four guards dragging you down a deserted hallway and beating the hell out of you until you stop acting crazy. That will act as a natural sedative. 4. Employment training. Not in county jail if he gets a term of less than a year. If he wants to get a felony conviction and go to state prison, then good luck 5. No job discrimination for a criminal record. In la-la land… ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/19 "2008-03-11T21:35:43Z")
So wait a minute… Brother Dearest can apparently think rationally enough to make this kind of decision. But somehow he can’t work? Unless he’s a parapalegic narcoleptic with Tourette’s in the few hours he’s not jittery from his smack addiction, methinks something is up. You can get a job answering phones more or less on-demand for 10 bucks an hour. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Jolly\_Roger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/91b2a8/32.png) [@Jolly\_Roger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jolly_Roger)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988/20 "2008-03-11T22:24:25Z")
[QUOTE=Squarebubble1] My brother, essentially unemployable (don’t ask), is about to have his unemployment benefits expire. Since nobody, including myself, can afford to support him, and Welfare in this area is limited pretty much to single women/kids, he is contemplating either jail or the psychiatric ward for his 3-hots-and-a-cot. His arguments for each: In jail, you get free medical/dental/employment training; as long as you play crazy there, you’ll be put in isolation with a nice supply of sedatives to pass the day; and when you get out, no employer can legally deny you a job. (Of course the downside is both keeping up the act and having to stay as long as the sentence is.) In the psych ward, you only have to stay in until someone (presumably me) vouches to watch over them; as long as he can ride out the system, the State has to foot his basic needs; and, again, employers would be hard put to legally deny him a job. (He looks at this as the lesser of the two; myself, I really don’t like either alternative Comments? [/QUOTE] How old is this guy? If he feels he has no skills to get a job with, and is willing to go to fucking prison, why doesn’t he enlist? Pick a job with a long training period. If he doesn’t feel he can hack it after training, act like a nutball then. They’ll give him a general discharge for failing to adapt. Its not easy, but its easier than getting out of jail if he doesn’t like it. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lesser-of-two-evils-jail-or-psych-ward/440988.md?page=2)