# Let me be real clear: this message board does NOT need conservatives **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 28, 2021, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474 "2021-07-28T02:12:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 112
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2228 "2021-09-08T14:52:14Z")
I used to think Joe Rogan was cool, but then I realized that a guy who uncritically accepts deranged ramblings about pre-ice-age advanced societies destroyed by mass extinction events of which there is no evidence whatsoever probably can’t be trusted about their other opinions, either. The rest of the IDW movement is just as vacuous. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2229 "2021-09-08T15:14:02Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > For instance, I’ll take a bet that “illiberal” has been the word of the month on all those sites. Never seen that, at least on Fox News which provides a sometimes useful if dizzying dose of alternate reality. On a related matter, “Librul” (spelling and pronunciation) is a construct of an annoying subset of liberals. It should stop. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2230 "2021-09-08T15:19:29Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > Never seen that, at least on Fox News which provides a sometimes useful if dizzying dose of alternate reality. The IDW crowd is full of people who aren’t any more intelligent or educated than the Fox News crowd, but who are very self-congratulatory about how much smarter than everyone else they are and how “bOtH sIdEs” are full of morons who aren’t worthy to lick their boots. They’re the kind who calls themselves “classical liberals” while ranting about “cAnCeL cUlTuRe” (from the comfort of their huge and decidedly non-cancelled platforms) and “illiberalism”. To the Fox News crowd, a Liberal is a horrible monster that wants to take your guns and force your daughter to marry a black guy. To the IDW crowd, “Liberal” is not a negative term, but they paint anyone who is actually Liberal as a crazed SJW hippy, while claiming that their own regressive and reactionary policies are REAL Liberalism. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2231 "2021-09-08T16:13:25Z")
IT’s come across my radar a lot lately. Stuff like this [Economist article](https://www.economist.com/leaders/2021/09/04/the-threat-from-the-illiberal-left), but also our local idiots like **DemonTree**. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2232 "2021-09-08T16:52:04Z")
AIUI the name was a joke, but I’m not convinced it’s really a movement anyway. I’ve been reading Scott Alexander, Freddie de Boer, Lee Jussim and many others, and it’s really made me think and look at things differently. It’s just like when I was younger and read Dawkins etc and became an atheist. But then I come back here and most people are just repeating the same old slogans and arguments that I could easily make myself, and going on about Fox news, and frequently proving the ‘IDW’ types correct with their behaviour. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2233 "2021-09-08T16:58:37Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > I used to think Joe Rogan was cool, but then I realized that a guy who uncritically accepts deranged ramblings about pre-ice-age advanced societies destroyed by mass extinction events of which there is no evidence whatsoever probably can’t be trusted about their other opinions, either. Certainly [his idiotic recent (and previous) remarks](https://deadline.com/2021/09/joe-rogan-covid-test-dave-chappelle-tour-vaccinations-1234825866/) minimizing the dangers of COVID and misrepresenting the appropriate prevention and treatment measures for it, along with his refusal to state whether he himself got the vaccine, don’t inspire confidence about the general trustworthiness of his opinions. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2234 "2021-09-08T17:02:32Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > But then I come back here and most people are just repeating the same old slogans and arguments that I could easily make myself, and going on about Fox news, and frequently proving the ‘IDW’ types correct with their behaviour. I didn’t dismiss Joe Rogan and his guests offhand. I gave them (many, many) chances. But the simple fact is, anyone who takes Graham Hancock or Peter Deusberg seriously is a fool or a grifter. The entire IDW moment consists of people with stupid ideas and no evidence to back them up (there was an advanced civilization 12,000 years ago and they’re responsible for all the megastructures! AIDS is not caused by HIV but by the “gay lifestyle”!); when their claims are rejected by the scientific community (because of that pesky “no evidence” thing) they go on Joe Rogan’s show to bitch and moan about cancel culture. It’s absolutely ridiculous that anyone takes these people seriously. It’s also not very surprising that their audience is overwhelmingly young white guys who don’t like not being the center of the universe anymore, or how many of these claims have pretty dark undertones (of course this ancient civilization was light-skinned and led to European/Western civilization! Of course AIDS isn’t a real issue if it’s just caused by teh gayz and their “lifestyle”!) ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2235 "2021-09-08T17:03:44Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Certainly [his idiotic recent (and previous) remarks](https://deadline.com/2021/09/joe-rogan-covid-test-dave-chappelle-tour-vaccinations-1234825866/) minimizing the dangers of COVID and misrepresenting the appropriate prevention and treatment measures for it, along with his refusal to state whether he himself got the vaccine, don’t inspire confidence about the general trustworthiness of his opinions. Definitely - I rolled my eyes at the Graham Hancock episodes, and quit after the Duesberg - but if I hadn’t then COVID denial would have been the last straw. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2236 "2021-09-08T17:39:47Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > there was an advanced civilization 12,000 years ago and they’re responsible for all the megastructures! AIDS is not caused by HIV but by the “gay lifestyle”! Never heard anything even remotely like these. It’s more like ‘standardised testing works and here’s the scientific evidence’, and the other side is claiming ‘it’s all due to test prep’ or ‘it just reflects SES’ with no evidence whatsoever. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2237 "2021-09-08T17:50:44Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > there was an advanced civilization 12,000 years ago and they’re responsible for all the megastructures! AIDS is not caused by HIV but by the “gay lifestyle”! > > Never heard anything even remotely like these Ice Age Lunacy (one of many videos, Graham Hancock is a frequent guest of Joe Rogan) [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/Rxmw9eizOAo/hqdefault.jpg "Joe Rogan Experience #1284 - Graham Hancock") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rxmw9eizOAo) The Peter Deusberg episode was removed from YouTube at some point (I originally watched it there) but it IS on Spotify. It’s a pretty cringey episode because Rogan brought someone on to debate Deusberg, but the guy he brought in is just some random dude, not an expert on medicine or AIDS or anything. > **[\#282 - Peter Duesberg, Bryan Callen](https://open.spotify.com/episode/09V4RttjR7mpqwgy2Ie9yT)** > > Listen to this episode from The Joe Rogan Experience on Spotify. Joe sits down with Peter Duesberg and Bryan Callen. > [@DemonTree](#): > > It’s more like ‘standardised testing works and here’s the scientific evidence’, Yes, they also make those kinds of claims. Unfortunately they apply they same level of evidence-based critical thinking to the question of standardized testing as they do to the question of whether the Sphinx was built by an ancient global civilization, which is why I stopped taking them seriously years ago. > [@DemonTree](#): > > and the other side is claiming ‘it’s all due to test prep’ or ‘it just reflects SES’ with no evidence whatsoever. 🤣 that’s cute. Jordan “Psychedelics let me understand the meaning of the universe” Peterson isn’t who I’d usually point to if I wanted to make the point that evidence-based arguments are important but YMMV. Right of the bat, saying that “standardized testing works!” is completely non-sensical. If you want to say “standardized testing accurately measures X” then you are welcome to to so and make an evidence based argument that it is so. And I’m not sure where you get the idea that people who oppose standardized testing due so with no evidence. In fact, evidence about the shortcomings of standardized testing is precisely why many are moving to lower the emphasis placed on such tests. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2238 "2021-09-08T18:04:24Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > And I’m not sure where you get the idea that people who oppose standardized testing due so with no evidence Actually I have a pretty good guess - that’s a claim that people like Joe Rogan and Jordan Peterson make all the time. And they present about as much evidence for this claim about the behavior of “the left” as they do for the age of the Sphinx or the root cause of AIDS. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2239 "2021-09-08T18:05:15Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Unfortunately they apply they same level of evidence-based critical thinking to the question of standardized testing as they do to the question of whether the Sphinx was built by an ancient global civilization, which is why I stopped taking them seriously years ago. And, in the case of Weinstein and Heying as well as Rogan, [claiming that taking ivermectin is a better anti-COVID prophylaxis than the vaccine](https://www.vice.com/en/article/wx5z5y/why-is-the-intellectual-dark-web-suddenly-hyping-an-unproven-covid-treatment). (And unlike Rogan, the other two are outright claiming not to have been vaccinated because of “fears” and false allegations about the vaccine’s safety. Although apparently they have no such fears about self-dosing with an unapproved, non-recommended drug whose benefits are very uncertain and whose side effects can be very harmful.) ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2240 "2021-09-08T19:10:30Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Jordan “Psychedelics let me understand the meaning of the universe” Peterson isn’t who I’d usually point to if I wanted to make the point that evidence-based arguments are important but YMMV. I’m _not_ pointing to him. Never seen any of his stuff. > [@Babale](#): > > And I’m not sure where you get the idea that people who oppose standardized testing due so with no evidence. In fact, evidence about the shortcomings of standardized testing is precisely why many are moving to lower the emphasis placed on such tests. Because their reasons are generally that they dislike the _results_ of such testing. Either for racial equity reasons, or what it shows about the state of education, or just that it doesn’t fit their worldview of everyone being equal. And in some cases, I suspect because it’s much harder to improve your kid’s score on the SAT than to help them get good grades and great extra curriculars and an amazing admissions essay so they can go to a top university. And I rarely see anyone on that side present any evidence. _You_ said this in a previous thread: > Also, admissions are based on performance on a test by middle schoolers. Sorry, but that has WAY more to do with your parents and how able and willing they are to invest time and money in tutoring you for this test than any kind of objective measure of ability or intelligence. and gave no evidence for this implausible claim. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2241 "2021-09-08T19:57:27Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > Jordan “Psychedelics let me understand the meaning of the universe” Peterson isn’t who I’d usually point to if I wanted to make the point that evidence-based arguments are important but YMMV. > > I’m _not_ pointing to him. Never seen any of his stuff. He’s like the poster child of the Intellectual Dark Web. It’s like if someone claims to have read a lot about Communism recently but then gets confused when someone mentions Marx. > [@DemonTree](#): > > Because their reasons are generally that they dislike the _results_ of such testing Yes, that’s exaclty what the Joe Rogans and the Jordan Petersons will tell you the other side’s argument is. It isn’t TRUE but I’m not surprised you’re parroting it back. > [@DemonTree](#): > > And in some cases, I suspect because it’s much harder to improve your kid’s score on the SAT than to help them get good grades and great extra curriculars and an amazing admissions essay so they can go to a top university. That’s a funny joke right? It is not difficult to get a good SAT score using prep classes - certainly not more difficult than enrolling your child in a rigorous course of extracurricular activities or ensuring they get good grades. > [@DemonTree](#): > > And I rarely see anyone on that side present any evidence. _You_ said this in a previous thread: > > > Also, admissions are based on performance on a test by middle schoolers. Sorry, but that has WAY more to do with your parents and how able and willing they are to invest time and money in tutoring you for this test than any kind of objective measure of ability or intelligence. > > and gave no evidence for this implausible claim. Here, a link to a study that shows that SAT or ACT scores have fuck-all to do with performance in higher education while GPA does - or in other words, “how well you do in school” is a better predictor for “how well you will do in college” than “how well you did on this random test” is: > **[PACE - Predicting College Success](https://edpolicyinca.org/publications/predicting-college-success-how-do-different-high-school-assessments-measure-2019)** > > The Smarter Balanced Assessment (SBAC), implemented in California in 2014–15 as part of the California Assessment of Student Performance and Progress, is designed to evaluate students’ levels of college and career readiness. Student scores on the... By the way, you’ve never actually TAKEN the SAT or ACT, have you? ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2242 "2021-09-08T19:57:40Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > ….or just that it doesn’t fit their worldview of everyone being equal. You are an odious gaslighting piece of shit ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2243 "2021-09-08T21:02:30Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > I’m _not_ pointing to him. Never seen any of his stuff. 🤨 Did you mean a _different_ Intellectual Dark Web from the one we know and loathe? ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2244 "2021-09-08T21:06:18Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > He’s like the poster child of the Intellectual Dark Web. It’s like if someone claims to have read a lot about Communism recently but then gets confused when someone mentions Marx. I’m not claiming anything. That just seemed the best description of the things I have been reading. If you don’t think it fits then you are free to disregard it. 🤷‍♀️ > [@Babale](#): > > Here, a link to a study that shows that SAT or ACT scores have fuck-all to do with performance in higher education while GPA does - or in other words, “how well you do in school” is a better predictor for “how well you will do in college” than “how well you did on this random test” is: Did you bother to look at your own link? The very first point of the summary: - The Smarter Balanced Assessment does **as well as the SAT** in predicting college outcomes, specifically first-year college GPA and second-year persistence rates for students enrolled in CSU and UC. From the report, HSGPA correlation with first year college GPA is .45, SAT .37, combined .48. It shows that GPA is a better predictor, but the idea that SAT scores have fuck all to do with performance in higher education is nonsense. And furthermore, that’s not even what I asked for evidence of. You claimed performance on standardised tests has “WAY more to do with your parents and how able and willing they are to invest time and money in tutoring you for this test than any kind of objective measure of ability or intelligence.” That is what I want evidence for. Instead you just repeat it: > [@Babale](#): > > That’s a funny joke right? It is not difficult to get a good SAT score using prep classes - certainly not more difficult than enrolling your child in a rigorous course of extracurricular activities or ensuring they get good grades. If it’s not difficult then why do Ivy League universities have legacy admissions? Those parents should be able to buy their kids good enough scores. And if it’s so easy to get any kid a great SAT score, why has no one done it to help poor and/or minority students get in to higher education? As I said, this claim is implausible on its face. > [@Babale](#): > > By the way, you’ve never actually TAKEN the SAT or ACT, have you? Nope. Have you? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2245 "2021-09-08T21:18:19Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > If it’s not difficult then why do Ivy League universities have legacy admissions? Those parents should be able to buy their kids good enough scores Because they’re elitist institutions trying desperately to get the alumni parents’ donations? > [@DemonTree](#): > > Did you bother to look at your own link? The very first point of the summary: > > - The Smarter Balanced Assessment does **as well as the SAT** in predicting college outcomes, specifically first-year college GPA and second-year persistence rates for students enrolled in CSU and UC. > > From the report, HSGPA correlation with first year college GPA is .45, SAT .37, combined .48. It shows that GPA is a better predictor, but the idea that SAT scores have fuck all to do with performance in higher education is nonsense. I did, as I said in my post, > [@Babale](#): > > in other words, “how well you do in school” is a better predictor for “how well you will do in college” than “how well you did on this random test” is: ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2246 "2021-09-08T21:26:23Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > And if it’s so easy to get any kid a great SAT score, why has no one done it to help poor and/or minority students get in to higher education? It isn’t super helpful because just getting a kid to have a higher SAT score won’t do much for that kid, since SAT scores don’t measure anything valuable and you aren’t making the kid any more prepared for college by doing so; and you certainly aren’t addressing the deep impacts that growing up in poverty had on a kid’s ability to do well at school; but I don’t know where you got the idea that “no one” has done this. In the actual real world, lots of groups have done exactly that, like this one: > **[The Test-Prep Program That Helps Low-Income Students Get to College](https://nationswell.com/collegespring-test-prep/)** > > CollegeSpring’s innovative curriculum has helped thousands of disadvantaged kids turn a far-fetched fantasy into reality. > [@](#): > > “The SAT isn’t a test that’s trying to trick or trap you. It’s an opportunity to demonstrate what you know how to do,” says Julie Bachur Gopalan, CollegeSpring’s senior vice president of strategy and impact. “You can put up a number that you can improve pretty quickly over a short period of time. You can’t do that with a GPA by the time you get to junior year.” So, yeah, according to Gopalan, the SAT isn’t measuring anything inherent - in fact by prepping for it you can easily raise your score quickly, which you cannot do with for example GPA. The link also talks about for-profit prep centers, which we all know about. Or the kids who get one on one tutoring at up to $200 per hour. > **[How Much Do SAT Prep Courses Cost?](https://blog.prepscholar.com/how-much-do-sat-prep-courses-cost)** > > Questions about the average cost of SAT prep courses? Check out our complete guide to learn what to expect. > [@DemonTree](#): > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > By the way, you’ve never actually TAKEN the SAT or ACT, have you? > > Nope. Have you? I live in America and I went to college, so yes, of course. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2021, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474/2247 "2021-09-08T21:46:17Z")
> [@DemonTree](#): > > because it’s much harder to improve your kid’s score on the SAT than to help them get good grades and great extra curriculars You know there is an enormous industry based on the idea that you can quickly raise SAT scores, right? Or maybe you don’t, since you don’t live in the US. But there are several centers in my town that claim to do exactly that (for pay, of course) and there’s a lot of evidence that practicing on SAT-like questions (even better if paired with some guidance and support) consistently raises SAT scores. > [@DemonTree](#): > > If it’s not difficult then why do Ivy League universities have legacy admissions? Those parents should be able to buy their kids good enough scores. And if it’s so easy to get any kid a great SAT score, why has no one done it to help poor and/or minority students get in to higher education? What Babale said. But also, Ivy league universities get many more completely qualified applicants than they can accept. Harvard could fill its entire freshman class with nothing but valedictorians, or with nothing but top SAT-score earners if they wanted to. They want to have a more diverse class than that (including kids who excel at sports, the arts, a particular subject, etc.) so they mostly just check to see if scores are “good enough” and look at other things. Including whether the kid’s parents went there, because yeah, alumni give more money if they feel the college cares about their connection to it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474.md?page=111) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-me-be-real-clear-this-message-board-does-not-need-conservatives/947474.md?page=113)