# Let Theists agree before they have the nerve to criticize atheists! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 12, 2007, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785 "2007-05-12T00:55:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/361 "2007-05-18T00:44:32Z")
[QUOTE=cosmosdan] And {in case you didn’t notice} with anyone who has _any_ experience that influences their world view and affects their future actions. That is to say, most people on the planet. Go figure! [/QUOTE] People filter what they allow to influence their world view and actions all the time. You choose not to filter what can’t be objectively proven. We are no doubt all somewhere on a scale that goes from “away with the fairies” to “Mr Spock”. I’m pretty comfortable with being as far away from the “away with the fairies” end of the scale as possible. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/362 "2007-05-18T01:01:04Z")
[QUOTE=Czarcasm] Do you mean experiences that have an objective reality, such as speeches, acts of kindness by others and the like? Or do you mean experiences that pertain to you and you alone, like voices in your head and feelings from out of nowhere? [/QUOTE] I mean experiences with an objective reality and experiences that are purely subjective, since that is what makes up the life of, {guess who?}most people on the planet. I’ll just wait patiently for the next snide remark. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/363 "2007-05-18T01:03:17Z")
I’ve met some really interesting “Away with the Faeries” cats. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/364 "2007-05-18T01:11:04Z")
[QUOTE=Princhester] People filter what they allow to influence their world view and actions all the time. You choose not to filter what can’t be objectively proven. We are no doubt all somewhere on a scale that goes from “away with the fairies” to “Mr Spock”. I’m pretty comfortable with being as far away from the “away with the fairies” end of the scale as possible. [/QUOTE] That’s completely your choice and I respect your right to make it. The funny thing is, it’s very tricky to measure the worth a person and their contribution to society just from where they are on that scale, ain’t it? I’m wondering what you mean by “You choose not to filter what can’t be objectively proven” Do you mean, I {as in you} choose? Do you mean we, as in most people? or do you actually mean you, as in “me , cosmosdan”? I’m not sure it matters much since _everyone_ processes and makes a value judgment on things that can’t be objectively proven. It goes with being a living human who interacts with others. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/365 "2007-05-18T01:40:10Z")
[QUOTE=cosmosdan] That’s completely your choice and I respect your right to make it. The funny thing is, it’s very tricky to measure the worth a person and their contribution to society just from where they are on that scale, ain’t it? [/quote] The thing is, what is the point in someone like you participating in this OP? This OP is about theists criticising the position of atheists and no doubt vice versa. In your worldview, there’s no room for that, it’s all cool, so what are you doing here? > [@](#): > > I’m wondering what you mean by “You choose not to filter what can’t be objectively proven” Do you mean, I {as in you} choose? Do you mean we, as in most people? or do you actually mean you, as in “me , cosmosdan”? You, **cosmodan**. Isn’t that what you’ve been saying for the last few pages? ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/366 "2007-05-18T03:32:27Z")
[QUOTE=Princhester] The thing is, what is the point in someone like you participating in this OP? This OP is about theists criticising the position of atheists and no doubt vice versa. In your worldview, there’s no room for that, it’s all cool, so what are you doing here? [/QUOTE] Well I came in on page 7 to respond to one particular post and then responded to you. BTW I didn’t say there’s no room for criticism. There are positions on both sides that deserve it. > [@](#): > > You, **cosmodan**. Isn’t that what you’ve been saying for the last few pages? I don’t think so, but I’m not sure I get your meaning. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/367 "2007-05-18T04:29:19Z")
**cosmodan** , the basic subject of this thread is whether or not a god or gods exist. Your position as I understand it is that it should be an individual matter based upon ones own experiences up to and including the voices in one’s head. So that’s the end of the debate for you isn’t it? Whatever anyone says is their personal experience leading to their personal decision about theism/atheism is valid for you, so what more can anyone say to you on the topic? As to the other thing, as I understand it you accept a god on the basis of your experience of voices you hear in your head, and you don’t discount that experience just because what it suggests to you can’t be objectively proven. Isn’t that what you’ve been saying? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/368 "2007-05-18T04:37:37Z")
Maybe you can alleviate my concerns just a bit, **cosmodan**. I assume that, over the years, you have developed a nice set of morals and ethics. If the voice you identify as “God” told you to do or say something that was contrary to the ethics/morals you already have, would you: A. Realign those ethics/morals to be in line with God, because if he does it, it must be moral and right, or B. Doubt that it was God in the first place? ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/369 "2007-05-18T05:20:42Z")
Still waiting on\*\* ITR Champion’s \*\* response to the cites I found. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/370 "2007-05-18T05:38:46Z")
[QUOTE=Revenant Threshold] Still waiting on\*\* ITR Champion’s \*\* response to the cites I found. [/QUOTE] I’m also wondering what **ITR Champion** ’s response to Pochacco’s post #357 might be. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/371 "2007-05-18T11:38:14Z")
[QUOTE=Princhester] **cosmodan** , the basic subject of this thread is whether or not a god or gods exist. [/QUOTE] Actually, the basic subject of this thread is whether or not theists have a right to criticize atheists when they don’t agree with each other 100%. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 11:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/372 "2007-05-18T11:40:23Z")
[QUOTE=Lord Ashtar] Actually, the basic subject of this thread is whether or not theists have a right to criticize atheists when they don’t agree with each other 100%. [/QUOTE] Or 90%. Or 70%. Anyone for 50%? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/373 "2007-05-18T11:51:30Z")
If theists were attempting to present a united argument against atheism, such agreement would be requisite. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Ashtar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ea924/32.png) [@Lord\_Ashtar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Ashtar)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/374 "2007-05-18T11:56:09Z")
[QUOTE=Czarcasm] Or 90%. Or 70%. Anyone for 50%? [/QUOTE] Thanks for clarifying that you don’t think theists are in agreement with each other. Based on your earlier posts to this thread, I was unsure of your position. ---
**Author:** ![Quiddity\_Glomfuster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/c4cdca/32.png) [@Quiddity\_Glomfuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quiddity_Glomfuster)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/375 "2007-05-18T12:18:51Z")
[QUOTE=Lord Ashtar] Actually, the basic subject of this thread is whether or not theists have a right to criticize atheists when they don’t agree with each other 100%. [/QUOTE] Which, in itself, is ludicrous. It doesn’t require refutation because it is without merit as an argument. ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 12:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/376 "2007-05-18T12:35:10Z")
Handy, since that seems to be the view taken by everyone except **Valteron** himself. But all arguments require refutation, sadly. ---
**Author:** ![Quiddity\_Glomfuster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/c4cdca/32.png) [@Quiddity\_Glomfuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quiddity_Glomfuster)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/377 "2007-05-18T12:44:13Z")
[QUOTE=Revenant Threshold] Handy, since that seems to be the view taken by everyone except **Valteron** himself. But all arguments require refutation, sadly. [/QUOTE] Um. No they don’t. They can be as easily ignored and left to wither away in ignominy. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/378 "2007-05-18T13:24:44Z")
[QUOTE=Quiddity Glomfuster] Which, in itself, is ludicrous. It doesn’t require refutation because it is without merit as an argument. [/QUOTE] So what _was_ your purpose for posting 19 times in this thread? ---
**Author:** ![Quiddity\_Glomfuster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/c4cdca/32.png) [@Quiddity\_Glomfuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quiddity_Glomfuster)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/379 "2007-05-18T13:32:47Z")
[QUOTE=Czarcasm] So what _was_ your purpose for posting 19 times in this thread? [/QUOTE] I was involved in one of the side discussions. In response to you, initially. ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2007, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785/380 "2007-05-18T13:35:56Z")
[QUOTE=Quiddity Glomfuster] Um. No they don’t. They can be as easily ignored and left to wither away in ignominy. [/QUOTE] Sure they can. But who gets to decide what has merit? A system of just dismissing arguments out of hand will inevitably mean some good arguments fall through the cracks. While it would be nice to be able to ignore every crackpot theory out there, we can’t do so and claim that they are conclusively untrue. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-theists-agree-before-they-have-the-nerve-to-criticize-atheists/403785.md?page=20)