# Let your boy be a girl for Halloween? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 7, 2004, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957 "2004-10-07T01:23:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 11:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/21 "2004-10-07T11:02:23Z")
FWIW, I have three sons – now aged 18 to 26. If they had wanted to dress up as a girl at any age, I’d have had no problem with that. I can’t remember whether any of them actually have, though it’s quite possible: some of them spent many years in amateur drama groups, and all sorts of things are possible there. I also have a daughter, who also has spent a lot of time in amateur drama, including a lot of Shakespeare. I remember one very amusing act at a festival that shewas is – she wasn’t one of the actors is this – with a teenage girl and boy playing Beatrice and Benedick from Much Ado. The funny bit was that the girl played Benedick and the boy playted Beatrice. I don’t think the experience would have caused them lasting psychic damage. ---
**Author:** ![Iceland\_Blue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/4bbf92/32.png) [@Iceland\_Blue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iceland_Blue)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/22 "2004-10-07T11:45:27Z")
I think most people would realize an 18-yr-old out carousing the streets dressed as a cheerleader/Snow White/a nun is just dressing up like that for the occasion. The number of oddly-dressed people who gather round the harbor on Friday night is amazing. I don’t think anyone seriously believes they wear that kind of stuff regularly. Well they may do.Thats up to them 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/23 "2004-10-07T12:01:01Z")
Eh, I don’t think it’d be a problem. He’s three years old, and it’s only for Halloween. An older boy might even get away with something like that by going about it with humor. For example, if he dressed up as a girl and acted as if it were to get laughs. As a child, I had a HUGE box of old clothes for playing “dress up”, and when we had family get togethers at my house, my male cousins would put on dresses and hats and parade around and act goofy. Personally, I believe telling the kid he can’t do it just makes it more of a problem. The more fuss you make, the worse it gets. ---
**Author:** ![norinew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb9ed0/32.png) [@norinew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/norinew)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/24 "2004-10-07T12:03:43Z")
Well, having no sons (and since I’m done making babies, I’m not likely to _ever_ have a son), I can only speak hypothetically. I wouldn’t have a problem with a little boy dressed up as Dora. Conversely, if my four-year-old daughter wanted to dress as Bob the Builder, I wouldn’t mind that, either. At that age, it just doesn’t matter. ---
**Author:** ![tanookie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/48db29/32.png) [@tanookie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tanookie)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 1:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/25 "2004-10-07T13:24:39Z")
> [@Zette](#): > > Not to be all PC, but why would anyone have a problem with this? There are plenty of female firefighters IRL, so dressing up as one has little to do with gender roles, IMHO. There are a lot of female firefighters. But this particular costume was under a very large sign marked “BOYS COSTUMES” and the tags even say boy’s costume on them. I don’t have a problem with this but I did get some quizzical looks when I told the grandparents. ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/26 "2004-10-07T13:35:10Z")
Your answer really shocked me, but at least you admit you have a double standard. Of course a kid should be anyone he wants to be for Halloween. And especially (as others have said) a three-year-old! He’s just a baby. Exactly what horrible thing is expected to come of this? ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/27 "2004-10-07T13:36:51Z")
> [@SolGrundy](#): > > To be completely honest, I have to admit that I would have a problem with it. Even though at three years old, it doesn’t make a bit of difference for the child’s development, I would have a problem with it. My rational mind can say “outdated gender roles,” and “focus on achievement, not sex” and all that, but deep down I’d think that a boy that age should dress up as a boy, even on Halloween. When he gets into his teens and wants to go around in drag, either as a joke or not, then more power to him. > > And yeah, there’s a double standard, too, because I’d be fine with my (hypothetical) daughter’s dressing up as a male character. Uh, sorry, the first part of that was addressed to SolGrundy. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 2:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/28 "2004-10-07T14:48:01Z")
I also think it would cause more problems than it would solve, since the boy is _frickin 3 years old_. If it’s the type of costume with a mask, it would drop the chance of harassment to around 0% since you usually cant even tell the gender of children that age without seeing the face. If it were an older child, however, I would still let them do that, but if they did not understand that there was a chance that people would make fun of him for it, I would bring that topic up somehow. If he still wanted to do it, I’d let him. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/29 "2004-10-07T15:00:32Z")
> [@SolGrundy](#): > > To be completely honest, I have to admit that I would have a problem with it. Even though at three years old, it doesn’t make a bit of difference for the child’s development, I would have a problem with it. My rational mind can say “outdated gender roles,” and “focus on achievement, not sex” and all that, but deep down I’d think that a boy that age should dress up as a boy, even on Halloween. When he gets into his teens and wants to go around in drag, either as a joke or not, then more power to him. > > And yeah, there’s a double standard, too, because I’d be fine with my (hypothetical) daughter’s dressing up as a male character. Same take as SolGruindy on the issue. ---
**Author:** ![Indygrrl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@Indygrrl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indygrrl)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/30 "2004-10-07T15:13:11Z")
I think it’s fine if he wants to be Dora, I really don’t think it will have any future ramifications. But make sure to take lots of pictures so you can show them to his girlfriends when he gets older. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![SolGrundy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbce88/32.png) [@SolGrundy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SolGrundy)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/31 "2004-10-07T21:35:01Z")
> [@Dung Beetle](#): > > Your answer really shocked me, but at least you admit you have a double standard. > Of course a kid should be anyone he wants to be for Halloween. And especially (as others have said) a three-year-old! He’s just a baby. Exactly what horrible thing is expected to come of this? I don’t know why it’s “shocking,” and I don’t think anything horrible would come of it. At three years old, the kid probably doesn’t even yet make the connection that Dora is a female character. So this case in particular, it’s no big deal at all. But I’d still encourage the boy to go as a character _like_ Dora, but not _as_ Dora. Why? For the same reason I’d dress my male baby in blue PJ’s and my female baby in pink. It’s just the idea of the thing – there’s a structure in gender roles that exists, and it exists for a reason, and it’s not necessarily a bad thing. This isn’t the same thing as my being some big hairy guy in a wife-beater shirt and one hand down his pants freaking out if he sees his son playing with a doll, snatching it away from him and shoving a dump truck in his hands instead. It’s more like what they say about abstract art – you don’t start out your first painting doing cubism; you begin with the traditional stuff and then start to find your voice. There’s nothing wrong with taking a child that young and saying, “this is what boys are like, and this is what girls are like,” and then letting the child as he grows figure out how much of that he wants to accept or reject. I don’t think the goal is a completely genderless society; it’s a society that’s open enough that we’re not _bound_ by gender but instead just get structure from it. There’s nothing wrong with telling males to be masculine and females to be feminine, as long as you acknowledge that they might have their own take on what it means to “be a man” or “be a woman.” At 3 years old, the child doesn’t have a clear take on that yet. ---
**Author:** ![norinew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb9ed0/32.png) [@norinew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/norinew)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/32 "2004-10-07T22:00:04Z")
> [@SolGrundy](#): > > I don’t know why it’s “shocking,” and I don’t think anything horrible would come of it. At three years old, the kid probably doesn’t even yet make the connection that Dora is a female character. So this case in particular, it’s no big deal at all. But I’d still encourage the boy to go as a character _like_ Dora, but not _as_ Dora. Why? For the same reason I’d dress my male baby in blue PJ’s and my female baby in pink. > > It’s just the idea of the thing – there’s a structure in gender roles that exists, and it exists for a reason, and it’s not necessarily a bad thing. This isn’t the same thing as my being some big hairy guy in a wife-beater shirt and one hand down his pants freaking out if he sees his son playing with a doll, snatching it away from him and shoving a dump truck in his hands instead. It’s more like what they say about abstract art – you don’t start out your first painting doing cubism; you begin with the traditional stuff and then start to find your voice. There’s nothing wrong with taking a child that young and saying, “this is what boys are like, and this is what girls are like,” and then letting the child as he grows figure out how much of that he wants to accept or reject. > > I don’t think the goal is a completely genderless society; it’s a society that’s open enough that we’re not _bound_ by gender but instead just get structure from it. There’s nothing wrong with telling males to be masculine and females to be feminine, as long as you acknowledge that they might have their own take on what it means to “be a man” or “be a woman.” At 3 years old, the child doesn’t have a clear take on that yet. All this talk in defense of your answer is fine, _except_ that you also said: > [@](#): > > And yeah, there’s a double standard, too, because I’d be fine with my (hypothetical) daughter’s dressing up as a male character. I don’t know about \*\*Dung Beetle [/quote] , but this is that part that I personally found shocking. ---
**Author:** ![kelly5078](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/6f9a4e/32.png) [@kelly5078](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kelly5078)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/33 "2004-10-07T22:01:16Z")
I went as a woman when I was 8 or 9. Red lipstick, high heels, the works. It doesn’t seem to have had any lasting damage. ---
**Author:** ![norinew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/eb9ed0/32.png) [@norinew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/norinew)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/34 "2004-10-07T22:01:49Z")
Don’tcha hate when you screw up the coding, preview, and post anyway? :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![SolGrundy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbce88/32.png) [@SolGrundy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SolGrundy)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/35 "2004-10-07T23:14:20Z")
> [@norinew](#): > > All this talk in defense of your answer is fine, _except_ that you also said: > [how there’s a double standard for girls wanting to dress as boys] > I don’t know about **Dung Beetle** , but this is that part that I personally found shocking. That’s because gender roles are in the process of evolving, in particular for women in the west. The prevailing message for women is “you can be whatever you want,” while the prevailing message for men is “be a man.” That’s why the character of “Dora the Explorer” exists in the first place, while you don’t see characters like “Stanley the Nurse.” Believe me, that’s _not_ an attempt on my part to diminish anyone’s job (for the record: I’ve _dated_ male nurses, and I know that there’s nothing inherently “feminine” or, for that matter, “masculine” about the job). I’m just pointing out that the change is a gradual process, and we’re in the middle of it. And because of that, there’s currently a double standard. Women wearing slacks: cool, even the norm. Men wearing skirts: still “weird.” It may not be fair, but it’s the way things are for now. And just as people say that nothing horrible will happen by letting the boy go as a girl, I say nothing horrible will happen by encouraging him not to until he’s old enough to realize how boys and girls are different and decide for himself how many of society’s conventions he wants to rail against. I dunno, maybe by the time I have children and this is more than just an academic argument for me, things will be different. And a gay man taking his three-year-old son out trick-or- treating dressed as a female character would be a complete and total non-issue to _everyone_, not just the people on this board. But for now, it would seem very weird, and for now, I would have a problem with it. ---
**Author:** ![Padeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a9a28c/32.png) [@Padeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Padeye)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2004, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/36 "2004-10-07T23:19:13Z")
I too was put into drag for halloween as a kid. Perhaps a result of my mother never having a daughter to dress up. It really seemed to frustrate her that I couldn’t get the hang of crossing my legs like a lady. I turned out straight and it’s not like I’m some kind of pervert. Well actually… ---
**Author:** ![gfloyd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/d2c977/32.png) [@gfloyd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gfloyd)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2004, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/37 "2004-10-08T05:26:43Z")
When my older brother was two or three, my mother sent my father to Sears with him to by Winnie the Pooh PJs that were on sale. The whole gang was on sale, and my dad let Jon pick what he wanted. My brother’s favorite character at the time was Piglet. My father therefore bought him pink piglet pjs. My mother looked at him a little ascanse, but Jon turned into a relatively normal young adult, well if you call physical chemists normal … Ergo, I don’t see a problem with it. ---
**Author:** ![Dunderman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecb155/32.png) [@Dunderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dunderman)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2004, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/38 "2004-10-08T08:24:12Z")
> [@SolGrundy](#): > > Why? For the same reason I’d dress my male baby in blue PJ’s and my female baby in pink. I’m surprised and amazed to hear this from _you_, **SolGrundy**. > [@](#): > > There’s nothing wrong with taking a child that young and saying, “this is what boys are like, and this is what girls are like,” and then letting the child as he grows figure out how much of that he wants to accept or reject. Wouldn’t it be better to say nothing so that the child doesn’t have to “accept” or “reject” restrictions but rather grow into a role of its own? As for the original subject, I would have no problem with a boy dressing up as a female character. ---
**Author:** ![Dung\_Beetle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dung_beetle/32/7945_2.png) [@Dung\_Beetle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dung_Beetle)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2004, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/39 "2004-10-08T12:10:35Z")
> [@SolGrundy](#): > > That’s because gender roles are in the process of evolving, in particular for women in the west. The prevailing message for women is “you can be whatever you want,” while the prevailing message for men is “be a man.” That’s why the character of “Dora the Explorer” exists in the first place, while you don’t see characters like “Stanley the Nurse.”… > I’m just pointing out that the change is a gradual process, and we’re in the middle of it. And because of that, there’s currently a double standard. Women wearing slacks: cool, even the norm. Men wearing skirts: still “weird.” It may not be fair, but it’s the way things are for now. Maybe if we let our three-year-olds dress as Dora the Explorer we can help to be part of this change? ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2004, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957/40 "2004-10-08T13:30:24Z")
> [@SolGrundy](#): > > This isn’t the same thing as my being some big hairy guy in a wife-beater shirt and one hand down his pants freaking out if he sees his son playing with a doll, snatching it away from him and shoving a dump truck in his hands instead. /whisper Is she talking about my husband? /whisper I should’ve clarified. While he is quite big and rather hairy (everywhere except the top of his head, alas), my Hubby isn’t the least bit neanderthal. He’s highly educated and extremely liberal. That’s what has made some of his responses so surprising. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/let-your-boy-be-a-girl-for-halloween/267957.md?page=3)