# Let's cheer the right-wing smear machine! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 12, 2005, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768 "2005-08-12T19:25:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![light\_strand](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a6a055/32.png) [@light\_strand](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/light_strand)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/161 "2005-08-14T16:53:43Z")
Once again. “He did it first”, is not political discourse. Moreover, you didn’t just say that he personally is an anti-semitic, cowardly, genocidal maniac, you said that _all_ Spaniards are anti-semitic, cowardly, genocidal maniacs. I think that’s ridiculous. Obviously, you disagree. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/162 "2005-08-14T16:54:53Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > Well, shit, you can’t blame a Clinton so I guess you have to go after Kerry. > > Get a new fucking trick. > > -Joe I’m not going after him, you silly snot, you were. I was agreeing with you. Interesting that **you** would bring up Clinton. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/163 "2005-08-14T17:00:54Z")
> [@light strand](#): > > Once again. “He did it first”, is not political discourse. No. But I’m trying to **help him** so that he can come to terms and understand his own bigotry and prejudice by seeing it reflected back at him. Moreover, you didn’t just say that he personally is an anti-semitic, cowardly, genocidal maniac, you said that _all_ Spaniards are anti-semitic, cowardly, genocidal maniacs. I think that’s ridiculous. Obviously, you disagree. [/QUOTE] Untrue. Untrue. I did not say that. I said that Spain had one of the worst records of genocide and anti-semitism. I also specifically exempted Antonio Banderas. ---
**Author:** ![litost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@litost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/litost)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/164 "2005-08-14T17:09:44Z")
What a thread! IMHO, Ms. Sheehan wants Bush to apologize for making the decision to go to war, and comfort her in her loss. If I were Bush, and genuinely believed the WMD threat Iraq posed and made this difficult decision to send troops into battle, I would publicly apologize just as Blair did. For whatever reason, Bush doesn’t have the honor to do so. Or, as he said during the debates, in a piece of mis-leading logic, one cannot fight a war which is openly acknowledged to be based on mistaken intelligence. “Oh, look… I broke this thing, but it wasn’t a mistake because if it were, I couldn’t fix it” So, in conclusion, I have to agree with people that Ms. Sheehan is wasting her time. Even if she meets Bush, nothing will come out of it. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/165 "2005-08-14T17:31:50Z")
Well then, not much of a stretch to conclude that Bugleboy, of the 101st Keyboarders, is _fighting mad_. Oooooh! Watch me _::::shuddder::::_ at the completetly irrelevant venom spewing forth from his laptop! Man the monitors, lethal _bytes_ incoming! Fuckin’ pathetic, weasel. Your tough guy Internet persona, impresses none but the already deluted such as yourself. Not much to address in that fetid pile, but FWIW, I actually see quite a few paralels between our past crooked empire and your current one. Then again, I’m not about to explain them to you for that would presume that you’d read a history book or two. Fat chance. As for facists and Franco, again, fight your own ignorance, Bugleboy – as in why and how he came to power and [who helped him stay there for all those decades](http://hitlerstoppedbyfranco.com/images/photos/Franco_with_US.jpg). BTW, I have little doubt that your own Fearless Misleader would carry on famously with El Generalisimo were he not, still, dead. Aznar did try to resucitate the bastard, and other than becoming one of Georgie’s best pals, all it got him was the boot back home. Good fuckin’ ridance to the lying cretin. Surely there’s a lesson yet to be learned by the majority of Americans. Too bad you keep having to learn in blood – yours and others regrettably. Well, by "yours’, I don’t literally mean obvious cowards as yourself, **Scylla** , but rather kids such as the subject of this thread. One’s a sad case, the other is just plain pathetic. I’ll leave it to the sagacious reader to figure out which is which. Enjoy the rest of your day, cumstain. PS-_Antonio Banderas_?! You’ve got to be fuckin’kidding me! Asshole couldn’t act himself outta of a paper bag. Then again, what else should I expect from a Neanderthal such as yourself? That you’d know who Javier Bardem was for instance? There’s another _fat chance_. Pearls/swine and all that. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/166 "2005-08-14T17:42:46Z")
This is not meant in any way to be a slam against Ms. Sheehan, but who wants to bet that the next time Bush takes a vacation in Crawford a multitude of groups will show up for some protest or other? It’s great way to launch your message onto the national stage since the press corp has to be there, and generally has nothing to report about. Bless her heart for being so passionate about her cause-- the idea that we should bring the troops home-- but she’s tilting at a nonexistent windmill. Bush is not going to cut and run, and no serious candidate for his replacement in '08 is going to do so either. With some luck, we will be drawing down the troops by then anyway. I mean, seriously, how much training do Iraqi soldiers need? Our guys are mostly young, and couldn’t have more than a few years training themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/167 "2005-08-14T17:46:40Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Pearls/swine and all that. What, no parting good wishes for the rag heads? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/168 "2005-08-14T18:02:50Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > I mean, seriously, how much training do Iraqi soldiers need? Our guys are mostly young, and couldn’t have more than a few years training themselves. All due respect, **John** , but our military has been doing this for quite a while now, and is generally considered to be quite good at training foreign forces. I had the pleasure of seeing some of this firsthand, when I was in the Navy. There is probably nobody who knows more about this subject than Robert D. Kaplan. I’d recommend looking his articles up for a quick primer of the efforts our forces are making worldwide in this area. For instance, here’s Kaplan in the July/August 2003 _Atlantic_: > [@](#): > > In formerly communist Mongolia, U.S. Army Colonel Tom Wilhelm, a fluent speaker of Russian who studied at Leningrad State University, is an adviser to the local military. With Wilhelm’s help, Mongolia has reoriented its defense strategy toward international peacekeeping—as a means of gaining allies in global forums against its rapacious neighbors, Russia and China. The planned dispatch of a Mongolian contingent to help patrol postwar Iraq was the result of what one good man—in this case, Wilhelm—was able to accomplish on the ground. I recently followed him around on an inspection tour of Mongolia’s Gobi Desert border with China. We slept in local military outposts, rode Bactrian camels, and spent hours in conversation with mid-level Mongolian officers over meals of horsemeat and camel’s milk. It is through such activities that relationships are built and allies are gained in an era when anyplace can turn out to be strategic. Some more, in the April 2005 _Atlantic_: > [@](#): > > “Every time you fire, a bad guy should bleed!” Sergeant Rivera yelled. “Aim for the high center torso. Any hit is good. Don’t worry about carving up the bull’s-eye. This isn’t target shooting. It’s about fighting with a gun.” He spoke with a Bronx accent, his voice at once loud, grating, and intimate. Because Rivera was a specialist in weaponry and the related field of close-quarters combat, Coughlin—who, as Gunny, technically outranked him—deferred to him. > > A Nigerien major, Moussa Salou Barmou, translated Rivera’s commands into French and Hausa for his soldiers. Major Moussa had trained with the U.S. Army at Fort Benning, Georgia, and with the Ivorians, the Cameroonians, and the Pakistanis. “I didn’t know what real combat was about until Fort Benning,” he told me. “The Americans have the money to simulate war in training, unlike other armies. But I wish the Americans could see how the rebels settle in our border towns in the desert and marry local girls so that they become invisible, so that you don’t know who you have to fight.” Because Major Moussa outranked the Marine noncoms, each made sure to address him as “Sir.” > > Rivera went on. The Nigeriens were only fifteen yards out from the targets—paper silhouettes of soldiers aiming their guns. “You will all fire a controlled pair followed by a hammer,” he explained. “A controlled pair is two slow shots. A hammer is two fast ones. Shooting a hammer, the rifle will recoil twice. You won’t have time to readjust, meaning with a fucked-up body position you will miss the target at least once. And that”—he was now shouting—“is unacceptable!” > > Rivera demonstrated, repeating and yelling everything, sometimes mixing English with French in his Bronx accent: “En position. Levez la sécurité. Feu! Avancez.” ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/169 "2005-08-14T18:11:07Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > All due respect, **John** , but our military has been doing this for quite a while now, and is generally considered to be quite good at training foreign forces. I never said othewise. I fully expect that the higly trained officers with years and years of experience will be the last to leave Iraq. But the foot soldiers, the 18, 19, and 20 year olds… surely they can be largely replaced by Iraqi men of equal age and training within the next few years. After all, they come to the job with something our best trained troops will never have-- local knowledge. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2005, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/170 "2005-08-14T21:14:42Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > Fuckin’ pathetic, weasel. Your tough guy Internet persona, impresses none but the already deluted such as yourself. Dude, you have the best typos. > [@](#): > > PS-_Antonio Banderas_?! You’ve got to be fuckin’kidding me! Asshole couldn’t act himself outta of a paper bag. I didn’t say he could act. I just think he’s cool. > [@](#): > > Then again, what else should I expect from a Neanderthal such as yourself? I’m a cro-mangon man you genocidal, antisemitic, fascist dog! > [@](#): > > That you’d know who Javier Bardem was for instance? There’s another _fat chance_. HA! Oh, like that’s obscure :rolleyes: The dude was nominated for best actor. Have you eaten at his place in Madrid? ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/171 "2005-08-15T00:07:49Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > I never said othewise. I fully expect that the higly trained officers with years and years of experience will be the last to leave Iraq. But the foot soldiers, the 18, 19, and 20 year olds… surely they can be largely replaced by Iraqi men of equal age and training within the next few years. After all, they come to the job with something our best trained troops will never have-- local knowledge. Why should it take _years_ to train young men to be police and soilders in their own country? Why is it that after all this time Iraq has little in the way of an effective police force or army ready to fight the insurgents who want to steal their democracy? Could it be that one or more of these? They are reluctant to kill thier fellow countrymen for what is percieved as the American puppet government. They fear acts of retribution against them and thier families. Democracy sounds good but not worth all this violence. Killing Muslims on behalf of the Infidels is a mortal sin. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/172 "2005-08-15T00:48:46Z")
It is pathetic to see someone proving the point of the OP. Keep it up **Scylla**! ---
**Author:** ![Frostillicus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Frostillicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frostillicus)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/173 "2005-08-15T01:00:57Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > This is not meant in any way to be a slam against Ms. Sheehan, but who wants to bet that the next time Bush takes a vacation in Crawford a multitude of groups will show up for some protest or other? It’s great way to launch your message onto the national stage since the press corp has to be there, and generally has nothing to report about. God, I hope so! ---
**Author:** ![imthjckaz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/imthjckaz/32/3223_2.png) [@imthjckaz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/imthjckaz)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/174 "2005-08-15T02:04:45Z")
Bush won’t meet with Cindy Sheehan again, there is too much of a chance that some of his answers could get him in dutch. Who knows, the ear piece could malfunction so couldn’t hear what his handlers are saying. If that happens, confused, he just may just blurt out “Poland, lets not forget about Poland!” > [@Scylla](#): > > Nyahh. We talked about your Mom. Apparently servicemen the world over are grateful. A mama joke? Are you kidding me! > [@](#): > > Well… Yeah. If you want to do reduce it down to it’s basic component, simplest terms, then yes, “Pussy” is the definition of liberal. I guess that goes with the saying “You are what you eat.” ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/175 "2005-08-15T02:11:03Z")
I’d like to see Cindy Sheehan and Natalee Holloway’s mom duke it out in the mud for the prime cable talk-show slots. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/176 "2005-08-15T02:16:26Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Or, you could just say conservatives are “dicks.” > [@imthjckaz](#): > > I guess that goes with the saying “You are what you eat.” Gee, that works on so many levels… ---
**Author:** ![Stephe96](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Stephe96](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stephe96)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/177 "2005-08-15T02:43:35Z")
You know, I just realized that it’s been 10 years since Jerry Garcia died. That means the Deadheads have been pretty much aimless for the last decade. I’m sure that the Cindy Sheehan protest is just the kind of ‘cause’ that gives these losers an excuse to thumb a ride down to Crawford and sit in the dirt and sing protest songs to each other. I’ll bet they feel _alive_, man! Yeah! Hey, don’t bogie that joint, dude… ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/178 "2005-08-15T02:49:13Z")
First off, let’s say right off that Mrs. Sheehan has every right to her opinion, and I, for one, won’t fault her for it. The essential qustion for me is whether this would be a huge media event under other circumstances. Like, say, a Democratic president. And I think all evidence shows that it would not be one. I’m reminded of the reactions of some family members after the Mogadishu incident. Reports were that when Clinton went to Walter Reed to see some of the troops, some of them refused to have their pictures taken with him. In addition, the father of Medal of Honor awardee Randy Shughart refused to shake Clinton’s hand, and told him point blank that he wasn’t fit to be president or commander-in-chief. Now, this is public knowlege, to anybody who cares to look it up. Mark Bowden reported on it extensively. But there didn’t seem to be a huge media swarm here, which is, one must admit, not the rule when it comes to the Clinton administration. Now, the circumstances were a bit different, I’ll grant. We were out of Somalia when the Medal of Honor citations were written, so this incident couldn’t be seen as opposition to an ongoing war. Thus, it was a bit less dramatic. It does seem to indicate, though, that the Sheehan story is on TV solely because it makes good TV, and the Shughart snub wasn’t because it wouldn’t have been. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/179 "2005-08-15T02:57:41Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > Thus, it was a bit less dramatic. It does seem to indicate, though, that the Sheehan story is on TV solely because it makes good TV, and the Shughart snub wasn’t because it wouldn’t have been. Well, it was less dramatic. Now had he camped out for two weeks where Clinton was on vacation, perhaps it would have been equally dramatic, and then I suspect it would have been widely reported. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2005, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768/180 "2005-08-15T03:00:37Z")
The headline: [U.S. Lowers Sights On What Can Be Achieved in Iraq](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/08/13/AR2005081300853_pf.html) The punchline: > [@](#): > > **Administration Is Shedding ‘Unreality’ That Dominated Invasion, Official Says** What? You mean you can’t make your own anymore? :smack: * * * [Busywork for our very own 101st Keyboarders](http://www.claybennett.com/images/archivetoons/checklist.jpg). n/c [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-cheer-the-right-wing-smear-machine/316768.md?page=10)