# Let's keep sneering at "Bernie bros", it worked so well last time. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 5, 2020, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524 "2020-02-05T03:08:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 7:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/341 "2020-02-13T07:45:44Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Irrelevant. You’re saying that only 53% of people are sure who they’re going to vote for no matter what on election day. I’m saying that doesn’t mean 47% of the voters are going to stay home or vote for Trump, it just means people aren’t willing to commit their vote now and stick to it regardless of what happens, which is perfectly reasonable. There’s a 99% chance I will vote for whoever the democratic candidate was, but I’m part of that 47% that you’re just assuming won’t do it, simply because I’m not willing to say that absolutely no matter what goes on from here on out, there’s nothing that could posisbly change my voting inclination. Which is more likely: you’re ridiculously convoluted situation, or that Bernie simply loses, and: > [@Iowa Caucus Discussion](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iowa-caucus-discussion/847465/104): > > Yup. If he isn’t the nominee, I’ll stay home and play here ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 7:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/342 "2020-02-13T07:52:27Z")
> [@Unreconstructed\_Man](#): > > Shut your cunt mouth you fucking worm. Be careful guys, don’t want to hurt the Bernie supporters’ feelings! ---
**Author:** ![margin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/65b543/32.png) [@margin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/margin)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 8:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/343 "2020-02-13T08:25:21Z")
> [@Unreconstructed\_Man](#): > > Shut your cunt mouth you fucking worm. Yeah, no sexism THERE. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/344 "2020-02-13T12:40:17Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > This whole “Bernie as the Messiah” thing is really fucking stupid. People who support Bernie aren’t a cult. They’re not like Trump cultists. They don’t think he’s a God-Emporer. > > All he is is someone that actually represent real leftist ideals, the likes of which we haven’t seen in a presidential run in - I honestly don’t know the last time. There are a lot of people in this country that know we’re a managed democracy, really an oligarchy, and that both parties bow down to the richest among us. > > The reason Bernie stands out is that he has a decades-long history of being completely sincere and fighting for actual progressive/leftist ideals. No one thinks he’s flawless, he’s just literally the only candidate in our lifetimes who is willing to call out the most fundamental problem of our political system: that the rich own almost all of our media and both of our parties and completely control our political discourse. They’ve given us political choices ranging from extreme right whackadoo loot the whole country to the benefit of the rich tomorrow, to moderate right wing let the rich loot the country at a steady and more sustainable pace. > > It’s amazing that none of you guys even seem to understand the mindset of a Bernie supporter, because it’s not complex at all, and they’ll tell you what they think. It’s not a cult of personality. Bernie has huge, obvious flaws. I’ve quoted this in its entirety _ **because I agree with it.** _ And that’s despite that I consider myself almost a “centrist.” _ **I understand enthusiasm for Bernie.** _ I admire the man. Recall that it was I — not one of the more fanatical Bernie Bros — who rebuked **margin** ’s stupid “ONE march” falsehood by mentioning the time he chained himself to blacks and was arrested. > [@](#): > > But he’s the only guy that’s willing to call out our actual problems and who we can be completely confident would actually sincerely do his best to improve the lives of the average person in this country. I think the other D candidates are sincere, though obviously they are all (with the exception of Warren) much less radical than Bernie. I get all that. I can’t speak for others in the thread, but _ **I admire Sanders; I admire the enthusiasm of his supporters.** _ Where the Bernie Bros go wrong is in lumping moderates like Biden with the Republicans. In some cases, even threatening to help elect Trump if Biden is the nominee. This shows such a bizarrely STUPID understanding of American politics, that when I read such stupidity, I discard EVERYTHING such a Bernie supporter writes or thinks. It’s like a restaurant patron who, upon learning that the Filet Mignon is unavailable and that he must choose between Veal Piccata or a Dogshit Sandwich, chooses the Dogshit out of spite. _ **Any Bernie supporter who lumps the moderate D’s with the R’s in today’s political clime is demonstrating the IQ of a banana slug.** _ Get it? HTH. ---
**Author:** ![Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f475e1/32.png) [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jimmy_Chitwood)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/345 "2020-02-13T13:01:55Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > That’s what you get out of this thread? God help us. Listen to yourself. God help us if the Sanders supporter _who said from the beginning he would vote for_ whatever reach-across-the-aisle-and-lose lobbyist in chief warmonger the Democrats nominate didn’t “get” the right thing from this thread. Such an amazing educational opportunity for a dumb baby like me to get shouted out about irrelevancies that were conceded before the conversation even started, and I’ve squandered it. Typical Bernie brat. No, I didn’t get that from this thread. What I got from this thread is nothing, other than a reminder of why I don’t come around here. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/346 "2020-02-13T13:39:27Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > Do you notice a difference in tone between what you just posted, and [this](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=22121086&postcount=38)? What difference in effect might they have on their target audience? You keep bring this up so I have to think that I’ve really hurt your feelings. You gotta admit, as far as profanity laced rants go, it’s among the better ones out there. Right? 😉 Despite enjoying some teasing at the expense of Bernie and his most avid supporters, I’ve been very honest about being in favor of most of Bernie’s policies. Being an independent, like you. Being progressive socialist, like you. Acknowledging that you have agreed to vote “Blue no matter who”. What more can I offer you to get you and your fellow comrades (not meant as a pejorative) to understand that this election is about bigger things than any one Democratic party hopeful, and that we, as progressives, cannot afford to be blindsided by the undoubtedly sincere, though misguided, passions of “Bernie or Bust”. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/347 "2020-02-13T13:54:18Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Where the Bernie Bros go wrong is in lumping moderates like Biden with the Republicans. Is supporting fiascos like the Iraq war and singing the praises of people who like carpet bombing countries we’re not even at war with really what passes for ‘moderate’ these days? It’s kind of amazing that ‘I’m not going to vote anyone for president who voted for the Iraq war’ or ‘I’m not going to vote for anyone for president who thinks carpet bombing people is OK’ is some super-radical position to take. > [@](#): > > _ **Any Bernie supporter who lumps the moderate D’s with the R’s in today’s political clime is demonstrating the IQ of a banana slug.** _ Get it? What about Biden himself, who is fine enough with ‘compromising’ with the far-right agenda of the Republicans that he’d be willing to pick a Republican VP? “Uh, you have the IQ of a banana slug if the guy who’d be fine with a Republican VP is anything but staunchly opposed to the Republicans” doesn’t really work. (I’m safe from the accusation anyway, I wasn’t pulling for Bernie until he became the only palatable nomine, I’ve just been in the ‘no carpet bombing’ and especially ‘no pro-Iraq-war president’ camp.) > **[A Biden-G.O.P. Ticket? He’s Open to It, but Doesn’t See Options (Published 2019)](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/12/30/us/politics/joe-biden-running-mate.html)** > > A voter asked Joseph R. Biden Jr. if he’d consider choosing a Republican as his running mate. “I would, but I can’t think of one now,” Mr. Biden responded. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/348 "2020-02-13T14:08:37Z")
Hmm, how did the Democrats nominating an antiwar candidate work out last time it really was an issue? > [@](#): > > Nixon won the election in a landslide, taking 60.7% of the popular vote and carrying 49 states, and he was the first Republican to sweep the South. McGovern took just 37.5% of the popular vote. Yup, ‘For (at least) More Years!’ CMC fnord! ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/349 "2020-02-13T14:13:13Z")
> [@Unreconstructed\_Man](#): > > BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAA!!! > > _SO_ many fucking people are doing that, both on the SDMB and elsewhere. You just don’t see it. Well, sorry, but that’s on you. Open your fucking eyes. You poor thing you. NO ONE IS DARING ‘non’ Democrats to vote for Trump. Open your own eyes. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/350 "2020-02-13T14:30:53Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > Is supporting fiascos like the Iraq war and singing the praises of people who like carpet bombing countries we’re not even at war with really what passes for ‘moderate’ these days? It’s kind of amazing that ‘I’m not going to vote anyone for president who voted for the Iraq war’ or ‘I’m not going to vote for anyone for president who thinks carpet bombing people is OK’ is some super-radical position to take. Joe Biden voted AGAINST the 1991 Gulf War, so lumping him with war mongers seems … quaint. His vote for the AUMF-Iraq in 2002 may have been similar to Hillary’s vote (see below); in any event he soon turned against the Bush-Cheney adventure when their lies and incompetence became apparent. After the (correct) decision to invade Afghanistan in 2001, the U.S. had a duty to the people of Afghanistan and to the U.S. soldiers put in harm’s way. This is not the thread to discuss Every.Single use of American military force, but those who say it is NEVER right to use military force are just as wrong as those who think it is ALWAYS right. Hillary was hugely and wrongly maligned by ignoramuses for her vote on AUMF-Iraq. I’ve posted excerpts from her own Senate speech to shatter these lies — her vote was intended to REDUCE the chance for War. But people prefer to have their minds made up, to repeat whatever lies fit their prejudices. If I thought there was a 2% chance you’d reconsider your ignorant views I’d spend some more Googles to disabuse you of the lies you’ve bought into. Lies pushed by haters, liars and, yes, perhaps Bernie Brats. It would be a waste of my time? Thought so. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/351 "2020-02-13T14:42:01Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > Hmm, how did the Democrats nominating an antiwar candidate work out last time it really was an issue? > Yup, ‘For (at least) More Years!’ > > CMC fnord! Can’t find the link right now, but I read an analysis last week that showed that if a Democrat got McGovern’s voting demographics today (i.e. his percentage of black, white, hispanic, etc.), they’d probably win rather comfortably. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/352 "2020-02-13T16:00:23Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Joe Biden voted AGAINST the 1991 Gulf War, so lumping him with war mongers seems … quaint. His vote for the AUMF-Iraq in 2002 may have been similar to Hillary’s vote (see below); in any event he soon turned against the Bush-Cheney adventure when their lies and incompetence became apparent. In other words, he voted for the Iraq war and spoke out in favor of it at the time just like I said. Later on when the war became unpopular he, along with a lot of other Democrats, suddenly became anti-war, but being antiwar after you’ve already had the war is pretty meaningless. > [@](#): > > If I thought there was a 2% chance you’d reconsider your ignorant views I’d spend some more Googles to disabuse you of the lies you’ve bought into. Lies pushed by haters, liars and, yes, perhaps Bernie Brats. It would be a waste of my time? Thought so. There’s nothing ignorant about my views, claiming that I’m ‘ignorant’ for looking at actual history instead of whitewashing nonsense is pure ad hominem. The record is clear, Biden voted for the Iraq war and spoke out strongly in support of it at the time. There are no ‘lies’ involved, I’m talking about well-documented historical fact. > [@](#): > > After the (correct) decision to invade Afghanistan in 2001, the U.S. had a duty to the people of Afghanistan and to the U.S. soldiers put in harm’s way. This is not the thread to discuss Every.Single use of American military force, but those who say it is NEVER right to use military force are just as wrong as those who think it is ALWAYS right. Not sure why you’re bringing in a bunch of non-sequitors. I didn’t say a single word about Afghanistan or state that it is NEVER right to use military force. If you’re confused, the reference to carpet bombing civilians in a country we’re not at war with refers to him saying “Dr. Kissinger, Mr. Secretary, you are a friend. A genuine friend…Thank you for always being my reality check” to a man who orchestrated a campaign to carpet bomb civilians in a country we weren’t even at war with. I am willing to say that THAT is never right. Is ‘I oppose carpet bombing people we’re not even at war with’ really too far-left of a position for you? > [@](#): > > Hillary was hugely and wrongly maligned by ignoramuses for her vote on AUMF-Iraq. I’ve posted excerpts from her own Senate speech to shatter these lies — her vote was intended to REDUCE the chance for War. But people prefer to have their minds made up, to repeat whatever lies fit their prejudices. She was nowhere near maligned enough for her vote for the Iraq war, people like you continue to make excuses for her. Excerpts from her speeches don’t change that she voted to enable the war when she could have voted against it. The fact that she’s a lying politician who wants to have things both ways and made CYA statements in speeches doesn’t ‘shatter’ the truth that she voted for the war, period. I compromised my principles and voted for her in 2016, and the fact that the Democrats are dragging out another candidate who thought Iraq was peachy keen and enabled it to happen demonstrates that I made a horrible mistake in signaling that I’d be willing to hold my nose and vote for that sort of person. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/353 "2020-02-13T16:03:15Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > More ignorance, or is it lies, from you?: > > [Link for quote above](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/may/02/hillary-clinton-trump-election-loss-russia-fbi-interference). Here is the headline on your link: “Hillary Clinton: I’m to blame for election loss _ **BUT OUTSIDE INTERFERENCE COST ME** _” Emphasis added. It still looks a lot like excuse making. She is not owning her defeat. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/354 "2020-02-13T16:14:23Z")
> [@Skypist](#): > > I will vote for anyone who wins the Democratic nomination. But I hope Bernie supporters will do the same if their preferred candidate doesn’t get the nomination. Otherwise we almost surely will get another 4 years of Frump. Please don’t try to take a swipe at the DNC by punishing the rest of us. It’s starting to look like a brokered convention and all bound delegates are released after the first vote. Bernie’s camp needs a majority of the bound delegates to win this thing otherwise they will give it to someone else. And if Bernie showed up with a plurality of the delgates and still loses, then a lot of Bernie supporters will take their ball and go home. That’s the threat. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/355 "2020-02-13T16:20:54Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Here is the headline on your link: > > “Hillary Clinton: I’m to blame for election loss _ **BUT OUTSIDE INTERFERENCE COST ME** _” > > Emphasis added. > > It still looks a lot like excuse making. She is not owning her defeat. Is she wrong? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/356 "2020-02-13T16:23:49Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > I wonder if you see the irony here:… > > YOU ARE MAKING A HUGE STRATEGIC BLUNDER THAT WILL CRIPPLE YOUR FUCKING PARTY FOR YEARS TO COME, AND FOR NO REASON. > > If defeating Trump and whatever comes after him really is the only priority, maybe you shouldn’t thumb your noses at all the fucking politically active, enthusiast young people that would want to help you do so if you didn’t keep dismissing and insulting them. Sounds like you’re not all that committed to beating Trump at all if taking swipes and insulting well-meaning progressives is more important to you. For added irony, do you see how you are dismissing all the moderates that are actually going to swing this election. Bernie probably can’t actually win the nomination. There is no likely pathway to his nomination. He would need a majority of the bound delegates to avoid a brokered convention and there is no way that a brokered Democratic convention produces Bernie as the nominee. And right now it is still unlikely that he wins an outright majority of bound delegates. I am glad that the Democrats are having this adult moment when they realize that telling boomers they are irrelevant by sneering “OK Boomer” at them is a bad idea. I’m glad that Democrats are taking this opportunity to tell the vocal far left wing of the party to sit down and shut up because their vote carries no more weight than the votes of a moderate Democrat no matter how much they shout and insult and pout. You are basically saying that we are practically forcing you to let Trump win by not giving you everything you want. You think people aren’t sneering at Biden? At Butigieg? At Bloomberg? Come on man. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/357 "2020-02-13T16:27:56Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > This is basically a wild guess. We don’t know who’s going to win in the general, and Any prediction this early is just guessing. It’s guessing right up until election day but a lot of never trumpers are no longer never trump. All those supreme court nominations got a lot of them over their reluctance to support a racist. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/358 "2020-02-13T16:31:48Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > And old commie, an old guy who sometimes seems befuddled, an older woman who has been smeared for the past three or four years, an old guy who some might see as an insurgent, and a gay guy. With such choices, how can we (I’m including myself, though I’m a left-leaning Independent) lose? How would you describe the candidate they are running against? I think Bernie has no chance at the nomination. I think it’s a little early to label Warren as the beleaguered female candidate that has been badmouthed into unelectability. Biden hasn’t really been making a lot of waves, good or bad. Boring is the worst thing you could say about him Bloomberg’s strategy might make him king, it might make him a king-maker. I think folks are more concerned about Butigieg’s inexperience than his sexual orientation. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/359 "2020-02-13T16:33:03Z")
> [@SenorBeef](#): > > You guys like to just dismiss stuff by insulting it, in this case hyperbolic and delusional, without actually responding to it. Your posts are devoid of content, and no one has tried to make a case as to why insulting Bernie supporters helps the democratic party or helps anyone beat Trump. How does insulting moderates help the Democratic party or help anyone defeat Trump? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2020, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524/360 "2020-02-13T16:41:56Z")
> [@Jimmy\_Chitwood](#): > > There’s no reason not to blame both. It is absolutely consistent to say that the Democrats are, and have been, fuckin’ the dog something fierce when it comes to giving people who aren’t right of center-right electoral options that feel good, but then _also_ say that the balance of the equities on election day 2016 meant that, if you didn’t show up and vote for Clinton, you were voting to roll the dice on some really fucking atrocious outcomes, and so you should have. > > Emphasizing one of those things doesn’t make the other not true anymore, which is the mistake a lot of people around here have decided to make their specialty. A liberal Democrat of exactly the Straight Dope type (this place always represented a very thin demographic sliver, but by now the chart is effectively one-dimensional) loves to start on the conclusion that “no matter how shitty” the candidate is, it’s better than Trump, and just stay right there, without ever thinking about how convenient that is when no matter who the candidate is, it’s going to be basically exactly what they want, and that this isn’t true for most people. Most people don’t occupy the space that is exactly in the middle of the “no matter how shitty” range of candidates. But when you do, man is that easy! > > You would think that it would matter to a group so putatively obsessed with electability that, just as a mathematical inevitability, there are going to be returns that diminish as voters are ideologically further and further from a given candidate’s positions. It is inescapable that people whose politics are remote enough from the offerings available would eventually decide that the cost of voting outweighs the benefit. The more of those there are, the more somebody who cares about electability should be paying attention to them. > > But, with that all said, it works the other way too. No matter how bad the options are, it’s still reasonable to blame anybody who arrives at that decision for making the bad choice. There is a real difference between having Trump as president and having whatever other bloodthirsty technocrat would be in there instead. That doesn’t get less real depending on how many dipshits are in a place being dipshits about it. You have to be very very far to the left to not see daylight between Trump and any Democrat running for office. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-keep-sneering-at-bernie-bros-it-worked-so-well-last-time/847524.md?page=19)