# "Let's lose with Joe!" what the 2020 campaign slogan should be **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 15, 2020, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820 "2020-04-15T03:58:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RealFDRdem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ac8455/32.png) [@RealFDRdem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealFDRdem)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 8:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/21 "2020-04-15T08:27:36Z")
One place I will give credit where it is due is that regardless of his policies, Biden is actually treating the left and Bernie with some respect (Unlike Hillary). We’ll see if this goes beyond tone and reaches into believable substance (such as his VP pick) and just maybe he’ll be able to squeak this out. But if he doesn’t will you “moderates” please look in the mirror and admit that you were wrong, rather than trying to blame Russia, “Bernie Bros”, or whoever else you feel takes the responsibility off your shoulders? ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/22 "2020-04-15T08:32:33Z")
For most of us, Biden was never a first choice. I liked Elizabeth Warren, but eventually it was apparent she wasn’t attracting voters — I blame the stupidity of the American voter. For me, Sanders’ left-wing policies were never a problem. _ **They wouldn’t be enacted anyway.** _ (Improved health-care funding is MORE likely to happen under a moderate who can unite than under a leftist who will frighten moderates.) The reason we settled on Biden is: _ **Rightly or wrongly, we think his chances will be better than Bernie’s in November.** _ Your reversal of this fact shows great ignorance and confusion. Opiners were stating this reasoning quite clearly: Do you think they were all lying? Is there some hidden cabal, invisible to top politicos, with the motives you ascribe? Many MANY Americans, rightly or wrongly, despise the idea of socialism and, while eager to vote for a Democratic moderate, would never vote for Sanders after the GOP-Kremlin propaganda blitz that would be launched. Capische? And I read that 15% of Bernie supporters will vote for Trump. It sounds like you are also implicitly advising those who read your newsletter to let Trump win. This is what is so astounding about you Bernie supporters. In a restaurant where only meatloaf and dogshit are on the menu, you tell the waiter: “No lobster thermidor? Well then, bring me either the meatloaf or the dogshit — it doesn’t matter.” ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 8:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/23 "2020-04-15T08:58:28Z")
> [@RealFDRdem](#): > > … (especially the ridiculous idea of listing Republican/conservative organizations rating of ANY Democrat. Whatever that means. You’re unhappy that the Competitive Enterprise Institute rated Senator Biden at 0%? Or you think all D’s get the Zero? [Here are CEI’s latest ratings](https://votesmart.org/interest-group/77/rating/73#.XpbI-yNS_IU): Note one Minnesota Democratic Congressman gets 46%. > [@](#): > > And the fact that you slipped in that he was more liberal than “about” 75% of senators - which would put him at best in the middle of the Democratic party ideologically, probably somewhat in the bottom half). _Almost_ right. The _more liberal than “about” 75%_ (Why did you need the extra quote marks?) is “almost”(:)) synonymous with _“exactly median Democrat”_ in these partisan days. As shown at the link. I could have phrased it either way, but thought you _might_ click the link if you cared enough to attempt arithmetic. _ **But, what in tarnation is so horridly wrong with the D’s picking as their candidate someone who’s in the middle of the D’s on the issues?** _ Yes, we get that the leftists would prefer a leftist. And the blue-dogs would prefer a blue-dog. I’m in the (fringe?) camp that prefers _ **a candidate who might win in November.** _ Is that so unspeakably mushy-brained? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/24 "2020-04-15T10:56:09Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > …So you’ll be voting for Trump, then? > [@RealFDRdem](#): > > Of course not. I live in a safe state so I have the freedom to vote my conscience by either voting Green or writing in Bernie. …So you’ll be voting for Trump, then. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/25 "2020-04-15T11:35:05Z")
This is one of the reasons why we are a collapsing board. Can we not devour the newbies? **Broomstick** sheesh. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/26 "2020-04-15T11:41:18Z")
> [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](#): > > Da, preach it comrade! We of the democrat party must do better in choosing party leader. That’ll earn you a warning, Happy Fun Ball. Per the new sticky it’s forbidden to call people Russian trolls or bots or whatever. Please don’t do it again. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 11:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/27 "2020-04-15T11:43:06Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > How much are the Republicans paying you to post here? And this will earn you a warning, Broomstick. Please do not insult other posters nor accuse them of lying. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/28 "2020-04-15T11:45:25Z")
All of that said, I think the OP counts more as a rant than anything else. I’ll send it off to The BBQ Pit and make it Miller’s problem. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/29 "2020-04-15T11:48:04Z")
Biden’s chances are infinitely better than Bernie’s. You simply cannot win as a Democrat without significant turnout among blacks. Bernie has been unable to improve his standing with minorities and once it got down to a two person race he had no chance. Had he been the nominee, minority turnout would be tepid at best. Biden’s policies are plenty liberal for me without going into whack-a-doodle it’ll never happen territory. Biden will achieve positive change, how much will depend on whether Turtle McTurtleface is still Majority Leader. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/30 "2020-04-15T11:59:15Z")
> [@RealFDRdem](#): > > Of course not. I live in a safe state so I have the freedom to vote my conscience by either voting Green or writing in Bernie. If I lived in a swing state I would vote for Biden. But I wouldn’t knock on any doors for him, I wouldn’t passionately try to get others to vote for him, and I certainly won’t send him any money. He gets enough from the corporations that have made him their stooge. You basically acknowledged that Biden is a better choice than Trump, but you instead devote time and energy to mocking Biden and not attacking the greater of two evils. You’re either a troll or a Trump supporter. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/31 "2020-04-15T12:15:34Z")
I’ve decided to convert this thread into a Poll. Those who answer ‘No’ on Question 1 are ineligible to answer Questions 2 & 3. Question 1: Have you [watched this video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JoU1u4HoMjA)? ⧠ Yes. ⧠ Loved it! I skipped the first 90 seconds to get to the political message. ⧠ Didn’t need to. Already caught the 2-minute excerpt on cable news. ⧠ Of course not. My mind’s already made up. Question 2: Compare your credentials with the speaker in the video. ⧠ It’s close, but the opinion of the 44th President of the United States is worthier than mine. ⧠ I’m smarter than fatso on _The Young Turks_. Who’s this guy with the funny ears? ⧠ That guy orchestrated the Massacre in Benghazi. I never did that. Question 3: Did the video change your mind about anything? ⧠ I was already a strong Biden supporter. The video made me even more fervent. ⧠ Obama, Trump, Biden — they’re all the same. I’m still planning to write-in Lady Gaga for President. ⧠ Is this question a joke? Do you have a cite that anything posted at SDMB has ever changed anyone’s mind? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 12:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/32 "2020-04-15T12:15:35Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > You basically acknowledged that Biden is a better choice than Trump, but you instead devote time and energy to mocking Biden and not attacking the greater of two evils. > > You’re either a troll or a Trump supporter. Nah, he’s just a Sandersnista who needs time to heal so he can finally stop trying to make Bernie happen. Grief is a multi-step process. I think this is the anger stage. ---
**Author:** ![Unreconstructed\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/76d3ee/32.png) [@Unreconstructed\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unreconstructed_Man)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/33 "2020-04-15T12:45:23Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > Or maybe most of them can [read polls and understand demographics](https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/latest_polls/democratic_nomination_polls/), and would prefer to win with Biden rather than lose with Bernie, even if Bernie is their ideological preference. Those polls are Biden vs Bernie, not Biden vs Trump and Bernie vs Trump. And the biggest reason why Biden beats Bernie in those head-to-heads is because people think Biden is more “electable”. That is to say, group A supports Biden because they think group B supports him, and group B supports Biden because they think group A supports him. No-one particularly wants him on his merits, which is why he’ll run an anaemic campaign that won’t excite anyone, and that, in turn, is why he’s going to get steamrollered by Donald Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Unreconstructed\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/76d3ee/32.png) [@Unreconstructed\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unreconstructed_Man)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/34 "2020-04-15T12:48:28Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Biden’s chances are infinitely better than Bernie’s. You simply cannot win as a Democrat without significant turnout among blacks. Jesus…_blacks only support him because they think whites’ll support him!_. If blacks and white liberals actually voted for who they fucking _WANTED_ rather than who they _think_ the other group will vote for we wouldn’t be in this mess. This is what happens when liberals try to be smart :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/35 "2020-04-15T13:10:28Z")
> [@Unreconstructed\_Man](#): > > Jesus…_blacks only support him because they think whites’ll support him!_. If blacks and white liberals actually voted for who they fucking _WANTED_ rather than who they _think_ the other group will vote for we wouldn’t be in this mess. > > This is what happens when liberals try to be smart :rolleyes: Stop trying to justify why Bernie lost the black vote. Given the choice between two old white men, they went with the more moderate candidate. Black voters, particularly in the south, are more conservative than you wish they were. The entire fucking country is more moderate than you wish it to be. THAT is why we’re in this mess. Not because people refuse to vote their conscience. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/36 "2020-04-15T13:13:34Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > That’ll earn you a warning, Happy Fun Ball. Per the new sticky it’s forbidden to call people Russian trolls or bots or whatever. Please don’t do it again. Can you please point to this? I have just looked and I do not see any new sticky talking about Russian trolls. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/37 "2020-04-15T13:14:01Z")
Okay, let us repeat this for anyone with brains still participating in this thread. [ul] [li]Username RealFDRDemocrat[/li][li]Joined literally yesterday[/li][li]Immediately posted this thread[/li][/ul] Do you really still think it’s worth participating? I mean, being quarantined is boring, but … really? ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/38 "2020-04-15T13:19:14Z")
> [@naita](#): > > Okay, let us repeat this for anyone with brains still participating in this thread. > > [ul] > [li]Username RealFDRDemocrat[/li][li]Joined literally yesterday[/li][li]Immediately posted this thread[/li][/ul] > > Do you really still think it’s worth participating? I mean, being quarantined is boring, but … really? What, you don’t believe he voted for FDR? ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/39 "2020-04-15T13:32:37Z")
> [@RealFDRdem](#): > > How did those polls work out in 2016? Pretty well, actually. Clinton won the popular vote by the amount suggested by national polls. She lost the Rust Belt states within the Margin of Error. The issue wasn’t the polls, it was that she assumed WI, MI, PA were safe and didn’t react to moving poll numbers there. The Trump campaign DID make a big push for those states in the final weeks because, again, they saw the polling. > [@Lamoral](#): > > Biden’s weakness as a candidate has absolutely nothing to do with his policies - _nothing_ at all to do with his policies - it’s everything to do with his total lack of personal charisma. That’s a pretty bizarre estimation, in my view. Biden has always been a well liked guy which was a big part of his work with Congress. People liked him and trusted him and felt respected by him. He has a way of not only having people like him but also making people feel like _[Biden likes them](https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2020/01/inverted-beer-test/604282/)_. Obviously it’s not universal and people opposed to his policies are going to try to bang the “Creepy Joe!” drum but saying the guy lacks charisma is sort of boggling. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2020, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820/40 "2020-04-15T13:33:41Z")
> [@RealFDRdem](#): > > Of course not. I live in a safe state so I have the freedom to vote my conscience by either voting Green or writing in Bernie. If I lived in a swing state I would vote for Biden. But I wouldn’t knock on any doors for him, I wouldn’t passionately try to get others to vote for him, and I certainly won’t send him any money. He gets enough from the corporations that have made him their stooge. Then you’re a fool. Last election people thought PA was safe, so I know a number of people who did just what you’re proposing to do. Trump won in PA. Fuck your holier than thou, gotta be a pure unicorn or I just won’t have it, even if Bernie DID say vote for Biden, attitude. If Trump wins again, it’ll be because of people like YOU. You’re not getting married to him, so the fact that he doesn’t check all your boxes or doesn’t “inspire” you doesn’t matter one whit. Keeping Trump OUT does. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-lose-with-joe-what-the-2020-campaign-slogan-should-be/851820.md?page=3)