# Let's say I want to vacation in North Korea. . . **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 7, 2008, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485 "2008-03-07T19:09:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2008, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/1 "2008-03-07T19:09:21Z")
OK, it’s not exactly on my short list of travel destinations, but I’m curious, nonetheless, and I do have some factual questions. (Actually, confirmation on things that I think I’ve gleaned.) From what I’ve been able to gather, though, here’s what I think. Correct me if I’m wrong. Unlike Cuba, the US doesn’t have a travel proscription against it. (If I’m wrong about this point, the rest of the questions are irrelevant.) However, the State Department doesn’t seem to think much of the idea, since there are not official diplomatic ties to North Korea. Travel is only available as a closely monitored tour group. Visas must be obtained thru China, since the US has no diplomatic ties. Visas are hard to obtain because of the bureaucracy of having to go thru a third party. North Korea doesn’t like to issue visas to Americans. ---
**Author:** ![dolphinboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dolphinboy/32/330_2.png) [@dolphinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dolphinboy)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2008, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/2 "2008-03-07T20:29:01Z")
A co-worker of mine who has a US passport but has been on assignment in Shanghai for the past two years is planning a “vacation” in North Korea for later this Spring. He said it’s not that difficult to arrange, but as you would expect there is a lot of red tape and you aren’t allowed to leave the tour group even for a few minutes. I believe there are a few western-style hotels there, but I’m not sure how fun it would be to visit a country tightly controlled by a mentally unbalanced dictator (IMHO). ---
**Author:** ![HubZilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ccd318/32.png) [@HubZilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HubZilla)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2008, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/3 "2008-03-07T21:17:04Z")
Look online for some some travel blogs of North Korea. Utterly fascinating. Imagine a commie-block city with wide streets and NO CARS! You are taken on a guided tour and expected to follow along, not talk too politically, and be careful with the photos. And you must present flowers and bow to a Statue of Kim Il-Sung. Basically, take a polite “when in Rome” approach. The advice seems to be, “if you don’t want to do this, don’t go.” The tour guides seem like nice enough fellows, so if you want to play “the voice of freedom”, you will only end up getting the poor tour guide in trouble. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![threemae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f9b8f/32.png) [@threemae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/threemae)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2008, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/4 "2008-03-07T22:59:36Z")
It may be arrangable, but due caution is still called for. The State Department doesn’t forbid tourist travel (such as with Cuba), but obtaining visas is apparently challenging. [http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis\_pa\_tw/cis/cis\_988.html](http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_988.html) ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2008, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/5 "2008-03-07T23:09:56Z")
> [@](#): > > **ENTRY/EXIT REQUIREMENTS:** North Korean visas are required for entry. The U.S. Government does not issue letters to private Americans seeking North Korean visas, even though in the past such letters have sometimes been requested by DPRK embassies. Prospective travelers entering and departing North Korea through China must also obtain a two-entry visa for China as a valid Chinese visa is essential for departing North Korea at the conclusion of a visit or in an emergency. While the ROK government is attempting to open direct travel routes to the DPRK, routine travel from the ROK to the DPRK is currently prohibited. Travel across the demilitarized zone (DMZ) is allowed only infrequently for official and government-authorized cultural and economic exchanges, or aid shipments. There are no regularly operating direct commercial flights from South Korea to North Korea at this time. U.S. citizens who arrive in North Korea without a valid U.S. passport and North Korean visa may be detained, arrested, fined or denied entry. Individuals traveling to North Korea report that fees for local travel costs (taxi, tolls, permits and the cost for security personnel assigned to escort foreigner visitors) can be high and arbitrary. > > **Where to obtain a North Korean visa:** There is no DPRK embassy in the United States. U.S. citizens and residents planning travel to North Korea must obtain DPRK visas in third countries, for example in Beijing, China. For information about entry requirements and restricted areas, contact the DPRK Mission to the United Nations in New York. Source: [404 - Page Not Found](http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_988.html) ---
**Author:** ![Desert\_Nomad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desert_nomad/32/177_2.png) [@Desert\_Nomad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desert_Nomad)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2008, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/6 "2008-03-07T23:14:54Z")
> **[🥇 Koryo Tours North Korea & International Tour Experts (2021-2022) -...](https://koryogroup.com/)** > > Koryo Tours are the experts in travel to unusual and unique destinations. Discover our North Korea tours, Bhutan tours, Central Asia tours, and more tours to unusual travel destinations. As an American, you will find it hard to get a visa. I have been trying for years. I did manage a visa to Iran tho, so hard visas are not always impossible. ---
**Author:** ![GaryM](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garym/32/241_2.png) [@GaryM](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaryM)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2008, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/7 "2008-03-08T01:43:26Z")
Looks like you might be able to go by [train](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22196808/) from South Korea. Of course there’s still that visa problem. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2008, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/8 "2008-03-08T05:21:03Z")
[QUOTE=GaryM] Looks like you might be able to go by [train](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22196808/) from South Korea. Of course there’s still that visa problem. :smack: [/QUOTE] And the fact that you have to be a cargo container… Have you ever looked at the inter-Korean border in Google Maps? It’s fascinating. You can see this vast shiny new train station on the southern side with northbound tracks that merge down to one track which ends at a fence and a gate, then on the other side continues into North Korea. Also, there’s [this YouTube video about the Ryugyong Hotel](http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=lEjqnTcdkXY). Plus two parts of a [bus](http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=6z9UpLPoYfk) [journey](http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=TBxS07WstyY) through the streets of Pyongyang. ---
**Author:** ![MikeS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MikeS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MikeS)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2008, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/9 "2008-03-08T05:21:47Z")
[QUOTE=Earl Snake-Hips Tucker] Visas must be obtained thru China, since the US has no diplomatic ties. [/QUOTE] Note that China isn’t the only country with diplomatic ties to North Korea; other [countries with North Korean embassies](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Korean_diplomatic_missions) include the UK, Germany, Italy, Sweden, and Mexico. I’d assume that you could get a North Korean visa from any of these embassies. However, seeing as the only easy way to get into the DPRK is via China, you’d still have to deal with the Chinese at some point. ---
**Author:** ![SanibelMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e4f/32.png) [@SanibelMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanibelMan)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2008, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/10 "2008-03-08T06:17:21Z")
I found this from an NY Times blog… [This guy](http://www.vbs.tv/northkorea/) got into North Korea by basically buying a visa in China and has now put together a 14-part documentary on his trip. What he’s put up so far has been pretty interesting. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Them](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/898d66/32.png) [@The\_Them](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Them)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2008, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/11 "2008-03-10T00:21:11Z")
I’m too lazy and incompetent to bust out with links; a guy from Harper’s went to the DPRK solo in 1996, as a journalist. Mebbe you could be one of those? Or a “scientist?” A total WAG: wouldn’t there be an office for the DPRK at the UN? ---
**Author:** ![Omoikane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/c4cdca/32.png) [@Omoikane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omoikane)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2008, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/12 "2008-03-10T03:06:09Z")
[QUOTE=The Them] I’m too lazy and incompetent to bust out with links; a guy from Harper’s went to the DPRK solo in 1996, as a journalist. Mebbe you could be one of those? Or a “scientist?” A total WAG: wouldn’t there be an office for the DPRK at the UN? [/QUOTE] > [@](#): > > In the land of the Dear Leader. > Harper’s Magazine, July, 1996 by Schell, Orville is the cite, I believe. I can post the full text, if anyone wants… ---
**Author:** ![Omoikane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/c4cdca/32.png) [@Omoikane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omoikane)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2008, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/13 "2008-03-10T03:22:44Z")
Ok, I lied. [http://www.mediafire.com/?jfxd6pxujlt](http://www.mediafire.com/?jfxd6pxujlt) He didn’t go solo though. ---
**Author:** ![jovan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/0ea827/32.png) [@jovan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jovan)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2008, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/14 "2008-03-10T05:02:16Z")
[QUOTE=MikeS] However, seeing as the only easy way to get into the DPRK is via China, you’d still have to deal with the Chinese at some point. [/QUOTE] You can take a bus to [Kumgangsan](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kumgangsan) (the Diamond Mountains) from South Korea. Of course, it’s a bit of a special place and not really what I suppose most people have in mind when they think of North Korea. ---
**Author:** ![Crocodiles\_And\_Boulevards](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ee7513/32.png) [@Crocodiles\_And\_Boulevards](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crocodiles_And_Boulevards)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2008, 6:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/15 "2008-03-10T06:52:50Z")
Just recently we’ve started being able to take tours into N. Korea. It’s expensive, but a lot of people have been signing up. I don’t know what you do if you’re not Korean, though =/ ---
**Author:** ![Faruiza](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecd19e/32.png) [@Faruiza](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Faruiza)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2008, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/16 "2008-03-10T07:11:11Z")
I’ve just spent HOURS at that site linked by **SanibelMan**. Good stuff there. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2008, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/17 "2008-03-10T07:20:36Z")
[QUOTE=jovan] You can take a bus to [Kumgangsan](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kumgangsan) (the Diamond Mountains) from South Korea. Of course, it’s a bit of a special place and not really what I suppose most people have in mind when they think of North Korea. [/QUOTE] Mt. Geumgang is, essentially, a South Korean resort located geographically inside the territory of North Korea. Also, the workers there are North Koreans. It’s an odd thing all around. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Them](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/898d66/32.png) [@The\_Them](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Them)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2008, 9:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-say-i-want-to-vacation-in-north-korea/440485/18 "2008-03-11T09:09:35Z")
Thanks, **Omoikane.** Guess my memories are playing tricks again. My favorite bit was when Mr. Schell went to get a haircut…