# Let's stop the terrorism double standard **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 28, 2015, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886 "2015-11-28T23:42:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/41 "2015-11-29T17:43:29Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > Sorry I changed my mind. OK. > [@](#): > > Why should it matter if its Political Terrorism or Religious Terrorism? Both should be condemned. Blowing up innocent people because you want freedom from the UK is just as morally repulsive as blowing up innocent people because they are the wrong religion or because they go to an abortion clinic. Who here is arguing otherwise? ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/42 "2015-11-29T17:48:56Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > OK. > Who here is arguing otherwise? What about the fact that the US media was very reluctant to ever label the IRA as terrorists? That can’t really be denied. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/43 "2015-11-29T17:49:51Z")
the useful thing about using terms like ‘terrorist’ is they’re inherently judgmental and serve the cause. There was a point in Iraq where, taking both invaders and indigenous into account, about 99% of everyone there was a ‘terrorist’. Totally helpful and constructive: solved a whole bunch of issues. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/44 "2015-11-29T17:51:50Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > What about the fact that the US media was very reluctant to ever label the IRA as terrorists? That can’t really be denied. Fwiw, I’ from London and I would never use that term about the IRA. Its just mind numbingly infantile. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/45 "2015-11-29T17:54:36Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Fwiw, I’ from London and I would never use that term about the IRA. Its just mind numbingly infantile. > **[1993 Bishopsgate bombing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_Bishopsgate_bombing)** > > The Bishopsgate bombing occurred on 24 April 1993, when the Provisional Irish Republican Army (IRA) detonated a powerful truck bomb on Bishopsgate, a major thoroughfare in London's financial district, the City of London. Telephoned warnings were sent about an hour beforehand, but a news photographer was killed in the blast and 44 people were injured, with fatalities minimised due to its occurring on a Saturday. The blast destroyed the nearby St Ethelburga's church and wrecked Liverpool Street... ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/46 "2015-11-29T17:56:00Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > [1993 Bishopsgate bombing - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1993_Bishopsgate_bombing) It’s two miles from here. As above. Infantile. In fact I’d go as far as to say things got to that stage exactly because of dehumanising strategies like pejorative name calling. Playground stuff. Intellectual gibberish. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/47 "2015-11-29T17:57:57Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > It’s two miles from here. As above. Infantile. So it wasn’t done by the IRA or it wasn’t an act of terrorism? which is infantile? ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/48 "2015-11-29T18:02:35Z")
You nailed the tone perfectly. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/49 "2015-11-29T18:10:29Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > The Palestinians want their own socio economic nation separate from Israel, yet all of their terrorism is lumped under “islamic terrorism”. Horseshit. When have atrocities committed by the PFLP been classified as “Islamist terrorism”? Similarly, all the guerrillas who carried out the 1972 Munich operation were Muslim, or at least of Muslim descent, but I don’t remember any referred to as “Muslim terrorists”. Instead they were called Palestinian terrorists. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/50 "2015-11-29T18:18:31Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > What about the fact that the US media was very reluctant to ever label the IRA as terrorists? That can’t really be denied. You seem awfully sure of yourself when it comes to events you knew so little about that you foolishly bragged you could find statements by IRA leaders using religious justifications for their violence. This despite the fact that they were a Marxist group. Are you really sure you know enough about the situation to make such strong statements? Do you have any knowledge about it beyond a couple of wiki articles you scanned? ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/51 "2015-11-29T18:23:48Z")
It’s a simple world of cowboys and injuns and the Lord will ensure the moral prevail. Etc. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/52 "2015-11-29T18:33:29Z")
The more I see about the Planned Parenthood shooter the more he looks like a nutjob who went over the edge rather than a terrorist. On the lighter side: [Climate Change is a form of terror](Http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/28/opinions/sutter-cop21-paris-preview-two-degrees/index.html) Yes. They went there. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/53 "2015-11-29T18:38:22Z")
Oh okay, ‘terrorism’ is the rational persons choice for murder. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/54 "2015-11-29T18:44:06Z")
Oh okay. Every murder is terrorism. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/55 "2015-11-29T18:50:16Z")
Unless they’re a nutjob. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/56 "2015-11-29T19:20:34Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > The more I see about the Planned Parenthood shooter the more he looks like a nutjob who went over the edge rather than a terrorist. > > On the lighter side: > [Climate Change is a form of terror](Http://www.cnn.com/2015/11/28/opinions/sutter-cop21-paris-preview-two-degrees/index.html) > Yes. They went there. You probably don’t agree with me, but my definition of terrorism (the attempt to achieve political goals through violence against civilians) is very similar to that used by the U.S. Code Tittle 22 Chapter 38, Section 2656f(d): > [@](#): > > Premeditated, politically motivated violence perpetrated against noncombatant targets by subnational groups or clandestine agents, usually intended to influence an audience. I wouldn’t discount the political motive just because a person is nuts. Nutty people can be politically motivated, too. In the end, though, it’s all criminal, so whether we call it “terrorism” or not is, to a certain extant, semantic. I know that laws have been modified to add penalties when “terrorism” is involved, but it wouldn’t bother me at all if we dropped that. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/57 "2015-11-29T19:42:02Z")
Well it’s not that important to me if people want to call him a terrorist, it just seems to me this guy was just as likely to shoot up some office or school as Planned Parenthood. He advised a neighbor to put in a metal roof to stop government spying. He hid food in the woods.The FBI isn’t likely to find out how he was “radicalized”. Nobody who knew said he had any strong political or religious views (other than hating government spying on him). So I just don’t think it’s a useful term to describe him. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/58 "2015-11-29T19:45:55Z")
> [@Nelson\_Pike](#): > > OP began: “Attacks like the one yesterday at Planned Parenthood are terrorism just the same as any Islamist attack.” That suggests a fundamental parity between clinic bombing and Islamic terrorism. The body count provides clear-sighted, incontrovertible proof that Islamic terrorism is so vastly more of a threat that comparison with clinic bombing is stupid. > > And were I to categorize victims in your manner, children such as the 8 victims of 9/11 aged 2-11 would be the saddest cases. The OP did not state or imply whether the clinic shooting or Islamic terrorism is a greater threat, just that the clinic shooting was an act of terrorism as much as an Islamic attack. I don’t see a logical argument contradicting that. I stated that I am at more risk for an attack at a U.S. medical facility by a radical Christian terrorist than an Islamic terrorist, and I stand by that. I don’t know that more people have died from Islamic than Christian violence, but will read any reputable source that provides the historical body count for each with great interest. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/59 "2015-11-29T19:54:38Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Well it’s not that important to me if people want to call him a terrorist, **it just seems to me this guy was just as likely to shoot up some office or school as Planned Parenthood.** He advised a neighbor to put in a metal roof to stop government spying. He hid food in the woods.The FBI isn’t likely to find out how he was “radicalized”. Nobody who knew said he had any strong political or religious views (other than hating government spying on him). So I just don’t think it’s a useful term to describe him. Other than using the phrase" No more baby parts". ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2015, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886/60 "2015-11-29T19:56:14Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > You probably don’t agree with me, but my definition of terrorism (the attempt to achieve political goals through violence against civilians) is very similar to that used by the U.S. Code Tittle 22 Chapter 38, Section 2656f(d): That’s hilarious. “The United States is engaging in terrorism!” “No, we’re not. Look it up!” “It’s premeditated, politically-motivated violence against noncombatant targets!” “Sure, but we’re neither subnational nor clandestine.” “Er – what?” “When we’re out to influence an audience by terrorizing folks, we say we’re a nation.” “That doesn’t…” “ **USA! USA!** As long as we do that chant, it _can’t_ be terrorism!” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-stop-the-terrorism-double-standard/738886.md?page=4)