# Let's talk about Political Correctness on American college campuses **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 24, 2015, 8:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251 "2015-12-24T08:49:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Chief\_Pedant](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@Chief\_Pedant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chief_Pedant)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/21 "2015-12-24T17:30:46Z")
Children need causes. The good ones have been done: Mother Earth; Protect the Weak; Enjoy good sex; Malign the wealthy; Death to Nixon. What’s left is a bunch of lame-ass pretense that stupid shit is Important. A racist lurking in every shadow; verbal insults turned into a Weapon of Aggression; standard ridicule made out to be Actionable Offenses… Yeah; it’s pitiful. But kids need a Great Cause. Without them, they would have to meet an academic standard to feel significant, and who wants to substitute mastery of a topic for the easier-to-attain significance of being a Victim? Only a handful can be Top Tier academically. Everyone can be a Victim, with enough training, and Victimhood has far too many delicious secondary gains to pass up. “Political correctness” is simply ugly-speak for diminishing my Cause from Great to bullshit. As a matter of fact, calling something I CARE ABOUT “political correctness” is AGGRESSION, you asshole! Stop it! Stop it now! ---
**Author:** ![botsgotme](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@botsgotme](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/botsgotme)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/22 "2015-12-24T17:35:04Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Every single sentence here is wrong. There’s a reason Ward Churchill became famous: he’s exactly the sort of far-out-of-the-mainstream-of-leftism that the right loves to hold up as a false example of what all leftists think. It’s astonishing how convincing folks find Breitbart’s transparently slanderous propaganda. Cite please? Ward Churchill compared the victims of the WTC massacre as “little Eichmans”-ergo, they deserved their fate. Is this not false, hateful, and barnrupt of morality? And he claimed to be American Indian-he is not. in short, every statement you made is false. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/23 "2015-12-24T17:39:00Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > It’s considered [NOT Consistent with Either University Assembly Guidelines or the University’s Commitment to Diversity and Inclusiveness.](https://sp.ehs.cornell.edu/fps/fire-code-compliance/Documents/FCC_Fire_Safety_Guidelines_for_Holidays_Decorations.pdf) Boy howdy–doesn’t context just make a difference! The guidelines specifically state that religious symbols and specific-holiday symbols may be displayed in > [@](#): > > appropriate campus display areas, subject to regular administrative procedures > governing the use of these areas. However, there are other guidelines for holiday displays that “would give the impression that the symbol is associated with the university.” These rules are far stricter and should in general be “focusing on the winter season rather than a particular holiday.” It’s this latter set of guidelines that discourage mistletoe, along with crosses, stars of David, angels, etc.–again, all of which are allowed in private displays, displays by campus groups using the display areas that are always available to campus groups, and so on. This terrible example of political correctness run amok? It is, like virtually every other example, overwrought and incorrectly represented; it is an entirely reasonable item in a set of entirely reasonable guidelines. > [@botsgotme](#): > > Cite please? Ward Churchill compared the victims of the WTC massacre as “little Eichmans”-ergo, they deserved their fate. Is this not false, hateful, and barnrupt of morality? And he claimed to be American Indian-he is not. > in short, every statement you made is false. Cite for what, for my claim that he’s out of the mainstream of leftist thought? You provided the cite! He called victims of the WTC massacre “little Eichmans”! Are you for real trying to claim this is within mainstream leftist thought? ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/24 "2015-12-24T17:42:43Z")
> [@botsgotme](#): > > Cite please? Ward Churchill compared the victims of the WTC massacre as “little Eichmans”-ergo, they deserved their fate. Is this not false, hateful, and barnrupt of morality? And he claimed to be American Indian-he is not. > in short, every statement you made is false. Reading comprehension is your friend. No one has defended Churchill. He is a loon. And _he is an outlier._ ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/25 "2015-12-24T17:46:50Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Boy howdy–doesn’t context just make a difference! The guidelines specifically state that religious symbols and specific-holiday symbols may be displayed in > > However, there are other guidelines for holiday displays that “would give the impression that the symbol is associated with the university.” These rules are far stricter and should in general be “focusing on the winter season rather than a particular holiday.” It’s this latter set of guidelines that discourage mistletoe, along with crosses, stars of David, angels, etc.–again, all of which are allowed in private displays, displays by campus groups using the display areas that are always available to campus groups, and so on. No, that’s not what the document says. The last bit represents their guidelines for group and individual displays. > [@](#): > > University members are reminded to be respectful of the religious diversity of our students and colleagues and are encouraged to use an inclusive approach in celebrating the holiday season. Individuals and units demonstrate this inclusive approach by: IOW, mistletoe is somehow not considered “inclusive”. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/26 "2015-12-24T18:09:49Z")
> [@Tithonus](#): > > That’s exactly it, IMO. The weird thing, however, isn’t that kids are rebelling. Kids always do that, and, as you say, if they can’t find good targets they’ll make their own. That’s not what’s surprising about all this. What’s surprising is that the adults are letting them get away with it. > > Take the video I linked to earlier, with that shrieking half-child effing and blinding about how “YALE IS _NOT_ AN INTELLECTUAL SPACE! IT’S A HOOOOME!” It’s total nonsense. Why aren’t the adults fighting back against this kind of thing? Why aren’t they saying “It’s _not_ a home. You already _have_ a home. You _left_ it to come _here_. This is a _University_, and if you ever want to have any hope of ever being of any use to anyone you’ll stop trying to make Yale your own personal ‘safe space’ and spend this time _learning._ Learning about things which might upset you, learning how to _deal_ with things which might upset you, and learning how to _debate_ things which might upset you. Oh, and you’ll learn some manners while you’re at it. Now go to your room and do your homework.” > > Granted, that may be a little blunt, but the longer these brats go without getting any pushback from their authority figures the more damaged and useless they’ll be when they graduate. The other adults, most college students are adults, are cowards. They’d rather the PC hammer drop on someone else. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/27 "2015-12-24T18:28:10Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > That Cracked article is something y’all should really read. It’s exactly on-point. The twittering over Political Correctness Gone Amok is nothing more than a rear-guard action, a way to trivialize and diminish real concerns by finding the most outre examples of protestors with foolish actions and pretending they represent everything, or even an important thing, about the protests. It’s embarrassing that anyone would fall for such. It’s also not like right-wingers don’t get equally hysterical over trivial stuff. Think about how many people actually believe that Christians, or whites, or men, or heterosexuals face huge amounts of discrimination or that there really is a “War on Christmas”. I’m not sure which I find weirder this time of year. The number of adults who get upset over hearing someone say “happy holidays” or the number of those same people who with a total lack of self-awareness wonder why people might not like being told “Merry Christmas”. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/28 "2015-12-24T18:34:28Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > No, that’s not what the document says. The last bit represents their guidelines for group and individual displays. > > IOW, mistletoe is somehow not considered “inclusive”. Uh, of course it’s not. It’s specifically a symbol of Christmas–or do you think it’s a common element of Hanukkah and Diwali displays? People who are reading this as saying that such things can’t be put up by groups or individuals need to reread the entire document, including the parts that specifically describe how specific (as opposed to inclusive) displays may be made. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/29 "2015-12-24T18:46:25Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Uh, of course it’s not. It’s specifically a symbol of Christmas–or do you think it’s a common element of Hanukkah and Diwali displays? I don’t see it as any different from Holly in that regard. Holly = OK\*; Mistletoe = Not OK. Or “decorated trees”. It’s not really a big deal… unless you insist on defending what is clearly a stupid decision by whoever wrote that. If someone is offended by mistletoe, they need to grow the fuck up. \*or at least more OK than mistletoe. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/30 "2015-12-24T18:47:40Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I don’t see it as any different from Holly in that regard. Holly = OK\*; Mistletoe = Not OK. Or “decorated trees”. > > It’s not really a big deal… unless you insist on defending what is clearly a stupid decision by whoever wrote that. If someone is offended by mistletoe, they need to grow the fuck up. > > \*or at least more OK than mistletoe. Who’s talking about offended? Factually, mistletoe is associated with Christmas. Do you deny this? And if you’re trying to do a winter display NOT associated with a specific holiday, you should avoid symbols of a specific holiday. Do you deny this? What exactly is your objection to this document? I don’t think your objection reflects a full reading. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/31 "2015-12-24T18:56:54Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Who’s talking about offended? If no one is offended by these things, then what is the problem? > [@](#): > > Factually, mistletoe is associated with Christmas. Do you deny this? It is, but so are “decorated trees”. And yet the latter is OK. makes no sense. > [@](#): > > And if you’re trying to do a winter display NOT associated with a specific holiday, you should avoid symbols of a specific holiday. Do you deny this? Mistletoe is no more Christmasy than a decorated tree is. Do you deny this? > [@](#): > > What exactly is your objection to this document? You asked for a cite. I gave you one. Now you’re acting like there is something wrong with the cite. > [@](#): > > I don’t think your objection reflects a full reading. I notice you have not retracted your original objection. Do you agree that your first post after reading it was incorrect? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/32 "2015-12-24T19:01:02Z")
Secular things that are still associated with Christmas: Snowflakes (used as decorations) Decorated Trees Misteltoe Holly. If you (and this is directed at everyone) had NOT read the Cornell document and were instructed to strike one of those things off the list as being “too Christmasy” to be inclusive, which would it be? For me, it would the tree. But all of those things are related to Christmas. All of them. ---
**Author:** ![sleestak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/919ad9/32.png) [@sleestak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sleestak)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/33 "2015-12-24T19:10:40Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Every single sentence here is wrong. There’s a reason Ward Churchill became famous: he’s exactly the sort of far-out-of-the-mainstream-of-leftism that the right loves to hold up as a false example of what all leftists think. It’s astonishing how convincing folks find Breitbart’s transparently slanderous propaganda. Do you actually read this message board? This happens constantly to conservatives/republicans here. IN FACT YOU JUST DID THE SAME DAMNED THING THAT YOU ACCUSE THE ‘RIGHT’ OF DOING. Jeez, man. Just stop. Slee ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/34 "2015-12-24T19:40:36Z")
I’d have guessed the problem with mistletoe is less that it’s not inclusive, and more the whole, “If you’re near this plant, I get to kiss you,” aspect. ---
**Author:** ![Keln](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/97f17d/32.png) [@Keln](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Keln)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/35 "2015-12-24T20:00:48Z")
Well, we do see rampant political correctness in the political arena, and for decades now, academia has been very politicized. As such it stands to reason that PR has crept into college campuses. Like the OP, I can’t say for sure how bad it is, since I haven’t been on a campus in many years. But there is plenty of anecdotal evidence swimming around the internet to suggest that it is a bit out of hand. Political correctness in general is, in my opinion, an indirect assault on free speech and ultimately free thought. If you can’t lawfully stop people from saying certain things, the next best thing is labeling what they say as hate speech or racist or sexist. There are so many issues in society that ought to be debated head-on, but aren’t because everyone is afraid of being labeled as some sort of bigot if they use the wrong word or point out facts that are inconvenient. It has created a chilling effect on public debate about a great many topics, and I think the same is happening on college campuses. That is a travesty if true. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/36 "2015-12-24T20:07:22Z")
Okay, it’s the product of an overly energetic 5% (if that) of the student body who are becoming politically active for the first time and going a bit overboard, and not otherwise something a rational person would find particularly concerning. Anything else about it? ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/37 "2015-12-24T20:33:04Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I’d have guessed the problem with mistletoe is less that it’s not inclusive, and more the whole, “If you’re near this plant, I get to kiss you,” aspect. Agreed. ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/38 "2015-12-24T21:50:22Z")
The problem is that while sympathizers hand-wave the lunacy as mere “outliers,” universities capitulate and professors/administrators have their reputations and livelihoods put on the line. For example, a couple hooligans paint swastikas and the UNIVERSITY PRESIDENT loses his job? What?? ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/39 "2015-12-24T21:51:38Z")
> [@Tithonus](#): > > Basically, it all started when the the wife of the guy getting screamed at (she’s a professor at Yale and he’s some kind of house master, I think) sent a polite e-mail saying it wasn’t Yale’s job to police the costumes students chose to wear for Halloween. A bunch of students kicked up a big stink about it because they _really_ wanted certain “culturally appropriative” Halloween costumes (like Indian head-dresses for example) banned on campus. The house master held an outdoors Q&A about it which gradually got more and more heated, until the girl in the video had a screaming shit-fit. > > The complete video is about half an hour long and it must be said that the house master kept his cool admirably throughout and was nothing but polite and respectful all the way though. For all the good it did him he might as well have turned up dressed as Hitler and burned a Koran. Eh, this is a pretty bad summary. [Here is the Yale Intercultural Affairs Committee email](https://www.thefire.org/email-from-intercultural-affairs/), which encouraged students to take a moment to think about their costume choices, and gave a simple four-question test to gauge whether a costume was offensive or not. [Here is the Erika Christakis email](https://www.thefire.org/email-from-erika-christakis-dressing-yourselves-email-to-silliman-college-yale-students-on-halloween-costumes/), in which she posits (among various tangents) that the original email represented adults exerting control over young people, and that offending people is part of the traditional college experience. Lastly, [here is the open letter directed at Erika Christakis](http://downatyale.com/post.php?id=430). It does not included a demand for Yale to ban any costumes; it’s a rebuttal of Christakis’ points (such as that the idea of not wearing offensive costumes originated with the administration and not from students’ complaints), and objects to how Christakis trivialized the underlying issues. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2015, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251/40 "2015-12-24T22:03:11Z")
> [@Stringbean](#): > > The problem is that while sympathizers hand-wave the lunacy as mere “outliers,” universities capitulate and professors/administrators have their reputations and livelihoods put on the line. > > For example, a couple hooligans paint swastikas and the UNIVERSITY PRESIDENT loses his job? > > What?? That spin is pretty bad. The president and chancellor resigned not because of people painting swastikas, they resigned because they handled that - and other racial incidents on campus - horribly. [By the school’s own admission](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/grade-point/wp/2015/11/09/missouris-student-government-calls-for-university-presidents-removal/): > [@](#): > > The Missouri Board of Curators sounded a solemn note in vowing changes, including a first-ever “chief diversity, inclusion and equity officer,” a review of policies, additional support for those who have experienced discrimination, and efforts to hire and retain diverse faculty. > > “It saddens me that some who have attended our university have ever felt fear, being unwelcome, or have experienced racism,” said Donald Cupps, the board’s chair. “To those who have suffered, I apologize on behalf of the university for being slow to respond to experiences that are unacceptable and offensive in our campus communities and in our society.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-political-correctness-on-american-college-campuses/741251.md?page=3)