Definitely a complicated issue. It is difficult for me to decide which side to support.
I would like to see a compromise.
Is this pipe line utilizing threaded pipe or is it welded?
Is it possible to encase another pipe around the oil pipe? With the space between pressurized? This would add better leak protection. And a leak could be identified and repaired.
I’m tired, it’s been a long long weekend. Not an extra long regular weekend, it’s been a long weekend, and it seems extra long too. I mention that because you usually have some kind of point you’re trying to make but I’m not getting it and I’ll just chalk that up to being tired. Maybe tomorrow I’ll figure out that you aren’t trying to say that oil pipelines aren’t a potential danger to ground water. But at the moment that’s what it sounds like.
If by protest you mean block a project that was properly engineered and vetted then yes, it’s never OK. There was a year long process of public access. THAT is the time to voice your concerns. This was not done.
As I’ve already cited, the tribe in question didn’t involve themselves in the process and to this day are not unified in this holy grail of environmental Armageddon.
I haven’t seen any evidence at all that her injuries were caused by the police.
Do you have any reason, other than the claims of her father and the tribe, to believe that the police are using any sort of devices capable of causing the type of injuries she has? Contrary to the father’s statements, police do not use concussion grenades, those are military weapons. Grenade - Wikipedia
The OP opened this thread to solicit information about the issues surrounding this pipeline and protests going on. I thought that was an excellent idea since so little information seem to be available. As I noted earlier, I read every article in both Sunday papers I read today (Merc News and NYT), but not much there, either. You, and others, have made some pretty bold claims in this thread. Don’t you think you should be able to back them up? That is all.
Whether true or not, this has nothing to do with my point, which was in response to an accusation that the use of gas vehicles means the protest is hypocritical.
Well don’t expect to convince many, for example, if you are protesting electricity generation while using the internet. Sure you can protest but only a fringe will take you seriously.
They aren’t protesting oil production or pipelines in general, just the location of that particular one.
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Uh … Wrong! 
Except no credible reasons have been given as to why that particular pipeline should not be built in that particular place, just vague notions that it is potentially risky. Every bit of industrial infrastructure in existence carries some risk and is on land that was at some point in history taken by force.
Sure. And I’m not qualified to say one way or the other. My post was strictly about how they are not being hypocritical by using petroleum and protesting this particular pipeline. They may well be incorrect about the actual danger of the pipeline but they are not being hypocritical by protesting it.
Sure, if this is just an isolated incident. But increasingly, there are protests aimed at pipelines generally. That does raise the issue: what alternative do the opponents of pipelines propose? Again, I don’t think it’s helpful to frame the issue in term of hypocrisy, but as a matter of transport and energy policy, what alternative is ring set out, other than “pipelines are bad.”
I’m also curious why the band did not participate in the review process? That does seriously undercut the rationale for the protests. If they had an opportunity to raise their concerns, before a body which had the power to order changes to the pipeline’s path, why the heck didn’t they do so? Have they explained why they didn’t do so?
If they had an opportunity to make submissions and didn’t do so, I’m afraid that undercuts Bricker’s summary of events.
Does anybody want one of these “in their back yard”? Anyone petition the Gov to send its blessings their way? Could it be that part of their ire is their impression that they are, politically, the weakest demographic there is, period? And that political weakness forms a major part in explaining how this gift was bestowed upon them.
It’s the same mentality that thinks the drug war can be fought by attacking the supply side. America is addicted to fossil fuels. Trying to prevent fossil fuels from reaching Americans isn’t likely to do much good. But modern day protesters seem less interested in making real change than they do feeling like they are on the right side. The Native American tribes are not in that category of course, but those coming to support them just want to fight the good fight and have very little invested in whether it works or not. And I seriously doubt it’s the Native Americans provoking the law enforcement response. Those are the professional protesters.
From my experience interacting with the self appointed guardians of the planet types that staff these sorts of protests, the alternatives that they propose generally consist of one or more forms of perpetual motion machine that “the corporations” are keeping off the market. In their minds all of this is due to “money in politics” and is why Citizens United must be overturned. And I am not even kidding, sadly.
You actually said that!?! With a straight face, you typed it and hit “Enter”?
There are lots of things that undercut that summary. It’s entertaining, but not particularly informative.
Spend a lot of time at environmental protests, do you? Pack a lunch, take the family, make an outing of it?