# Let's talk about your favorite "upbeat" song that is actually quite fucked up **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 15, 2009, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306 "2009-12-15T03:12:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/41 "2009-12-16T01:10:26Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > My grandparents are Mennonite and I doubt my grandma (who grew up Amish) has heard any rock music ever. She has never danced in her life. > > I totally forget where we were when it happened, we heard the song “Imagine” and she said how much she liked the song because she’s heard it at church. Not sure if she heard it from her church’s choir or a visiting choir performance, but she’s heard it. And she likes it. > > I guess it’s not TOO bad, because Mennonites are pacifists so they would like to see a world living in peace. They’d be ok with no religion…well, no religion other than Mennonite 🙂 If they are like most other Christians I know, they don’t even consider theirs a religion, It’s just the truth. A similar vein to Imagine is [Hallelujah](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2NEU6Xf7lM)\* by Leonard Cohen ([original lyrics](http://askville.amazon.com/recently-sang-song-Alleluia-Bon-Jovi-unplugged-release-group/AnswerViewer.do?requestId=2747364)). Way too many people I know seem to think it’s a Christian song. And maybe it is… for that bizarre sect that thinks its murdering someone’s husband because you saw her naked once and couldn’t help yourself is behavior worth celebrating. Don’t get me wrong, it’s actually a pretty cool song once you get out of the fundie mindset. It’s pretty accurate to the Biblical account: David repents of the murder and adultery, but still can’t get over his love for the woman. He actually chooses the son from that union to be his successor. It screws up the rest of his kids, but he still can’t get over her. What makes it non-Christian is that it celebrates this as being a good thing, while the Bible clearly does not. (In fact, I’ve always wondered if David picks Solomon out of desire to make it up to Bathsheba. Sorry I killed your husband–will making our son king make it up to ya? Still not great, but a little more in character for God to accept that.) \*Links to a cover. Better than the original, IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/42 "2009-12-16T02:34:13Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > A similar vein to Imagine is Hallelujah\* by Leonard Cohen (original lyrics). Way too many people I know seem to think it’s a Christian song. And maybe it is… **for that bizarre sect that thinks its murdering someone’s husband because you saw her naked once and couldn’t help yourself is behavior worth celebrating.** > > Don’t get me wrong, it’s actually a pretty cool song once you get out of the fundie mindset. It’s pretty accurate to the Biblical account: David repents of the murder and adultery, but still can’t get over his love for the woman. He actually chooses the son from that union to be his successor. It screws up the rest of his kids, but he still can’t get over her. What makes it non-Christian is that **it celebrates this as being a good thing** , while the Bible clearly does not. (Emphasis mine.) I do not get that at all from Leonard Cohen’s “[Hallelujah](http://www.leonardcohen.com/music.cgi?album_id=16&song_id=13)”. I’m listening to Cohen’s recording of the song right now, and not only is it not upbeat (hardly anything by Cohen is), in the last verse of the song the narrator seems pretty clear about the fact that he did not do a lot of good in his life: _I did my best, it wasn’t much. I couldn’t feel, so I tried to touch. I’ve told the truth, I didn’t come to fool ya. And even though it all went wrong, I’ll stand before the Lord of Song, With nothing on my tongue but “Hallelujah!”_ I also think you’re taking the references to David way too literally. The narrator is alluding to David and Bathsheba, and also to Samson and Delilah, to describe something happening to a modern man. He’s not simply retelling a Biblical story. It’s not clear to me that the narrator is the same man who “saw her bathing on the roof” – the narrator refers to that man as “you”, and while he might be referring to himself in the second person there does seem to be an external “you” to whom the song is addressed. Either way, there’s nothing in the song about murder, illegitimate children, or questionable royal succession, much less about these things being good. The narrator’s point seems to be instead that there are different ways to get in touch with the divine, and that passionate love/sex is one of them. _That’s_ what’s being celebrated, not murder, etc. This message is still hardly a traditional Christian one, but I’d say a much more obvious thing that makes the song “non-Christian” is that Cohen isn’t a Christian and the Biblical references in the song come from the Old Testament. Some of Cohen’s other work does contain explicit references to Christianity, but to the extent that “Hallelujah” is a religious song, it’s a _Jewish_ song. ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/43 "2009-12-16T02:51:14Z")
Getting back to the OP, while I wouldn’t call Pearl Jam’s “Alive” a really upbeat song, the chorus of “I’m still alive” has widely been taken as life-affirming. Anyone paying the slightest attention to the verses could tell that the narrator is coming from a pretty messed up background, but he’s shouting out that he’s still alive so he must be ready to put this behind him. He’s celebrating the fact that he has his own life to live. Right? Well, not exactly. Eddie Vedder has explained that when he wrote the song, which is semi-autobiographical, he didn’t mean for the narrator to be happy that he was still alive. The narrator instead considers it a kind of curse, wondering at one point in the song if he deserves to be alive at all. He’s shouting “I’m still alive” because he’s horrified and angry that he’s had all this drama dumped on him, and now he’s going to have to live with it. But that’s not the end of the story either. As Vedder explains in [this appearance on VH1’s _Storytellers_](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDOagxVsN0c) (link goes to YouTube video), the positive way audiences interpreted this song changed the meaning of the song for him too and “lifted the curse”. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/44 "2009-12-16T03:05:38Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > I grew up loving _Gentle on My Mind_ as sung by Glen Campbell, and written by John Hartman. John \*Harford \*or \*Hartford \*(he added a ‘t’ to his birth surname). ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/45 "2009-12-16T04:00:10Z")
“Sometimes Wanna Die” by Joydrop is sung rather cheerfully. Likewise “Sick & Beautiful” by Artificial Joy Club. Both are about men driving the singers to despair. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/46 "2009-12-16T05:24:11Z")
> [@Mtgman](#): > > Artificial Flowers is a hilarious song and about ten people know why. Well this just complicates things. Next time I see someone smiling and foot-tapping to this song, I won’t know if it’s because he’s one of ten who is in on the joke, or if he’s not paying attention to the lyrics. Next you’ll be telling me “Mack the Knife” isn’t about a killer. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 10:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/47 "2009-12-16T10:09:10Z")
> [@cjepson](#): > > I would have to go with Nick Lowe’s _Marie Provost_. It’s a very poppy, classic I-V-IV song telling (with much dark humor) the true and tragic story of silent film actress Marie Prevost… featuring the following classic couplet: > > _She was a winner > That became a doggie’s dinner_ Just one of several snappy yet cynical numbers on _Pure Pop for Now People_. Slick production, poppy tunes–then, you listened to the lyrics. Of course, I’m one of the Cool Kids who located the UK edition: [Jesus of Cool](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_of_Cool). Actually, I wasn’t exactly a “kid”–but an old hippie fart who intellectually approved of Punk’s assault on Overblown Arena Rock (& Disco) but was glad to actually find “new” music that was more sophisticated that the Sex Pistols. I wasn’t one of the kids moshing in front of the band at the Island (Houston’s main punk/new wave club)–I was hanging at the bar along with the other oldsters. Then there was the time I dropped by Real Records (Houston’s main punk/new wave record shop) & Ronnie Bond dropped the Elevators’ “You’re Gonna Miss Me” on the turntable–paying homage to his elders. (Ah, Hippie Nostalgia _plus_ Punk Nostalgia–Good Times! Don’t let me get started on Folkie Nostalgia or–God Help Us–Cosmic Cowboy Nostalgia.) ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/48 "2009-12-16T13:45:49Z")
Dave Mason’s “Feelin’ Alright?” is often thought of as an upbeat song, but it’s about a man who’s trapped in a bad relationship and has to quit it, then comes back to the woman even though he expects her to dump him again. Rather a sick relationship, but I’ve seen it used as a cheery upbeat song in commercials (though they only use the refrain “Feelin’ Alright” and don’t indicate it’s a question. The Beatles’s “We Can Work It Out” seems to be a song about compromising to save a relationship. But consider this verse: > [@Lennon/McCartney](#): > > Try to see it my way, > Only time will tell if I am right or I am wrong. > While you see it your way > There’s a chance that we might fall apart before too long. He’s saying: do it my way, right or wrong, or we’re through. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/49 "2009-12-16T14:37:55Z")
Johnny Cash had one, [Delia’s Gone](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1iKEPzF1Js), that got my mom, once—she tends not to notice the _lyrics_ to songs unless she’s really paying attention. Even when she’s singing along. :eek: 😃 As an odd twin to an “upbeat” fucked up song, I’ll add “Death is Not the End,” originally by Dylan, but covered notably by Nick Cave and the Bad Seeds. Depending on how you interpret the lyrics, it’s either “quietly inspirational, if wistfully melancholy,” or “chilled by the icy claw of inevitable horror.” Aaaand after that…one I just had the fairly recent pleasure to finally get ahold of, Tiny Tim’s version of [“The Other Side.”](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DEoOdcYKbc) Aka “The Ice Caps are Melting”; and just about anything Tom Leher’s written. First thing that comes to mind, _So Long Mom (I’m Off to Drop the Bomb)_. But since they’re basically comedy songs to begin with (?), they might not count. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/50 "2009-12-16T16:32:32Z")
I’m fond of the one I have for my cell phone ringtone: [“I Can’t Decide”](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFKUnfwBPTU) by the Scissor Sisters. It’s just so cheery: > [@](#): > > I can’t decide whether you should live or die > Oh, you’ll probably go to heaven, please don’t hang your head and cry > No wonder why my heart feels dead inside > It’s cold and hard and petrified > Lock the doors and close the blinds, we’re going for a ride. All done to a sort of bouncy ragtime-style tune. ---
**Author:** ![Strainger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/strainger/32/244_2.png) [@Strainger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strainger)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/51 "2009-12-16T16:37:53Z")
[Ahem!](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11873929&postcount=8) 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Strainger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/strainger/32/244_2.png) [@Strainger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strainger)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/52 "2009-12-16T16:42:37Z")
Thanks for the lowdown, **Mtgman**. I want to see _Tenderloin_ now. ---
**Author:** ![Strainger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/strainger/32/244_2.png) [@Strainger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strainger)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/53 "2009-12-16T17:03:28Z")
I think the Beatles had a few of these. One that immediately comes to mind is: “Bang bang Maxwell’s silver hammer came down upon her head. Bang bang Maxwell’s silver hammer made sure she was dead.” ---
**Author:** ![Meltdown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Meltdown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meltdown)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/54 "2009-12-16T17:11:57Z")
Someone else mentioned New Order’s “True Faith” – I came in to mention another New Order song – “Love Vigilantes.” The music is typical New Order synth-pop, bright and extremely danceable. The story is about a soldier in a distant land who wants nothing more to return to his wife and child. His time finally arrives, and he runs breathlessly through the door – only to find his wife crying over a telegram that she received telling her that he had been killed. And it was true – he was dead, but didn’t realize it until that moment. [Love Vigilantes](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l36eO6BwPq8) The band Iron and Wine have recently covered it, but their version isn’t really upbeat. ---
**Author:** ![Carl\_Corey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Carl\_Corey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carl_Corey)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2009, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/55 "2009-12-16T21:05:37Z")
I imagine quite a few Steely Dan songs would fit the OP. ---
**Author:** ![salinqmind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3ec8ea/32.png) [@salinqmind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/salinqmind)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/56 "2009-12-17T05:02:59Z")
I WIN! Not only is THIS cheery and bouncy and upbeat, but it’s ALSO a Christmas song! Two for the price of one. [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGdrMOttV\_s](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EGdrMOttV_s) ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/57 "2009-12-17T14:12:42Z")
In the spirit of the festival holiday season, I give you “Grandma Got Run Over By a Reindeer.” ---
**Author:** ![Ferret\_Herder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e47774/32.png) [@Ferret\_Herder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferret_Herder)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/58 "2009-12-17T15:37:56Z")
Florence and the Machine: [Kiss With a Fist](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpsDegqioVA). Major upbeat dance song, with lyrics that talk about him hitting her, her hitting back, and the violence escalating, culminating in her setting the bed on fire. Part of the chorus is “A kiss with a fist is better than none.” The musical heir to the song “He Hit Me (And It Felt Like a Kiss)”. ---
**Author:** ![Mehitabel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8797f3/32.png) [@Mehitabel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mehitabel)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/59 "2009-12-17T15:50:07Z")
Thanks for the TENDERLOIN info, I was just about to come here about it! I saw the 2000 Encores concert presentation of the 1960 musical and the way the song was done was that the anti-hero, Tommy, used this song as an audition to get into the church choir (with the bonus of impressing his dream girl who was also in it, and active in the preacher’s crusade). The choir stood around mournfully and joined in on the final verse, totally conned by Patrick Wilson’s sweet sad balladeering, even as it got sillier and sillier (“…and with cutting and waxing, she waned”) and he got into the choir (and of course got the girl later). The song was then used as the entr’acte, with chorus girls holding up signs for the lyrics pointing with flowers for us to sing along. It was fun. But Bock and Harnick are such good artists that the last line makes me mist up anyway. [Here’s](http://www.amazon.com/Tenderloin-2000-Encores-Concert-Cast/dp/B00004U034/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1261064585&sr=1-1) a page where you can hear a sample. ---
**Author:** ![yanceylebeef](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yanceylebeef/32/12290_2.png) [@yanceylebeef](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yanceylebeef)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306/60 "2009-12-17T15:59:47Z")
Go find albums by The Tripwires or the Minus 5. both are projects of Young Fresh Fellows Scott McCaughey. Really pretty Beatlesesque arrangements about really sad horrific stuff. Awesome! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lets-talk-about-your-favorite-upbeat-song-that-is-actually-quite-fucked-up/521306.md?page=4)