# Lex Luthor vs. Doctor Doom: which would-be world conquerer reigns supreme? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 2, 2007, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210 "2007-08-02T23:28:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/21 "2007-08-03T19:05:22Z")
Don’t blame me, I voted for Luthor. ---
**Author:** ![kingpengvin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9dc877/32.png) [@kingpengvin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kingpengvin)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/22 "2007-08-03T19:23:07Z")
Doom monologues far too much. Luthor is likely to use that against Doom. ---
**Author:** ![MonkeyMule](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc348/32.png) [@MonkeyMule](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MonkeyMule)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/23 "2007-08-03T19:37:16Z")
[QUOTE=Jonathan Chance] Doom has magic. Luthor has, in the past, had access to the technology of Apokalips. Darkseid is not someone with whom one screws around. [/QUOTE] Well that is past tense correct? Luthor at one point had Darkseid weaponry, but hell Dr. Doom _had_ The Power Cosmic. I think if we talk about who for a period in time had the most bad-assed powers around it’d wind up a wash. [QUOTE=Jonathan Chance] Doom has Latveria. Sweet. Luthor was President of the USA. Sweeter. [/QUOTE] Again Luther _was_ President, whereas Doom still _is_ ruler lord supreme of Latveria. And even then, Doom wielded more (internal) power in his office as head of state then Luthor ever could. Damn pesky constitution and its separation of powers! [QUOTE=Jonathan Chance] Luthor has the ability to talk people into things. Doom orders all to bow before him. [/QUOTE] Luthor wins points for the ability to be subtle when needed. [/QUOTE] Can’t fault you there, but it seems this comes down to a style question. And seeing as both men pose similar threats, it seems again to be a wash. One style does not seem intrinsically better. Again I am not seeing to much hard facts leaning in baldies favor. ---
**Author:** ![Quercus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/7ab992/32.png) [@Quercus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quercus)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/24 "2007-08-03T19:44:05Z")
Heck I’ll vote for Luthor, if nobody else will. I’m also comics ignorance, so I’m pretty much going off of the Gene Hackman Luthor and two FF issues I had when I was eight. But my extremely firmly held and deeply grounded opinion is that the key is that Luthor has some subtlety and patience, and particularly short-term humility (there’s really no question that Supes is stronger/faster than Lex, so he’s got to have practice in realistically admitting his own weaknesses), whereas Doom generally doesn’t display a lot of ego-control. I see it going down like this: If there have been no hostilities, Luthor approaches Doom, describing himself as a scientist eager to work under the sponsorship and guidance of the famous genius Doom. Otherwise, Luthor lets Doom destroy a few intentionally crippled Lex-bots, and then surrenders, claiming he recognizes Doom’s superiority, and wishes only to help such a glorious evil enterprise. Either way, Lex’s flattery and Doom’s ego makes Doom take this at face value. Soon Luthor is a loyal DoomCo employee cranking out new fireproof, superstrong, stretch-resistant, invisibility-detecting armor upgrades for Dr. Doom. Until the tragic accident, of course, after which it’s revealed that for subtle financial reasons Luthor now owns a controlling interest in DoomCo Holding Inc., and Lex soon succeeds the former, late, CEO as head of the various world-wide DoomCo enterprises. (Stock ticker changes from DRDM to LEXL). ---
**Author:** ![Askia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@Askia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askia)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/25 "2007-08-03T19:54:46Z")
I legitimately could see this going either way. Smart money’s on Doom, but I would would be far more entertained by Luthor getting one over on the Lord of Latveria, and Doom crawling back to power. “I rename this country… Luthorvia. Peasants, take this tin-man from my sight.” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Hamster\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8edcca/32.png) [@The\_Hamster\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hamster_King)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/26 "2007-08-03T20:35:53Z")
David Bowie. ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/27 "2007-08-03T22:11:03Z")
Who says Cafe Society isn’t highbrow? I think Luthor is better at coldly analyzing a situation and figuring out how to get on top of it. ---
**Author:** ![Interrobang](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/interrobang/32/17463_2.png) [@Interrobang](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Interrobang)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/28 "2007-08-03T22:23:55Z")
Yeah, lemme stop dragging this forum into the gutter long enough to tape up my glasses. It just occurred to me that a variant on this could make an interesting What If/Elseworlds scenario: What if Victor von Doom had gone to college with Lex Luthor instead of Reed Richards? Posit that Luthor replaces Richards in this reality, offering the same correction to Doom’s infernal calculations and being blamed for Doom’s disfigurement. With no Superman or FF in this continuity, Luthor could be the world’s foremost line of defense against a Doom takeover. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/29 "2007-08-03T22:40:50Z")
I think **Quercus** has got the first half right. The second half is where it’s discovered that the Doom Luthor defeated was really a Doombot, and the real Dr. Doom has been off in another dimension, or some damn thing, and comes back to kick Luthor’s ass, reclaim his throne, and restore everything to the status quo. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/30 "2007-08-03T22:54:34Z")
Von Doom wins because he _already_ won supreme power. Then he got bored and gave it up: the sweetness was in the achievement, not the goal. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/31 "2007-08-03T22:57:50Z")
Doom. Even if you can be sure it’s flesh and blood you’re defeating, you can’t be sure it’s not a clone or somebody genetically reconfigured and programmed with Doom’s memories. Doom has magic, economics and science. Lex only has two out of three. Doom can pyschically attack Lex in his dreams. Lex has never shown himself to sleep defended against such things. Doom is willing to take on the appearance of failure- see Triumph And Torment. And frankly, IMO Doom has tons more style. There’s just something to be said for a man who quotes Shakespeare as he rips your limbs off. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2007, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/32 "2007-08-03T23:41:15Z")
[QUOTE=MonkeyMule] Well that is past tense correct? Luthor at one point had Darkseid weaponry, but hell Dr. Doom _had_ The Power Cosmic. I think if we talk about who for a period in time had the most bad-assed powers around it’d wind up a wash. [/quote] Given that for a time Doom had the powers of The Beyonder, I think he wins in any comparison of temporary bad-assery. ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2007, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/33 "2007-08-04T01:51:54Z")
On the face of it, Doom has all the advantages: an entire nation’s-worth of capital at his disposal; raw scientific genius that almost certainly surpasses Luthor’s; not to mention skill at the magical arts, a sphere of influence that Luthor has never bothered to master. Unfortunately, Doom also has [this moment](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e8/DrDoomSquirrels.gif) to his credit, which renders all of the above completely meaningless. If a pack of squirrels can catch Doom off guard long enough to hand him his ass, then it’s safe to say that he’s not beyond Luthor’s reach as an opponent. For all his manifold gifts, at heart Doom seems profoundly insecure with himself. He is unable to acknowledge his own errors, and seems driven by the need to exert absolute control so that his judgement is never challenged or questioned. He surrounds himself with faithful robots; he conceals his scarred face behind a mask to shield his features from mockery and the attacks of vengeful squirrels. Luthor, on the other hand, seems much more comfortable in an uncontrolled environment. Sure, he’s got a battlesuit, but he’s also confident enough in his abilities that he doesn’t feel the need to wear it all the time. Even so, he has never been beaten up by squirrels. In all likelihood, Luthor has never concerned himself with wielding magic because he realizes that its power is fundamentally illusory and transient. No matter how much arcane power you manage to accumulate, it’s all going to count for jack the next time someone decides to beat up the universe. Bottom line: Squirrels don’t dick with Luthor. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2007, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/34 "2007-08-04T03:50:06Z")
Doom actually has a sense of honor and duty. If Doom owes you something, or if he has given his word on something, he will keep it. Luthor does not. There’s your edge. I’ve heard it explained thusly: Doom thinks that the world would be better off with him in charge, and he might be right (or at least more peaceful). ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2007, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/35 "2007-08-04T05:03:15Z")
Luthor has been tested against far more powerful superheroes than Doom has. Doom’s playing in the sandbox with some dude who’s super power is to stretch really far, and Luthor is fighting (and beating the living shit out of) Superman. _The_ Superman. No freakin’ contest here. Doom hasn’t even started the race yet, and Luthor’s already won. ---
**Author:** ![Reepicheep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ed655f/32.png) [@Reepicheep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reepicheep)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2007, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/36 "2007-08-04T05:25:05Z")
[QUOTE=Terrifel] In all likelihood, Luthor has never concerned himself with wielding magic because he realizes that its power is fundamentally illusory and transient. No matter how much arcane power you manage to accumulate, it’s all going to count for jack the next time someone decides to beat up the universe. [/QUOTE] And you are going to explain this to Stephen Strange? ---
**Author:** ![bbs2k](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e495f1/32.png) [@bbs2k](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bbs2k)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2007, 5:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/37 "2007-08-04T05:27:16Z")
Hey guys, you inspired[this thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=431507). Come on in and join the fun. We are all such geeks 😃 . ---
**Author:** ![HubZilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ccd318/32.png) [@HubZilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HubZilla)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2007, 10:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/38 "2007-08-04T10:06:32Z")
Doom wouldn’t have the stomach for it. After all, he was weeping when the World Trade Center came down. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2007, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/39 "2007-08-04T15:28:20Z")
[QUOTE=Mosier] Luthor has been tested against far more powerful superheroes than Doom has. Doom’s playing in the sandbox with some dude who’s super power is to stretch really far, and Luthor is fighting (and beating the living shit out of) Superman. _The_ Superman. No freakin’ contest here. Doom hasn’t even started the race yet, and Luthor’s already won. [/QUOTE] Superman is a thug in pajamas. Reed Richards carries around the Ultimate Nullifier n case Galactus shows up again. 'Nuff said. ---
**Author:** ![Terrifel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c68b51/32.png) [@Terrifel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terrifel)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2007, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210/40 "2007-08-04T16:19:54Z")
[QUOTE=Reepicheep] And you are going to explain this to Stephen Strange? [/QUOTE] Frankly, I think Dr. Strange realizes it already. It’s a safe bet that he doesn’t hang with the Defenders because of their combined charisma. Ultimately, Dr. Strange knows that being the Sorceror Supreme of Earth isn’t as reliable a defense as being surrounded by guys who hit really, really hard. When the chips are down, the unpredictability of magic means that his powers could blip out at any time, when Saturn and Venus are in the house of Capricorn or whatever, and then he’s just a wispy guy in a fey cloak. But chances are that the Hulk will still be able to hit really, really hard. Come to think of it, wasn’t that essentially Strange’s excuse for not using his powers to beam the Hulk into Limbo or turn him into a birdbath during the current \*\*World War Hulk \*\* storyline? “Sure, I could do that; but we all know that it wouldn’t stick. He’d just shrug it off somehow, and then he’d be angrier than ever. And then he’d hit me really, really hard.” That’s Luthor’s reasoning in a nutshell. Sure, Superman may be vulnerable to magic; but magic is fundamentally untrustworthy in such matters. And by all accounts, Superman hits even harder than the Hulk. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lex-luthor-vs-doctor-doom-which-would-be-world-conquerer-reigns-supreme/414210.md?page=3)