# LGBTQ rights going forward? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 9, 2016, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219 "2016-11-09T15:39:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/41 "2016-11-10T20:48:47Z")
The X factor here, compared to times of yore, is the sheer number of average citizens who actually know and like LGBT people, including celebrities. We’ll see, but I’m not as pessimistic as some here. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/42 "2016-11-10T20:49:37Z")
> [@Foggy](#): > > Could we NOT rehash this here? I know your views on this subject. We are NOT going to rehash it here. Is that clear to everybody? ---
**Author:** ![gytalf2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ac91a4/32.png) [@gytalf2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gytalf2000)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/43 "2016-11-10T20:54:45Z")
> [@Jragon](#): > > [The short version is it doesn’t look good](https://thinkprogress.org/trump-pence-transgender-students-aa32ee93cdb7#.hh30f5ggt), Pence has driven home that they’ll work to undo any protections they can, starting with Obama’s executive order protecting trans students. > > We’re talking about a veep who actually believes you can electroshock the gay out of people. Yeah, on this issue at least, Pence is a helluva lot scarier than the Trump. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/44 "2016-11-10T21:04:17Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > There will be a lot of calls for a constitutional amendment outlawing homosexuality. > [@sleestak](#): > > Wanna place a wager on this? Say $100. > > If so, I am game though we need to ensure there are clear rules. Sherrerd would immediately win this one because there are _always_ calls like that, coming from various fringe groups. The concern is that they might get some traction this time. I suggest, though, that a possible silver lining to this is the demonstration of it not being necessary to make overtly anti-LGBTQ statements to get elected as a Republican, though how (or even if) this could translate to a nonTrump candidate is unclear, I admit. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 1:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/45 "2016-11-11T01:14:07Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > And, yes, calls for a rights-restricting amendment to the federal Constitution will be heeded, and such an amendment will be proposed and put into the ratification pipeline. > > And a further ‘yes’: enough states will ratify to make it law. I do not see this as likely. The anger that drove the Trump electorate is not congruent with anti-gay feelings. Trump won the Electoral College, but not by the three quarters of the states needed to pass an Amendment (and he actually lost the popular vote). Republicans do not control two thirds of the Senate (and not all Republicans are anti-LGBTQ). While Pence can be seen proposing and supporting such actions, I doubt that Trump cares that much about such issues, (even if he can focus long enough to take action). ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/46 "2016-11-11T01:15:48Z")
But part of the fear is that Trump will lazily rubber stamp anything the smarter people around him want to do. So it doesn’t really matter what he thinks in the areas he doesn’t care about directly. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/47 "2016-11-11T01:30:58Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > But part of the fear is that Trump will lazily rubber stamp anything the smarter people around him want to do. So it doesn’t really matter what he thinks in the areas he doesn’t care about directly. To push a Constitutional Amendment takes more than a rubber stamp, particularly when there is no evidence that anything resembling a majority of people, (much less two thirds of the Senate and three fourths of the States), are actually behind a Religious Right pipe dream. ---
**Author:** ![DerekMichaels00](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f14d63/32.png) [@DerekMichaels00](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DerekMichaels00)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/48 "2016-11-11T02:13:02Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > You were attacked for calling trans people repulsive and disgusting, not for saying you would never date a trans person. no; what I was talking about is that just as many women say about short men, among their friends and in casual company “ew, short men are gross,” I should be able to say that “trans are disgusting” as much as or as little as they do. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/49 "2016-11-11T03:02:39Z")
> [@DerekMichaels00](#): > > no; what I was talking about is that just as many women say about short men, among their friends and in casual company “ew, short men are gross,” I should be able to say that “trans are disgusting” as much as or as little as they do. You said it here, a public forum, not in private, casual conversations. (I’ve never heard a woman say “ew, short men are gross,” and every short man I know is married on dating, so I suspect that your claim is some sort of imaginary role playing you do in your head.) However, since you made your claim PUBLIC, you have invited others to make PUBLIC comments on your dystopian fantasies. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/50 "2016-11-11T03:06:11Z")
I’m a little baffled by comparing a post on this message board with conversation among “friends and casual company”. I have no friends here and I’m wearing a tuxedo. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/51 "2016-11-11T03:13:59Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > And why do you believe that part of what he said? Why do you believe his Muslim ban or Wall plan? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/52 "2016-11-11T03:30:51Z")
> [@DerekMichaels00](#): > > no; what I was talking about is that just as many women say about short men, among their friends and in casual company “ew, short men are gross,” I should be able to say that “trans are disgusting” as much as or as little as they do. So, let me get this straight. Some people say hurtful things about an aspect of you that you can’t control. And your response to that is to use it as an excuse to say hurtful things about an _entirely unrelated group of people_. This is pretty much exactly like me walking up to you and punching you in the face, and then saying you deserved it because some other, entirely different person once punched _me_ in the face. ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/53 "2016-11-11T04:12:56Z")
> [@Foggy](#): > > I know there are dozens of thread about what happens next, and LGBTQ rights aren’t on the top of most peoples list, but with Trump in the WH & the R’s in control of both houses of Congress, I can’t help but be concern. > > What, if anything, could be reversed or repeal?😕☹ > > Thank You Trump supporter here. And a strong, practicing Christian too (Lutheran, if it matters). LGBTQ rights had better keep increasing. I will vote and work to that end. Heck, that’s not an _end_, that’s a _direction_. I will vote and work for complete equality. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/54 "2016-11-11T04:30:47Z")
> [@Bullitt](#): > > Trump supporter here. And a strong, practicing Christian too (Lutheran, if it matters). LGBTQ rights had better keep increasing. I will vote and work to that end. > > Heck, that’s not an _end_, that’s a _direction_. I will vote and work for complete equality. Out of curiosity, did you vote for any Republicans other than Trump? If so, are your preferred Republican candidates on record as being pro- or anti-LGBTQ rights? ---
**Author:** ![Bullitt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bullitt/32/5725_2.png) [@Bullitt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bullitt)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/55 "2016-11-11T04:35:12Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > Out of curiosity, did you vote for any Republicans other than Trump? No. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 4:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/56 "2016-11-11T04:38:31Z")
If I may be allowed a value judgement: good. Not ideal, but… okay. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/57 "2016-11-11T04:39:07Z")
> [@DerekMichaels00](#): > > no; what I was talking about is that just as many women say about short men, among their friends and in casual company “ew, short men are gross,” I should be able to say that “trans are disgusting” as much as or as little as they do. That’s still bigoted, but it’s also not what you said. Here it is yet again: > [@On the Topic of Transgenders](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-topic-of-transgenders/753980/93): > > I will accept transgenders if: > > 1. They and the pro-trans people accept that trans people do not belong competing in the sport of their transitioned-to gender > 2. That hetero cis men can find trans people repulsive without being called a bigot, and _can say so in public_ > 3. That trans people don’t start trying to pass themselves off as “cis,” or regular people and deceive them into a relationship. I never wanna go to a bar and find out that the girl I’m about to lay down game to isn’t a girl. That’s disgusting. > 4. That given their small proportion of the population, their representation in media reflect that. What’s next: Playboy putting one of them on, to show “solidarity with equality?” Ew, no, never. In your own words, you want to be able to call trans people repulsive **in public** , not in private conversations, without being called a bigot. Ask yourself if calling Jews repulsive in public is bigoted. “Repulsive” and “disgusting” – your bigoted words. If you agree they’re bigoted, why not apologize and try to improve yourself? ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/58 "2016-11-11T21:15:12Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > So, let me get this straight. > Some people say hurtful things about an aspect of you that you can’t control. And your response to that is to use it as an excuse to say hurtful things about an _entirely unrelated group of people_. > This is pretty much exactly like me walking up to you and punching you in the face, and then saying you deserved it because some other, entirely different person once punched _me_ in the face. Isn’t this basically the psychological dynamic that fuels the success authoritarians achieve by scapegoating? As in: _your life is hard; why not stomp a \_\_\_\_ person to death? Even if they haven’t done anything, you’ll feel better by asserting your right to stomp a member of an inferior group._ Rational, it is not. But look at the number of people freaking out about trans people using one restroom other than the other. There’s little or no evidence of any of the Terrible Consequences these folks claim, actually occurring–yet they feel perfectly justified in calling for measures intended to make the lives of trans people more miserable and more precarious. And politicians are enhancing their career prospects by keeping this ginned up: \*It’s a dire danger!!!1!!!–and we’ll all feel better if these terrible Trans people are officially made second-class citizens, via the law … \* As in your example, there’s no good reason for punching the unrelated person; the puncher simply believes he’ll enjoy doing the punching. And maybe he’s been encouraged to believe that. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/59 "2016-11-11T21:29:15Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > To push a Constitutional Amendment takes more than a rubber stamp, particularly when there is no evidence that anything resembling a majority of people, (much less two thirds of the Senate and three fourths of the States), are actually behind a Religious Right pipe dream. Well, it doesn’t really take a majority; Trump will be President despite not getting a majority of the votes of eligible Americans. In thirty-eight states there may well be legislatures (or conventions) that would go for a Hate-and-Resentment-and-Fear-and-Scapegoating Amendment, so to speak. As I’ve said, I don’t think Trump is gung-ho on restricting gay rights, but I do think he needs the cooperation of people who are. They may make it a condition of giving him whatever it is he wants, that he make a strong effort to sell the notion. He would succeed with some. I hope that Pence and his allies will occupy themselves otherwise, but I don’t think that should be taken for granted. They might well prioritize it. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219/60 "2016-11-11T22:24:44Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > Well, it doesn’t really take a majority; Trump will be President despite not getting a majority of the votes of eligible Americans. In thirty-eight states there may well be legislatures (or conventions) that would go for a Hate-and-Resentment-and-Fear-and-Scapegoating Amendment, so to speak. It’s a reach - thirteen states can block it, and if you can’t swing _that_, well… then you really have lost your way, America. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lgbtq-rights-going-forward/771219.md?page=4)