# Liberal Christians: Genealogies in the Bible? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 3, 2013, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-christians-genealogies-in-the-bible/662507 "2013-07-03T03:42:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-christians-genealogies-in-the-bible/662507/121 "2013-07-08T19:08:42Z")
> [@Kable](#): > > OK, so you are basically making your religion up and what’s in the Bible really doesn’t make much difference.. That’s what I think liberal Christians do to. If you think that’s the only possibility, you need to consider more carefully. Furthermore, if you want to engage in discussion with someone, it’s generally a good idea not to dress their views up ridiculously. One possibility is that liberal Christians read the Bible and ask themselves, “What message is God trying to give us here?” I’m not defending Christianity. I think the Bible is a useful historical document, chock full of mythology (like any other historical document, to some extent), biased by the viewpoints of the authors, as well as a collection of oral history, edited at various times to serve different political purposes, and frequently the result of compromise between competing factions. (Two examples: one when the Pentateuch was constructed to dispel factionalism between two groups that had been geographically divided, and another under Constantine to put together a single edition of the Bible for Roman Christians.) But there’s a big difference between intentionally making up a religion, and trying to find the messages in a revered text. Admittedly, there’s as much of Christianity that is conveyed by culture as by gospel. For example, homosexuality is barely mentioned in the Bible, but it’s a huge issue for modern Christians. The New Testament is full of advice to not plan ahead but let God find a way, to help the poor, and to abandon oneself to one’s enemy, but political Christian pundits show no evidence of this advice. But the fact that people use their religion to confirm their prejudices doesn’t mean that they’re just making it all up in broad cloth. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2013, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-christians-genealogies-in-the-bible/662507/122 "2013-07-08T19:24:37Z")
> [@JohnClay](#): > > My reply was based on replies like Czarcasms: > “If you believe that the Bible states that 1 day=a thousand years, then you are still being literal.” > I’m saying that there are problems for anyone that might believe that. the actual quote: > [@Czarcasm](#): > > If the Bible says that a thousand years is as a day to God, and you believe that to be true, _then you are taking the Bible literally_. If the Bible says that(and it does), then if you believe that you are taking the Bible literally. ---
**Author:** ![Kable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kable)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-christians-genealogies-in-the-bible/662507/123 "2013-07-09T02:45:02Z")
> [@JohnClay](#): > > It would be mostly based on the genealogies… using them to create the calendar suggests they take those numbers seriously. Yes, for as much as modern liberal Christians like to talk about liberal existing Christians existing from ages past, as far as I can tell, almost everyone back then was a young earth creationist. Same with Catholics. > **[Dating creation | Abrahamic religions](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dating_creation#Abrahamic_religions)** > > Within the biblical framework and chronology, various dates have been proposed for the date of creation since ancient times, to more recent periods. The Bible begins with the Book of Genesis, in which God creates the Earth, the rest of the Universe, and the Earth's plants and animals, including the first humans, in six days. A second narrative begins with the first human pair, Adam and Eve, and goes on to list many of their descendants, in many cases giving the ages at which they had children and... ---
**Author:** ![Kable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed655f/32.png) [@Kable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kable)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-christians-genealogies-in-the-bible/662507/124 "2013-07-09T02:55:56Z")
> [@Learjeff](#): > > If you think that’s the only possibility, you need to consider more carefully. Furthermore, if you want to engage in discussion with someone, it’s generally a good idea not to dress their views up ridiculously. I’m sorry but I really think that literally believing in a few select miracles, described in a book that believed to be full or errors and fake miracles is ridiculous. If you can explain to me how that isn’t ridiculous, I’m all ears. > [@](#): > > One possibility is that liberal Christians read the Bible and ask themselves, “What message is God trying to give us here?” They might think they do that, but I think they are fooling themselves if they are really just cherry picking the parts they like. > [@](#): > > I’m not defending Christianity. I think the Bible is a useful historical document, chock full of mythology (like any other historical document, to some extent), biased by the viewpoints of the authors, as well as a collection of oral history, edited at various times to serve different political purposes, and frequently the result of compromise between competing factions. (Two examples: one when the Pentateuch was constructed to dispel factionalism between two groups that had been geographically divided, and another under Constantine to put together a single edition of the Bible for Roman Christians.) Great, I agree that all that you say is true. However given the above, can you really take the resurrection of Jesus as credible? > [@](#): > > But there’s a big difference between intentionally making up a religion, and trying to find the messages in a revered text. In theory yes, in practice I think no. > [@](#): > > Admittedly, there’s as much of Christianity that is conveyed by culture as by gospel. For example, homosexuality is barely mentioned in the Bible, but it’s a huge issue for modern Christians. The New Testament is full of advice to not plan ahead but let God find a way, to help the poor, and to abandon oneself to one’s enemy, but political Christian pundits show no evidence of this advice. But the fact that people use their religion to confirm their prejudices doesn’t mean that they’re just making it all up in broad cloth. I think it’s the liberal Christians who are making it all up broad cloth, or just following someone else who is or has. Liberal Christians think homosexuality is barely mentioned (like you say) fundamentalists know the Bible is clear, it says to kill them. The fundamentalists, to me, at least seem to be making an effort to follow the Bible. Unfortunately the Bible is pretty screwed up as a source of morals. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2013, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-christians-genealogies-in-the-bible/662507/125 "2013-07-09T12:10:40Z")
> [@Skammer](#): > > You’re asking about things that are unknowable, irrelevant, or both. The Bible (to quote Hooker) contains all knowledge _necessary for salvation_. It’s not a history book or science text. > > Usher’s work was mid-17th century. > > I’m willing to back off my “generally” assertion and say that early church scholars had a diversity of views (not unlike modern religious scholars). In addition to Clement, Origen, and Augustine, there was Ambrose, Hilary and Philo who all promoted an allegorical understanding of Creation. In any case, your claim that the normal interpretation was literal until modern times is false. It’s a millennia-old argument. Skammer… I would like to know: How do you know the Bible has Devine Inspiration? Didn’t you learn this, was taught it, or you just like to believe it? In my studies I found it was all the word, and work of other human beings. Of course if the 81st in RC version, or 82d In KJ version are true than all are gods (and at best)Jewish men, The psalmist was talking to them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-christians-genealogies-in-the-bible/662507.md?page=6)