# Liberal equivalent to conservative preoccupation with 2nd amendment/paranoia about Obama taking guns **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 10, 2010, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661 "2010-06-10T15:29:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![appleciders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85f322/32.png) [@appleciders](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/appleciders)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/41 "2010-06-10T19:15:18Z")
> [@yorick73](#): > > I don’t really see a difference. Either way you are conscripted for service by your government. Is there any functional difference between service to your country and military support? Certainly- one of them carries the potential of asking me to shoot at someone who’s shooting at me. The other does not. I’d oppose both, but this is a significant difference. ---
**Author:** ![yorick73](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/b5a626/32.png) [@yorick73](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yorick73)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/42 "2010-06-10T19:25:09Z")
> [@appleciders](#): > > Certainly- one of them carries the potential of asking me to shoot at someone who’s shooting at me. The other does not. I’d oppose both, but this is a significant difference. I was making the distiction between national service (whatever that is, and which may involve you getting shot at…depending on where you serve) and military SUPPORT. You know…those people who look at imagery, do intelligence, or cook in the mess halls. ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/43 "2010-06-10T19:36:09Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > I’d say the liberal equivalent is class warfare. I love it when the right talks about class warfare. Especially on this side of the Atlantic. The only thing that can accurately be called class warfare that the US & Canada have seen is a pretty much relentless assault on the working class. When people suggest that workers should no longer just bend over and take it, they are the ones accused of class warfare. There’s been a class war for centuries. It’s about time one side started fighting back. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/44 "2010-06-10T19:39:35Z")
[QUOTE=villa] There’s been a class war for centuries. It’s about time one side started fighting back. [/QUOTE] Dude…put down the buggy whip and back away from the 19th century. Slowly… > [@](#): > > When people suggest that workers should no longer just bend over and take it, they are the ones accused of class warfare. Who are these ‘workers’ you speak of, and who comprises this ‘class’? Am I a ‘worker’? Are you? Is Sam? You speak of them as if they are some separate entity that none of us belong to, so I was curious. -XT ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/45 "2010-06-10T19:43:01Z")
> [@xtisme](#): > > Dude…put down the buggy whip and back away from the 19th century. Slowly… Exactly what I am talking about. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/46 "2010-06-10T19:43:46Z")
> [@CandidGamera](#): > > The left isn’t as homogeneous as the right, and so their irrational fears don’t tend to snowball to quite the same degree. The right is not as homogeneous as it appears. There are paleocons, theocons, neocons, bizcons, libertarians, and they don’t always see eye-to-eye on everything. Since the early 1960s they’ve worked together in a “no enemies to the right” strategy, but cracks are starting to appear in the coalition. Bush’s attempts at immigration reform, for instance, showed up the gulf between his nativist-populist base and his business-interests base. ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/47 "2010-06-10T20:01:44Z")
How about the concept of moving overseas? During the Bush years, lots of liberals were seriously thinking (and posting on internet forums) that they would have no choice but to leave the country permanently. Remember the maps with Canada and the coastal blue states joined together as a new country? It was a joke, of course, but it was rooted in a genuine fear among liberals that the America had gone so far to the right that it was unsalvageable, and another 4 years of Bush would split the USA culturally beyond repair. They cried desperately about the need to “take my country back”. (mmmm…sounds kinda like the teabaggers, heh ? 🙂 ) As for the OP’s request for measurable equivalents…it’s a little hard to do. Yeah some right-winger are buying guns and ammo , but they do that routinely anyway, so a few extra purchases are easy to justify “just in case”. There is no left-wing equivalent. The daily routine doesn’t include many physical purchases that symbolize paranoia. Unlike a gun, buying an extra pair of Berkenstocks or another jar of organic carrot juice doesnt give you that psychological boost that you’ve got an effective means of protection from the hoards of heathen. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/48 "2010-06-10T20:09:16Z")
> [@gitfiddle](#): > > …what is the equivalent preoccupation among liberals that trends up when a Republican president comes into office? Is there any measurable tendency among people who call themselves liberals when a Republican is in office? You mean, aside from poor people being thrown out into the street to starve, our civil liberties cancelled and all life on the planet threatened by rapacious corporate greed\*? \*which mysteriously goes into remission during Democratic administrations. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/49 "2010-06-10T20:45:14Z")
Abortion is the first thing that comes to my mind. The idea that the only thing standing between American women and anti-abortion laws is _Roe_. In reality, overturning Roe would be a disaster for Republicans, but it really wouldn’t alter the landscape all that much since it just throws the issue back to the states. The “I’ll move to Canada” meme is another good one, and something that is not uncommon to have heard on this MB. Another one is that the election was stolen. Or that “they” are going to force creationism to be taught in schools. ---
**Author:** ![gitfiddle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/898d66/32.png) [@gitfiddle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gitfiddle)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/50 "2010-06-10T20:49:18Z")
> [@Jackmannii](#): > > You mean, aside from poor people being thrown out into the street to starve, our civil liberties cancelled and all life on the planet threatened by rapacious corporate greed\*? > \*which mysteriously goes into remission during Democratic administrations. Nope. ---
**Author:** ![gitfiddle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/898d66/32.png) [@gitfiddle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gitfiddle)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2010, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/51 "2010-06-10T20:53:44Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > The “I’ll move to Canada” meme is another good one, and something that is not uncommon to have heard on this MB. This one seems like the most measurable. Doesn’t it seem that if liberals were intent on fleeing Bush to the extent many conservatives say they were, wouldn’t there have been at least one news report over the last decade about a spike in visas, home buying, something? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/52 "2010-06-11T00:55:42Z")
You’ve added an interesting angle to the debate. I don’t say the following to favor one wrong side of the debate over the other wrong side, but it is interesting that the conservative end doesn’t seem to have a place to flee to. If that seems like a slam against conservatives, consider that they may be better at realizing that this country is a better place to be than the alternatives, even when you don’t like the current state of affairs. Anyway, more directly to the OPs question, John Mace mentioned people saying they would move, not people actually doing it. ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661/53 "2010-06-11T12:51:09Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > The right is not as homogeneous as it appears. There are paleocons, theocons, neocons, bizcons, libertarians, and they don’t always see eye-to-eye on everything. Since the early 1960s they’ve worked together in a “no enemies to the right” strategy, but cracks are starting to appear in the coalition. Bush’s attempts at immigration reform, for instance, showed up the gulf between his nativist-populist base and his business-interests base. Amongst the thinking members of the Republican party, those divisions are accurate. But the vast majority of the base are undereducated xenophobic Christians who see no contradiction in agitating for small government and personal freedom at the same time as agitating for bans on gay marriage and against military spending cuts. That base does not have a political philosophy, per se - they just know what they hate and fear. They’re sheep, and when one of them gets spooked, they all stampede. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liberal-equivalent-to-conservative-preoccupation-with-2nd-amendment-paranoia-about-obama-taking-guns/542661.md?page=2)