# Libertarian, bend over... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 4, 2002, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328 "2002-08-04T21:18:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/101 "2002-08-06T16:53:38Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Libertarian \* > \*\*Race card, my ass. Only racists play race cards. \*\* Johnnie Cochran is a racist? huh? ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/102 "2002-08-06T17:09:24Z")
It is as it does. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/103 "2002-08-06T17:23:01Z")
Wait, what? ¿qué? Who let Forest Gump in here? ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/104 "2002-08-06T17:25:39Z")
> [@](#): > > It is as it does. Let me get this perfectly clear. First, I have no real opinin one way or another, I am just a little surprised at your logic, **Lib**. Certain persons have accused you of alluding to your heritage in irrelevant and perhaps insulting ways. The race card, as it were. You claim that you did not “play the race card.” Only racists play the race card. Since you believe that you are not a racist, ergo, no matter _what_ you said, you weren’t playing seven card Injun stud. I would appreciate it if you could confirm or deny that this is your line of reasoning. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/105 "2002-08-06T17:43:33Z")
I guess I’m saying that I didn’t play any race card at all, Maeglin, but that DJ did. At least, that’s how I see it. I’m not offended when I call myself an Injun. As I explained in another thread, when I was a child and someone said my father couldn’t be trusted, I wasn’t offended by their use of the term then either, but by their disrespect for my father. As I see it, a racist makes an issue out of race. Who has done that here? ---
**Author:** ![dalovindj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/65b543/32.png) [@dalovindj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalovindj)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/106 "2002-08-06T17:56:36Z")
Imply that it aint funny all you want. Just _try_ not to imagine **Lib** sucking on different things as the rest of your day plays out. It’s memetic engineering. First you’ll think of a door knob, and **Lib** sucking one. Then you’ll flash to my face. Still not shocked. What if he sucked the fire extinguisher!!! DJ looks at his watch. Damn. What if he sucked on . . . Go ahead try to fight it. With the attention you’ve drawn to it, I’m betting most people will at least spend a moment or two, if not more, imagining **Lib** sucking various household appliances. It makes me laugh, anyway. Oh and Lib, my fascination was with the mechanics of the way the board handled complaints, not with another’s personal pain. But kill those strawmen all you like. Everybody who assumed you meant what you said is absolutely crazy (thanks for the psychological defense **RTFirefly** ) and not worthy of your time. Got it. > [@](#): > > . . .and they shall answer and say, 'Our hands did not shed this blood, nor did our eyes see it. . . . . DaLovin’ Dj ---
**Author:** ![Maeglin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8baadc/32.png) [@Maeglin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maeglin)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/107 "2002-08-06T18:04:43Z")
All right, just checking. It just _sounded_ like you were defining both racism and the “race card” by your perceptions of your own actions. ---
**Author:** ![Soul\_Brother\_Number\_Two](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/soul_brother_number_two/32/3515_2.png) [@Soul\_Brother\_Number\_Two](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soul_Brother_Number_Two)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/108 "2002-08-06T18:09:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Libertarian \* > \*\*a wonderful woman being dragged through hell \*\* That’s fuckin rich. Careful of your back, Lib baby, lifting all that hyperbole. Take five, brave warrior. (Note: I’m not sure that I can claim any of my ancestors as brave warriors as they are primarily Italian. I slay me.) ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/109 "2002-08-06T18:22:55Z")
> [@](#): > > It makes me laugh, anyway. The defense rests. ---
**Author:** ![dalovindj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/65b543/32.png) [@dalovindj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalovindj)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/110 "2002-08-06T18:37:31Z")
> [@](#): > > I’m not offended when I call myself an Injun. Neither am I. I’m offended when you imply that people are attacking you because of your heritage when **no one is attacking you because of your heritage**. I wouldn’t call this racism. I would call it intellectual dishonest mostly. I was calling it “the race card” because that is what I thought the term meant. You seem to have a different definition of the phrase, which I have never run across until now. I think that hating people because of their race, and claiming you are being attacked because of your race when you are not are 2 very different things. One is hatred, the other is self-pity (undeserved). So let’s see: Only racists play race cards. You say I (:_cough_: pot/kettle) played the race card. Therefore, you say I am a racist. Maybe you mean to imply that I too am attacking you because of your race here. Wow, man. You sure have a persecution complex the size of Mt. Rushmore. The therapy comment returns to mind. Hmmm. Perhaps you should take your own advice on that count. > [@](#): > > Depression creates illusions. > > It causes us to feel weak and ineffectual. It creates a “persecution complex” where we begin to believe that others are out to get us. It makes us feel unwanted. This does not mean though, that they are gunning for us. But our depression makes us feel as if we are victims. Good luck you with that problem. 5000 DaLovin’ Dj ---
**Author:** ![Squish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8797f3/32.png) [@Squish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squish)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/111 "2002-08-06T20:12:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dalovindj \* > **I’m offended when you imply that people are attacking you because of your heritage when no one is attacking you because of your heritage.** Which is, I feel I need to repeat again, what prompted the OP. To say: [You’re too busy piling on me now. “There’s the Injun that disagrees with us! Get him!”](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?s=&postid=2331366&highlight=Injun#post2331366) was unnecessary, insulting to the posters in that thread, and had _**absolutely nothing to add to the defense of TubaDiva**_. > [@](#): > > **I think that hating people because of their race, and claiming you are being attacked because of your race when you are not are 2 very different things. One is hatred, the other is self-pity (undeserved).** No shit. And let’s deal with this homophobic nonsense right now. “Eat me!” “Fuck you!” “Suck my dick!” and their like are all common insults which have nothing whatsoever to do with the insultee’s sexual orientation. If I, as a bisexual woman, tell another woman, “Oh, eat me!” that is certainly not an invitation. :rolleyes: **Libertarian** : As far as your feeble attempt to dismiss your original comment as a joke akin to one black person calling another black person “nigger”, you weren’t addressing a group comprised solely of other Indians; you were addressing a diverse group of people. Your condescension, arrogance, and pathetic “I’m a victim!” stance in both that thread and this one disgust me. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/112 "2002-08-06T21:44:04Z")
Well, I’m glad we got this all straightened out. You, the ass-ramming bisexual woman, are disgusted and DJ, the door-knob-sucking rubber necker, is appalled. I am the most worthless human being who ever lived. Having established all that, surely we can all die happy now. ---
**Author:** ![Rockford](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ac8455/32.png) [@Rockford](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rockford)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/113 "2002-08-06T22:02:45Z")
_Libertarian-_ \*\* > [@](#): > > I am the most worthless human being who ever lived. Having established all that, surely we can all die happy now. \*\* Don’t be too hard on yourself Lib, I think it’s just just your “character weakness.” 😃 [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=100066](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=100066) ---
**Author:** ![Ferrous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Ferrous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferrous)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/114 "2002-08-06T22:09:06Z")
Ooh, bad form! What’s the point of dredging up ugly old shit like that? ---
**Author:** ![Squish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/8797f3/32.png) [@Squish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squish)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/115 "2002-08-06T22:28:17Z")
Because it gives an insight into **Libertarian’s** character? Because it shows that his current behaviour is not a momentary lapse, but a repeated pattern? > [@](#): > > **You, the ass-ramming bisexual woman, are disgusted and DJ, the door-knob-sucking rubber necker, is appalled. I am the most worthless human being who ever lived. Having established all that, surely we can all die happy now.** Shall I pull your lame tricks and accuse you of homophobia now? ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/116 "2002-08-06T23:12:59Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Libertarian \* > \*\* Where is someone who can look out their penthouse window and see Harlem coming from? \*\* Riverside Drive in the 80’s? ::d&r:: ---
**Author:** ![manhattan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manhattan/32/7_2.png) [@manhattan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/manhattan)\ **Post date:** [August 6, 2002, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/117 "2002-08-06T23:43:14Z")
Crap. I swear on a stack that this thread looked, like, two pages shorter when I posted that. Sorry about that. Please ignore my drive-by, or reserve it for future use. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2002, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/118 "2002-08-07T00:17:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Libertarian \* > \*\*Well, I’m glad we got this all straightened out. > > You, the ass-ramming bisexual woman, are disgusted and DJ, the door-knob-sucking rubber necker, is appalled. I am the most worthless human being who ever lived. Having established all that, surely we can all die happy now. \*\* Well, frankly, Lib. I, the non-ass-ramming, non door-knob-sucking, Libertarian voting (though god alone knows why sometimes), part cherokee, part african, mostly caucasian, jewish, male, homeowner and with luck King of mid-atlantic Straight Dope hospitality thinks you were being an ass in the other thread to. Your defense of ‘just a joke, folks!’ simply doesn’t ring true. I think you were locked in some sort of world where antagonizing the others fed some need of yours. I won’t attempt to say why but that was certainly my read on it. I think you should sit back and think long and hard on it. Examine why that thread spiraled in the way it did and in what way you contributed to its escalation. Now I think it would probably be a good idea to let this one die. I don’t see anything positive coming out of it from here on out. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Ace\_of\_Swords](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@The\_Ace\_of\_Swords](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ace_of_Swords)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2002, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/119 "2002-08-07T02:12:13Z")
Thanks for the link, **Rockford**. Major insight. **Lib** : I honestly don’t know what to say to you that the others, people whose opinions you fully appreciate, have already said. I value your insight and posting ability and hope to see you again here ina healthier perspective, and back here if you feel up to it. Keep in mind, it’s a gorgeous night, the kind of night that served as entertainment and community, in such times before these computers existed. And I’m going out in it to find some absinthe and call these girls I met. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [August 7, 2002, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328/120 "2002-08-07T09:49:16Z")
Ah. My brother. And the SDMB awards thing. Funny thing is, back during that time, people had me convinced that I had done something wrong. Oh, I don’t mean going overboard with enthusiasm. I admit that I did that. But I raised my brother as an example of how all the whiny brats complaining about others winning an award and how it would make some people feel bad ought to look at things. In a community — er, an _adult_ community — people ought to share joy in one another’s achievements. I think that envy of others’ achievements is a character weakness. I let the very ones who didn’t care squat about me get to me. That won’t happen again. I’m proud of conceiving the idea for an SDMB posting award academy. I’m also proud of what I did about Fred Phelps, so you can dig that one up, too. I came to realize some time ago the only way to make some of you like me is to behave like a twelve-year-old, make fun of the object of people’s faith, be invisible, and go along with the crowd. Not gonna happen, folks. I’ve learned not to care whether people I’ve never heard of like me. You think I did something wrong. I disagree. You’ve dug up a past incident in order to hurt me, but it doesn’t hurt. And I’m not going to reciprocate by even attempting to do the same. You’ve already decided that, _because_ you hate me, _whatever_ I do will be unacceptable to you. If you think that I’ll jump through your hoops just so you can broadside me later with something from two years ago, you’ve got another think coming. If I call you a “faggot”, then it cannot possibly be construed as a joke. But if Esprix calls himself that, then it can (and must). Same same for me. When I call myself an Injun, it’s a joke. What you really don’t like is that I implied that _other people_ were calling me an Injun and yet, the funny thing is, that you’ve crucified your own protest by calling me much worse things since then. And you continue this farce of “Oh, we would never call you an Injun!” while at the same time trying to stab me in the heart with every available tool. With apologies to Ace, it’s a beautiful morning, and I look forward to the day. It occurs to me right at this moment that such things as this thread are nothing more than another part of my moral journey — to learn to love people like you. My only regret is in reciprocating your jabs with jabs of my own. That is what needs to cease at this point. None of you are bad people. And I won’t fight you anymore. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-bend-over/122328.md?page=7)