# Libertarian is STILL an idiot. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 8, 2004, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174 "2004-07-08T21:37:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/1 "2004-07-08T21:37:05Z")
I know I’ve said regrettable things on this board, and that my credibility has suffered for them. I realize that I’m gonna have to be more careful about how I espress myself–for a long time–before that credibility starts to repair itself. But **Libertarian** , whose credibility also has its ups and downs, recently changed his name to **Liberal**. Now, if he’d taken this opportunity, this cleaning of the slate, to turn over a new leaf and post with an eye toward his damaged credibility–if he’d mended his ways–I’d give him a break (even though I would do it differently; I would just mend my ways and let my behavior speak for itself). But he’s just gone further round the bend; \*\*Liberal \*\* has [less credibility](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=265238) than \*\*Libertarian \*\* had, in my view. His stated reason for taking as a username the name of political orientation that is 180 degrees from his own is that he’s going by the archaic definition of the word. In other words, he’s suggesting that utterly ignoring, without qualification, a couple hundred years (or whatever) of linguistic evolution is irrelevant. That though he’s communicating with a word that is extremely well known by just about everybody on these boards by its modern definition, but that he means it to carry its archaic and rarely used–except when qualified by context–definition, that this is supposed to communicate something clearly. When clearly, it only muddies the waters and adds confusion to any debate he drops into. Nonetheless, and even though he has chosen a username that implies he’s very upfront about his political views, he continues to feign surprise that people are confused. Now, not that I would ever have anything to say about someone’s username–there are a few dopers whose usernames are so, um, disturbing, or childish, or whatever, that I simply don’t engage them–but by choosing the name he did, \*he’s \* made it an issue. Since his subsequent behavior has left me with the impression that he’s dishonestly trying to whitewash his past–and not with an eye toward better behavior in the future–I, personally, will refer to him as \*\*Liberal \*\* everywhere else on these boards, but will continue to refer to him as \*\*Libertarian \*\* in Pit threads. I refuse to support his whitewashing. Mostly because he’s an asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/2 "2004-07-08T22:01:25Z")
Let he who is not an asshole cast the first fart…or something. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/3 "2004-07-08T22:07:33Z")
People who live in glass houses shouldn’t throw parties! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/4 "2004-07-08T22:10:24Z")
> [@Jeff Olsen](#): > > Let he who is not an asshole cast the first fart…or something. Well he who is _without_ an asshole certainly won’t. ---
**Author:** ![Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac8455/32.png) [@Bippy\_the\_Beardless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bippy_the_Beardless)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/5 "2004-07-08T22:13:29Z")
Is there a plonk in your eye, or are you just happy to see me? ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/6 "2004-07-08T22:26:53Z")
Who are you to tell **Liberal** what he can and can’t describe himself as? ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/7 "2004-07-08T22:28:52Z")
I thought I’d acknowledged that I myself have behaved like an asshole from time to time; thought I’d covered that. So, no one has anything to say about **Lib**? only about me? Huh. He gets pretty regularly slammed in the threads he participates in, so I guess that surprises me a little. In any case, I’ve been pitted myself from time to time, so it seems to me that if this is gonna be exclusively a \*\*lissener \*\* pile on, you should feel free to start a thread with that purpose. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/8 "2004-07-08T22:31:04Z")
> [@SPOOFE](#): > > Who are you to tell **Liberal** what he can and can’t describe himself as? Hm. Thought I’d covered that too; also don’t recall telling to do anything in particular, except not be an asshole. ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/9 "2004-07-08T22:32:28Z")
So you were starting a thread trying to get some sort of pile on? And you’re surprised it backfired? Doesn’t it always? Frankly, I have no use for either one of you. ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/10 "2004-07-08T22:33:22Z")
I dunno. I’m pretty disappointed by this thread. I was expecting something a little more meaty. But just bitching about his username? Please. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/11 "2004-07-08T22:36:04Z")
> [@yosemite](#): > > I dunno. I’m pretty disappointed by this thread. I was expecting something a little more meaty. But just bitching about his username? Please. Sorry I gave that impression. I was just using his username as an example of his aggressive dishonesty, and how it emphasized his determined jerkness. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/12 "2004-07-08T22:38:49Z")
Homer: I don’t care if Flanders _is_ the nicest guy in the world, he’s a jerk. End of story. Of course in this case it’s two Homers. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/13 "2004-07-08T22:39:48Z")
> [@Neurotik](#): > > So you were starting a thread trying to get some sort of pile on? Not sure what gave that impression, unless you think any pitting is presumed to be a pile on. Unless \*pile on \* equals _venting_. ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/14 "2004-07-08T22:54:03Z")
😕 And what does it make us libertines? :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Neurotik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/91b2a8/32.png) [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/15 "2004-07-08T23:19:50Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > Not sure what gave that impression, unless you think any pitting is presumed to be a pile on. Unless \*pile on \* equals _venting_. This did: > [@](#): > > So, no one has anything to say about Lib? only about me? Huh. He gets pretty regularly slammed in the threads he participates in, so I guess that surprises me a little. Sounds to me like you were counting on **Lib’s** reputation to cause people to come in and jump on him. Unless I’m misunderstanding what you meant there. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/16 "2004-07-08T23:25:11Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > but by choosing the name he did, \*he’s \* made it an issue. The only one I’ve ever seen make it an issue is **YOU**. I’d suggest dealing with actual things he has said, rather than what he chooses to call himself. **Lib** is someone who delights in the linguistic arcana. Changing his name to \*\*Liberal \*\* seems right up his alley. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/17 "2004-07-08T23:26:31Z")
> [@Neurotik](#): > > This did: > > Sounds to me like you were counting on **Lib’s** reputation to cause people to come in and jump on him. > > Unless I’m misunderstanding what you meant there. What I meant was that it didn’t make much sense to me that 100% of the people who popped into this thread merely called the OP names. I’d have assumed, by my impression of his reputation, that someone would have responded to the content of the OP, rather than ignoring it to jump on me. Although, since that’s all they’re doing–no one has defended Lib, just called me names–I’ll withdraw for now. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/18 "2004-07-08T23:27:49Z")
> [@John Mace](#): > > The only one I’ve ever seen make it an issue is **YOU**. > > I’d suggest dealing with actual things he has said, rather than what he chooses to call himself. **Lib** is someone who delights in the linguistic arcana. Changing his name to \*\*Liberal \*\* seems right up his alley. I have dealt with things he said, and have said the mere FACT that he changed his name to Liberal is not the issue. I covered that in the OP. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/19 "2004-07-08T23:28:03Z")
Personally, I think both sides of this topic were already expressed quite well in the [pin the ad on the hominem thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=264062&page=1&pp=50&highlight=hominem), ergo this one is superfluous. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2004, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174/20 "2004-07-08T23:29:50Z")
> [@Jeff Olsen](#): > > Personally, I think both sides of this topic were already expressed quite well in the [pin the ad on the hominem thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=264062&page=1&pp=50&highlight=hominem), ergo this one is superfluous. That thread was started with a different intention; the Lib hijack was just that, a hijack. Plenty of threads have spawned offshoots, so I don’t “superfluous” is exactly accurate. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libertarian-is-still-an-idiot/254174.md?page=2)