# Libya too?! **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 16, 2011, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595 "2011-02-16T16:37:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 39
**Author:** ![wmfellows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c2a13f/32.png) [@wmfellows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wmfellows)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/761 "2011-03-19T17:47:52Z")
French warplanes already engaged over Benghazi, says BBC and France 24. Wonder if this will change the hyper-American centric SDMB discussions. Probably not. (as per the purported Qs, I am always amazed at the gullibility here). ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/762 "2011-03-19T18:06:36Z")
French planes have destroyed several tanks. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/763 "2011-03-19T18:31:13Z")
The sword of venegence has been unleashed upon Gaddafi, 😃 ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/764 "2011-03-19T18:39:55Z")
Merkel stated that though Germany won’t intervene directly, she will send aircrafts in Afghanistan to replace US planes used in Libya. Kadhafi himself would be hidden in a bunker situated under a civilian building (no clue how the channel I was watching would learn that, but they announced it as a fact, not as an hypothesis). ETA : They showed a pro-Kadhafi crowd assembled on a Libyan military airfield (Tripoli, I think) to prevent attacks. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/765 "2011-03-19T18:47:14Z")
> [@](#): > > ETA : They showed a pro-Kadhafi crowd assembled on a Libyan military airfield (Tripoli, I think) to prevent attacks. LOL. They are doing the French airmen quite a favour I suppose. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/766 "2011-03-19T18:49:07Z")
[QUOTE=wmfellows] Wonder if this will change the hyper-American centric SDMB discussions. Probably not. [/QUOTE] In what way? Because the US isn’t leaping to the fore, blades drawn and a 'yippeeekaya mother fucker! on our collective lips? I’m perfectly good with France taking the lead, along with the UK and Canada. I think they won’t have any trouble handling it without us, if it comes to that. -XT ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/767 "2011-03-19T19:02:02Z")
Something else that was announced : the idea would be limited but gradual attacks intended mostly for their psychological effect, the point being apparently to demoralize the units faithful to Kadhafi (and I suppose have them switch side or give up, or leave in the case of mercenaries), rather than their undiscriminated destruction. Also, preventing Khadhafi’s troop from entering Benghazi (because otherwise warplanes would have to launch attacks within the city, with obviously “collateral” damages. That would explain this almost symbolical attack (a handful of planes were engaged against tanks shelling Benghazi). It apparently followed informations according to which the situation was becoming more dificult in Benghazi, informations that would have convinced some representatives at the summit (Merkel was named) to give the green light for the beginning of the operations. Countries that would be involved : UK, France, USA, Canada, Norway, Denmark, Belgium and Spain. No mentions of Arab countries at this point. ---
**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/768 "2011-03-19T19:06:39Z")
Some info here: [http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/20/world/africa/20libya.html?\_r=1&hp](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/20/world/africa/20libya.html?_r=1&hp) > [@](#): > > While Arab representatives came, following through on the Arab League’s call for a no-fly zone in Libya, there were no African leaders, and the head of the African Union, Jean Ping, did not attend, instead going to Mauritania for a meeting with African leaders tasked with mediating a peaceful end to the Libyan crisis. I’m sure that’ll work. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/769 "2011-03-19T19:10:46Z")
Lebanon would have played a key role in convincing Arab countries to support the resolution and the intervention. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/770 "2011-03-19T19:15:23Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > Countries that would be involved : UK, France, USA, Canada, Norway, Denmark, Belgium and Spain. No mentions of Arab countries at this point. I see reports of UAE planes preparing for action right now, with other Arab forces possibly to follow. > [@Liz Sly and Sudarsan Raghavan / Baltimore Sun](#): > > U.S. ships in the Mediterranean were preparing to bombard Libya’s air defenses and runways to clear the way for European and Arab forces to establish a no-fly zone throughout the country, according to U.S. and European officials. Fighter aircraft from France, Britain and the United Arab Emirates converged on bases in and around Italy to begin operations over Libya under the command and control of the United States at its naval base in Naples. > [@Karen J. DeYoung / Washington Post](#): > > Obama made clear to the lawmakers he gathered for a White House briefing that there were no initial plans to use U.S. aircraft. > … > Officials said that Qatar, Jordan and Saudi Arabia were considering sending aircraft. > … > The UAE has one of the world’s most sophisticated air forces, including top-line U.S. F-16s and upgraded French Mirages. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/771 "2011-03-19T19:26:17Z")
I can’t say I’m really happy to see exemplary countries such as Qatar and Saudi Arabia :rolleyes: involved in this “fight for freedom” I’d have prefered the recently revolted Tunisia and Egypt, along with, say, Lebanon and Jordan (yes, I noticed Jordan was in) Turkey would have been a plus, too. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/772 "2011-03-19T19:38:28Z")
> [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](#): > > LOL. They are doing the French airmen quite a favour I suppose. 😉 I meant civilians. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/773 "2011-03-19T20:29:13Z")
The USA and the UK launched 110 cruise missiles against Libya. Explosions have been heard near Tripoli. Seemingly, these attacks are against anti-air assets. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/774 "2011-03-19T21:25:16Z")
Obama and Clinton have played a blinder here, I think. A military engagement that the US is not lead on (at least not publically - but there’s a US Admiral in charge of the Nato forces) and letting France do the initial stuff. I can hardly imagine how hot the diplomatic phones have been ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/775 "2011-03-19T21:34:25Z")
> [@Baron\_Greenback](#): > > Obama and Clinton have played a blinder here, I think. > [@](#): > > play a blinder (British informal) > to perform with a lot of skill, especially when you are playing sport I was mildly critical of Obama for passivity a little while back, but perhaps he was just interested in _not_ receiving credit, so to speak. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/776 "2011-03-19T21:44:42Z")
> [@spark240](#): > > I was mildly critical of Obama for passivity a little while back, but perhaps he was just interested in _not_ receiving credit, so to speak. Yes, this has been a very skilful bit of work. ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/777 "2011-03-19T21:49:12Z")
Also, thanks for defining my terms **spark240**. It’s never easy to know what other English speakers recognise ---
**Author:** ![Gozu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gozu/32/6615_2.png) [@Gozu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gozu)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/778 "2011-03-19T22:09:01Z")
Apparently, Sarkozy decided to start and assumed (correctly) that Britain and the U.S wouldn’t be far behind. That’ll win France many friends in Lybia. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/779 "2011-03-19T22:11:25Z")
> [@Commissar](#): > > Firstly, if the Libyans need to have a drawn-out guerrilla war, then let them have it. It’s their call, and the resolution needs to be theirs as well. Peace cannot be imposed from the outside; it must rise up on the inside. Consider Afghanistan for a moment. The outside world has been trying to pacify it for centuries, and how is that working out? Let people forge their own destinies; they are sentient beings, not your playthings. The difference is that this is a guerrilla war that can be avoided. If Gaddafi does not fall, there will be an insurgency. If Gaddafi falls, there will be no insurgency. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2011, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595/780 "2011-03-19T22:16:51Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > Countries that would be involved : UK, France, USA, Canada, Norway, Denmark, Belgium and Spain. No mentions of Arab countries at this point. According to this [Wiki article,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Libyan_no-fly_zone#Enforcement) Qatar and the UAE are participating, and Jordan and SA might. (None of these countries have serious ongoing trouble with their own protesters. Don’t look for Yemen or Bahrain or Algeria to jump in.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595.md?page=38) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/libya-too/571595.md?page=40)