# Lieberman Takes the Moral High Ground **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 7, 2004, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042 "2004-05-07T17:45:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Otters\_We\_Love](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3da27b/32.png) [@Otters\_We\_Love](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otters_We_Love)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2004, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/41 "2004-05-07T20:46:56Z")
A better presentation would have been them dressing in suit and tie; totally conservative. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2004, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/42 "2004-05-07T20:53:56Z")
Yeah, like when Zappa got invited to testify on the Parents Music Resource Center thing. Short hair, trimmed mustache, nice suit and tie. THAT’s how you steal a show. Look normal and have well-expressed beliefs. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2004, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/43 "2004-05-07T21:01:10Z")
> [@Jonathan Chance](#): > > Yeah, like when Zappa got invited to testify on the Parents Music Resource Center thing. Short hair, trimmed mustache, nice suit and tie. > > THAT’s how you steal a show. Look normal and have well-expressed beliefs. yea, as opposed to the guy from Twisted Sister **his** 10 second sound bite served to underscore how important it was to protect the children from _people like him_. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2004, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/44 "2004-05-07T21:33:26Z")
Bolding mine > [@wring](#): > > Specific amount of time is irrelevant; none of your list rattles their cages. think - there were news stories about the prison abuses back in January and **nobody** was talking - until photos appear on 60 minutes (which, as opposed to news websites and on TV, do more in depth stories) \*\*that rattled their cages. this two guys didn’t. \*\* Neither did those huge _organized_ anti-war protests, we’re still at war ain’t we? :rolleyes: The only way to “rattle their cages” is to corner these guys like rats with irrefutable evidence. So we should drop all other forms of protest and run around sleuthing, 60 minutes style, because it’s the most effective way to accomplish our goal. ---
**Author:** ![Olentzero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/90ced4/32.png) [@Olentzero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Olentzero)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2004, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/45 "2004-05-07T22:09:49Z")
> [@wring](#): > > nope sorry, 10 second news footage of someone being escorted out of the hearings does **not** rattle their cages. Shouting at him does. Did you even watch that clip? Rumsfeld’s cage was rattled. **Johnathan Chance** - that depends. Did lobbyists end the Vietnam War? ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2004, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/46 "2004-05-07T22:18:25Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > Bolding mine > > Neither did those huge _organized_ anti-war protests, we’re still at war ain’t we? :rolleyes: > > The only way to “rattle their cages” is to corner these guys like rats with irrefutable evidence. So we should drop all other forms of protest and run around sleuthing, 60 minutes style, because it’s the most effective way to accomplish our goal. Sequence: me - protest smart, not in such a way to be easily dismissed. ie a few seconds disrupting a congressional hearing you: mentioned on web news sources, ‘we’re talking about it’. me: geez, web news sources also had stories about the prison abuses in January, that wasn’t sufficient to rattle their cages (ie, simply getting air play on a news source wasn’t enough). you : well neither did the organized anti war protests. now we’re up to the present, right? apparently from this sequence you seem to understand that a few seconds air play 'cause two guys disrupted the congressional hearings is, well, futile. except of course, you were arguing that it was a good idea, 'cause it got the message out there. Irrefutable evidence doesn’t seem to help, either (remember the WoMD that weren’t there after we had sattelite photos “see, here they are and here and here”?) I’m suggesting to refrain from actions that can easily be dismissed (by both the neocons and the middle of the roaders) as ‘just another loony leftist that won’t be happy until we’re all singing kumbaya around a camp fire’. there’s better use for our resources and we play into their hands that way. and yes, well organized protests, even held miles away (make that part of the story dammit) with centered, rational people making speeches (ie don’t tell Michael Moore where we’re meeting - he’s polarizing at best), will do more for acheiving the goal of “beat the Bushes for a better America”. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2004, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/47 "2004-05-07T22:30:59Z")
> [@Olentzero](#): > > Shouting at him does. Did you even watch that clip? Rumsfeld’s cage was rattled. him looking uncomfortable /= rattled. He’s been shouted at for months. Hell, he looked uncomfortable during the Matt LAuer interview on Today show. and still was the same smug arrogant son of a bitch at his next news conference. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2004, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/48 "2004-05-07T22:54:45Z")
> [@Jonathan Chance](#): > > I want Bush out so bad I can taste it. I’d be scared to know what this tastes like, except for the fact that I’ve got a heaping plate of it myself. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2004, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/49 "2004-05-07T23:30:38Z")
> [@MrTuffPaws](#): > > Sorry for the bluntness, but come on. Do you really expect a conservative Jew to apologize to an Arab, any Arab? Do you mean conservative as in politically or do you mean the Conservative sect of Judaism? Being rather liberal, I do not fit the first. I do fit the second. I hereby apologize for the inexcusable torture of Iraqis by some members of our armed forces. I sincerely hope that these incidents are not repeated and that the soldiers responsible are severely punished. Of course, AFAIK Iraq isn’t actually an Arab country. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/50 "2004-05-08T00:07:00Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > Of course, AFAIK Iraq isn’t actually an Arab country. Iraq is. Iran isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/51 "2004-05-08T00:10:55Z")
Ah, yes. “Fightin’ Joe” Lieberman. At last, a ray of sunshine from the 2000 election debacle: Joe Lieberman isn’t one coronary away from being President. (“Worse than Bush?” Look, don’t _noodge_, ok?) ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/52 "2004-05-08T00:25:22Z")
**luc** Don’t even joke about [Presidential Succession](http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0101032.html) Read 'em and weep. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/53 "2004-05-08T00:26:50Z")
**Jayjay** Oops. ---
**Author:** ![Senggum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@Senggum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senggum)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/54 "2004-05-08T00:30:31Z")
> [@JuanitaTech](#): > > Does _anyone_ actually like Joe Lieberman? I like Joe Liberman. At least he has the kahunas to say what is on his mind and not politicize the issue. Who, in fact, did apologize to us for the Americans who had to jump out of the 104th floor of the WTC on 9/11/2001 or murdered, burned, dragged and hung Americans from a bridge in Fallujah, … :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Tobio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e68b1a/32.png) [@Tobio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tobio)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/55 "2004-05-08T00:47:40Z")
> [@Senggüm](#): > > I like Joe Liberman. At least he has the kahunas to say what is on his mind and not politicize the issue. Who, in fact, did apologize to us for the Americans who had to jump out of the 104th floor of the WTC on 9/11/2001 or murdered, burned, dragged and hung Americans from a bridge in Fallujah, … :smack: You’re joking, right? Do unto others as you would have them do unto you, two wrongs don’t make a right… is any of this getting through yopur thick fucking skull? ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/56 "2004-05-08T00:51:56Z")
> [@Olentzero](#): > > Shouting at him does. Did you even watch that clip? Rumsfeld’s cage was rattled. > > **Johnathan Chance** - that depends. Did lobbyists end the Vietnam War? I think my response to that would be that a change in voting patterns brought about by televised war brought about the end of the war. Do I agree that mass movements are important? Of course (other than my Washington DC based disapproval for people clogging up the metro and such)(fortunately not an issue for me anymore). Large scale movements are clearly an indicator of group passion and self-identification to a cause. But a few morons throwing a tantrum is hardly a mass movement. And is more likely to be counterproductive than productive. Look at the biggest mass movements of the last half century. The movement against the war and the civil rights movement. In both cases while there was motion there wasn’t governmental action until the Joe Blows of the world saw live in their living room people getting hit with fire houses and live reports from the war. Until you can convince the consciences of the soi-disant average man that something needs to be done all the disruptions in the world lead Joe Blow to think that those protestors are ‘commies’ or ‘unamerican’ instead of people with a worthwhile cause. So all ‘blue shirt’ guy did is damage his cause a very small bit and get him some claps on the back from his buddies later on. Or let me phrase it this way: **He wasn’t even important enough to arrest even though he’d clearly done something for which he could be arrested.** The powers that be saw no threat to their positions in him, merely a minor inconvenience. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/57 "2004-05-08T00:52:58Z")
> [@Senggüm](#): > > …At least he has the kahunas… Pretty sure you mean _cojones_. Wrong anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/58 "2004-05-08T00:55:54Z")
I dunno, man. I had visions of Fightin’ Joe hanging ten with the kahunas at Maui. Try **that** image on for size. Especially picture him in a set of flowery bermudas with a long board and a pineapple drink. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/59 "2004-05-08T01:15:59Z")
> [@Jonathan Chance](#): > > I dunno, man. I had visions of Fightin’ Joe hanging ten with the kahunas at Maui. > > Try **that** image on for size. Especially picture him in a set of flowery bermudas with a long board and a pineapple drink. Actually, I’ve always thought of Joe as a brain-dead surfer. Funny you would bring it up. He always struck me as a guy who’s reliving a bad acid-trip much of the time. ---
**Author:** ![Senggum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@Senggum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senggum)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2004, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042/60 "2004-05-08T01:17:01Z")
> [@Tobio](#): > > You’re joking, right? > Do unto others as you would have them do unto you, two wrongs don’t make a right… is any of this getting through yopur thick fucking skull? Huh? Two wrongs? Did we murder or torture any of those shown in the photos? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lieberman-takes-the-moral-high-ground/244042.md?page=4)