# Life on Earth has Just Changed - The North Atlantic Current is Gone **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 21, 2010, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507 "2010-09-21T04:03:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Libre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85e7bf/32.png) [@Libre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Libre)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/1 "2010-09-21T04:03:27Z")
Can anyone make a reasonably convincing argument against this article: [http://www.infiniteunknown.net/2010/09/14/life-on-this-earth-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/](http://www.infiniteunknown.net/2010/09/14/life-on-this-earth-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/) For what it’s worth, I located these previous gulf stream velocity images: [http://rads.tudelft.nl/gulfstream/gif/](http://rads.tudelft.nl/gulfstream/gif/) Thanks, Libre ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/2 "2010-09-21T04:25:31Z")
> [@](#): > > The entire ‘river of warm water’ that flows from the Caribbean to the edges of Western Europe is dying due to the Corexit that the Obama Administration allowed BP to use to hide the scale of the BP Deepwater Horizon Oil Disaster. Corexit, caught in temporal vortices formed by the high shear conditions of a fine [gauge](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauge_theory) needle in vaccination injection, is also responsible for autism spectrum disorders. Seriously, doesn’t anyone teach bullshit detection anymore? ---
**Author:** ![Shmendrik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Shmendrik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shmendrik)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/3 "2010-09-21T04:28:16Z")
> [@Libre](#): > > Can anyone make a reasonably convincing argument against this article: > > [http://www.infiniteunknown.net/2010/09/14/life-on-this-earth-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/](http://www.infiniteunknown.net/2010/09/14/life-on-this-earth-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/) > > For what it’s worth, I located these previous gulf stream velocity images: [http://rads.tudelft.nl/gulfstream/gif/](http://rads.tudelft.nl/gulfstream/gif/) > > Thanks, > > Libre I have no way to evaluate the credentials of the gentleman (Bill Deagle MD AAEM) making all of these claims other than by looking at his website: [http://www.nutrimedical.com/](http://www.nutrimedical.com/) He appears to be a medical doctor who is chiefly concerned with vitamin supplements. Actually, there appears to a second author, “Rt Hon. the Earl of Stirling”; the link you gave isn’t entirely clear though. He conveniently provides a biography on his [blog](http://europebusines.blogspot.com/): > [@](#): > > Lord Stirling > Evansville, IN, United States > I hold several ancient Scottish titles, Earl of Stirling, Viscount of Canada, Viscount of Stirling, Lord Alexander of Tulibody (1630), Lord Alexander of Tulibody (1633), etc., Chief of Clan Alexander, I also hold several honorific old Canadian great offices-of-state: Lord Lieutenant and Governor of Canada, Lord High Admiral of Nova Scotia, Lord Lieutenant of Nova Scotia, Lt.-Gen. of Nova Scotis (first Lord Stirling was founder of English speaking Canada in the early 1600s). I hold 3 degrees: B.Sc. in Pol. Sc. & History; M.A. in European Studies; B.Sc. in Education. I have worked on 3 addtional degrees: M.T.S. (theology); LL.B. (English Law); M.S. (Criminal Justice). I am former Scottish Editor at Burke’s Peerage in London. I also hold several Scots/Canadian feudal titles. I am a widower. I have a published book, CASH FOR PEERAGES: THE SMOKING GUN, [www.lulu.com/content/953682](http://www.lulu.com/content/953682) . Listing for me as Chief of Clan Alexander at [Chiefs of Clans and Names in Scotland](http://www.electricscotland.com/webclans/chiefs.htm) I am available for public speaking engagements. Please contact me at: [earlofstirling@yahoo.com](mailto:earlofstirling@yahoo.com) ---
**Author:** ![matt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@matt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/4 "2010-09-21T04:49:52Z")
The source document appears to be this one (pdf): [http://www.associazionegeofisica.it/OilSpill.pdf](http://www.associazionegeofisica.it/OilSpill.pdf) It’s by the “Gianluigi Zangari” mentioned in the article, and it’s somewhat more circumspect in its claims. For one thing, Coreexit isn’t mentioned at all, and BP’s involvement is just suggested as a possibility. Gianluigi Zangari appears to be a real person at least: a search for Zangari on the INFN website kicks out a few paper’s he has co-authored. All seems to be superconductivity physics though - not a lot about ocean circulation. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/5 "2010-09-21T04:50:35Z")
> [@Libre](#): > > Can anyone make a reasonably convincing argument against this article: On the contrary, the article fails to prove the point. One need not prove a negative. Also, the political comment that **Squink** points out should be a clue for you. ---
**Author:** ![Libre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85e7bf/32.png) [@Libre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Libre)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/6 "2010-09-21T05:11:31Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > The entire ‘river of warm water’ that flows from the Caribbean to the edges of Western Europe is dying due to the Corexit that the Obama Administration allowed BP to use to hide the scale of the BP Deepwater Horizon Oil Disaster. > > Corexit, caught in temporal vortices formed by the high shear conditions of a fine [gauge](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauge_theory) needle in vaccination injection, is also responsible for autism spectrum disorders. > > Seriously, doesn’t anyone teach bullshit detection anymore? Just because someone pads his article with this kind of nonsense - does it necessarily mean that the scientific data he quotes is incorrect? ---
**Author:** ![Shmendrik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Shmendrik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shmendrik)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/7 "2010-09-21T05:26:45Z")
> [@Libre](#): > > > [@Squink](#): > > > > Corexit, caught in temporal vortices formed by the high shear conditions of a fine [gauge](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauge_theory) needle in vaccination injection, is also responsible for autism spectrum disorders. > > > > Seriously, doesn’t anyone teach bullshit detection anymore? > > Just because someone pads his article with this kind of nonsense - does it necessarily mean that the scientific data he quotes is incorrect? Of course not. But he quotes very little scientific data. He cherry picked the paragraphs which sound the most alarming, leaving out paragraphs which contain hedge words like this one: > [@](#): > > Since comparative analysis with past satellite data until may 2010 didn’t show > relevant anomalies, it might be therefore plausible to correlate the breaking of > the Loop Current with the biochemical and physical action of the BP Oil Spill on > the Gulf Stream. The letter by Dr Zangari is interesting. I’m sure that it might be plausible, and am very interested in hearing about future research in this area. The histrionics on the website you linked to aren’t really worth paying attention to, though. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/8 "2010-09-21T05:28:42Z")
> [@Libre](#): > > Just because someone pads his article with this kind of nonsense - does it necessarily mean that the scientific data he quotes is incorrect? That’s not padding, that’s making up the conclusion you want, and then throwing some sciency sounding stuff around it to suck in the credulous. I posted links to some information on the loop current in the GD thread: [Did the BP oil spill screw up the ocean conveyor belt system](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=578704). There simply has not been time to make gather enough data to draw such shocking conclusions about Corexit and the loop current. The current varies wildly over the course of months to years all by itself, and there’s no reason to believe that a _little_ added solvent would mess with it in any significant way. When the author of this alarmist tripe comes back with 10 years of detailed corroborating data, and pie, he _might_ be worth listening to, but certainly not before then. ---
**Author:** ![Libre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/85e7bf/32.png) [@Libre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Libre)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/9 "2010-09-21T05:38:16Z")
I appreciate your comments and the GD link, Squink. This is along the lines of what I was trying to tell a friend. Also, sorry, I didn’t know this subject had been covered. I search for it last night on the Dope to no avail. ---
**Author:** ![Cunctator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/43a26b/32.png) [@Cunctator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cunctator)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/10 "2010-09-21T06:22:20Z")
[QUOTE=Shmendrik] Actually, there appears to a second author, “Rt Hon. the Earl of Stirling”; the link you gave isn’t entirely clear though. He conveniently provides a biography on his [blog](http://europebusines.blogspot.com/): > [@](#): > > Lord Stirling > Evansville, IN, United States > I hold several ancient Scottish titles, Earl of Stirling, Viscount of Canada, Viscount of Stirling, Lord Alexander of Tulibody (1630), Lord Alexander of Tulibody (1633), etc., Chief of Clan Alexander, I also hold several honorific old Canadian great offices-of-state: Lord Lieutenant and Governor of Canada, Lord High Admiral of Nova Scotia, Lord Lieutenant of Nova Scotia, Lt.-Gen. of Nova Scotis (first Lord Stirling was founder of English speaking Canada in the early 1600s). I hold 3 degrees: B.Sc. in Pol. Sc. & History; M.A. in European Studies; B.Sc. in Education. I have worked on 3 addtional degrees: M.T.S. (theology); LL.B. (English Law); M.S. (Criminal Justice). I am former Scottish Editor at Burke’s Peerage in London. I also hold several Scots/Canadian feudal titles. I am a widower. I have a published book, CASH FOR PEERAGES: THE SMOKING GUN, [www.lulu.com/content/953682](http://www.lulu.com/content/953682) . Listing for me as Chief of Clan Alexander at [Chiefs of Clans and Names in Scotland](http://www.electricscotland.com/webclans/chiefs.htm) I am available for public speaking engagements. Please contact me at: [earlofstirling@yahoo.com](mailto:earlofstirling@yahoo.com) [/quote] The Wikipedia entry for the [Earldom of Stirling](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk%3AEarl_of_Stirling) suggests that there is considerable doubt about Mr Alexander’s right to use the title. ---
**Author:** ![grimpixie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ecb155/32.png) [@grimpixie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/grimpixie)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/11 "2010-09-21T07:42:01Z")
I liked this part: “Violent mixing of the seasons, crop failures, and increased drought and floods in diverse places is now daily news since the April 20th 2010 BP Oil Volcano.” And not in the fifteen years before that? ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/12 "2010-09-21T10:23:06Z")
The linked images don’t seem to show much change in the current between 2004 and 2010, unless I am much mistaken. ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 11:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/13 "2010-09-21T11:01:58Z")
> [@Squink](#): > > When the author of this alarmist tripe comes back with 10 years of detailed corroborating data, and pie, he _might_ be worth listening to, but certainly not before then. > [@](#): > > Hibbert: (through an intercom) Lisa Simpson, are you ready to go on a voyage of intellectual self-discovery? > > Lisa: I think so. > > Hibbert: Is that a pie, or a quiche? > > Lisa: A pie. > > (Some murmuring over the intercom) > > Hibbert: You may enter. > **[They Saved Lisa's Brain](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/They_Saved_Lisa's_Brain)** > > "They Saved Lisa's Brain" is the twenty-second and penultimate episode of the tenth season of the American animated television series The Simpsons. It first aired on Fox in the United States on May 9, 1999. In the episode, after writing a thoughtful letter to the Springfield Shopper, Lisa is invited to join the Springfield chapter of Mensa. When Mayor Quimby later flees Springfield, the group takes control of the town, hoping to improve the lives of Springfieldians through the rule of the sma... ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/14 "2010-09-21T12:05:25Z")
> [@Libre](#): > > Just because someone pads his article with this kind of nonsense - does it necessarily mean that the scientific data he quotes is incorrect? No. At least in the sense that even a stopped-clock is right twice a day. I’m more of a gullible sucker for the latest conspiracy theory than the average Doper, but _ **Please find a site slightly more intelligent than this one before wasting my time.** _ ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/15 "2010-09-21T12:20:21Z")
It’s nice to know that the Gulf Stream is so fragile that it could be stopped so easily. Because that means I can now put into place my insidious plan to stop the Earth’s ocean currents unless the nations of the world pay me [Dr Evil] **One Million Dollars!** [/Dr Evil] Seriously, have some perspective. The Earth is what we scientists call “very very large”. The accumulated actions of human civilization could (and probably does) affect the flow of Gulf Stream and I doubt either the oil or the treatment for the oil did much good to the local aquatic fauna (hello, dead zone!) but stopping the current would take a bit more than that. Also, I think the weather here in England might be just a _teensy_ bit affected if such a thing had happened. ---
**Author:** ![dzero](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f9b8f/32.png) [@dzero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dzero)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/16 "2010-09-21T12:30:41Z")
IIRC the horrors that are to result depend upon a break down of the loop current. That may have happened over the summer for some brief period of time but the last I asked someone who knows about this stuff, the loop current is now intact and has been for quite a while. If the loop current ever breaks down in a way that indicates it could be permanent or semi-permanent - it will be big news. You won’t have to go looking for obscure articles in Italian journals that have nothing to do with climatology (Frascati National Laboratories (LNF) - National Institute of Nuclear Physics (INFN) Frascati 00044, Via E. Fermi, 40, ITALY) ---
**Author:** ![Daerlyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Daerlyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Daerlyn)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/17 "2010-09-21T12:41:32Z")
I would seriously doubt Mr Alexander’s claims to any “scots/canadian feudal titles”, since the Nickel Resolution way back in 1919 made all hereditary titles of Canadian citizens lapse with the death of the incumbent. His claims to being lord high muckety-mucks of various provinces and the dominion itself are simply laughable nonsense. Since there’s so much egregious bullshit in his biography, how could any of his ‘research’ be credible? ---
**Author:** ![Baron\_Greenback](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baron_greenback/32/48_2.png) [@Baron\_Greenback](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baron_Greenback)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/18 "2010-09-21T13:04:26Z")
> [@Shmendrik](#): > > Actually, there appears to a second author, “Rt Hon. the Earl of Stirling”; the link you gave isn’t entirely clear though. He conveniently provides a biography on his [blog](http://europebusines.blogspot.com/): > > > [@](#): > > > > Lord Stirling > > Evansville, IN, United States > > I hold several ancient Scottish titles, Earl of Stirling, Viscount of Canada, Viscount of Stirling, Lord Alexander of Tulibody (1630), Lord Alexander of Tulibody (1633), etc., Chief of Clan Alexander, I also hold several honorific old Canadian great offices-of-state: Lord Lieutenant and Governor of Canada, Lord High Admiral of Nova Scotia, Lord Lieutenant of Nova Scotia, Lt.-Gen. of Nova Scotis (first Lord Stirling was founder of English speaking Canada in the early 1600s). I hold 3 degrees: B.Sc. in Pol. Sc. & History; M.A. in European Studies; B.Sc. in Education. I have worked on 3 addtional degrees: M.T.S. (theology); LL.B. (English Law); M.S. (Criminal Justice). I am former Scottish Editor at Burke’s Peerage in London. I also hold several Scots/Canadian feudal titles. I am a widower. I have a published book, CASH FOR PEERAGES: THE SMOKING GUN, [www.lulu.com/content/953682](http://www.lulu.com/content/953682) . Listing for me as Chief of Clan Alexander at [Chiefs of Clans and Names in Scotland](http://www.electricscotland.com/webclans/chiefs.htm) I am available for public speaking engagements. Please contact me at: [earlofstirling@yahoo.com](mailto:earlofstirling@yahoo.com) Two things: He misspells some of his titles eg it’s Tullibody with a double l, and most of those titles went dormant in the 18th century. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/19 "2010-09-21T13:06:24Z")
> [@Daerlyn](#): > > I would seriously doubt Mr Alexander’s claims to any “scots/canadian feudal titles”, since the Nickel Resolution way back in 1919 made all hereditary titles of Canadian citizens lapse with the death of the incumbent. His claims to being lord high muckety-mucks of various provinces and the dominion itself are simply laughable nonsense. > > Since there’s so much egregious bullshit in his biography, how could any of his ‘research’ be credible? Technically, there’s a small square of land in Stirling Castle(?) which is part of Nova Scotia. This so the relevant earl could be invested as a lord of Canada, since that had to happen on the earl’s domain. So we can ban hereditary titles over here, but Lizzy’s ancestors already gave away the store. ---
**Author:** ![Clark\_Cello](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/58f4c7/32.png) [@Clark\_Cello](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clark_Cello)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507/20 "2010-09-21T13:09:31Z")
> [@Libre](#): > > > [@Squink](#): > > > > Corexit, caught in temporal vortices formed by the high shear conditions of a fine [gauge](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gauge_theory) needle in vaccination injection, is also responsible for autism spectrum disorders. > > > > Seriously, doesn’t anyone teach bullshit detection anymore? > > Just because someone pads his article with this kind of nonsense - does it necessarily mean that the scientific data he quotes is incorrect? Most of the time it does, yes. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/life-on-earth-has-just-changed-the-north-atlantic-current-is-gone/554507.md?page=2)