Fucking bullshit.
If the title of your job is “lifeguard,” and the place you work is a swimming pool or waterhole, then you should assume that CPR might be needed on any and every day of the swimming season.
Requiring that lifeguards use protective apparatus is a reasonable precaution; not having such apparatus available and within easy reach at every swimming site is completely unacceptable.
I’d make a distinction between J. Random Citizen, who may perform CPR once or twice in their lifetime, and a lifeguard, police officer, EMT, etc., who may have to perform CPR on a semi-regular basis. It may seem cruel, but I wouldn’t expect an emergency responder to risk their health and life in a situation where the proper safety equipment wasn’t available. The job is dangerous enough as it is, without taking unnecessary risks.
This isn’t the “good old days”. There is a significant chance that a three-year-old is HIV positive or has other communicable diseases. I had to attend a blood-borne pathogen training course. We were taught to treat blood like it was deadly chemical or radioactive waste.
I strongly disagree with this. While I can’t say what I’d do in the this situation, it is silly to condemn someone for doing EXACTLY what they are trained and told to do. I cannot fault anyone for refusing to put themselves at risk.
I was a lifeguard for many years, as well as a Wilderness F/A trained backcountry hike and ski leader. The first rule is don’t put yourself or anyone else at risk when attempting a rescue. I’ve had to give CPR once (it failed) and I wouldn’t hesitate to do it again without a mouth guard, but I would not think poorly of someone else who came to the same conclusion.
I agree, mouthguards and gloves should be SOP at the lifeguard station. But 99% of what a lifeguard does has nothing do with emergency responses. Carrying them with the guards doesn’t makes sense, but the other guards should be running over with the mouth guards and gloves.
I’d rather save the 3 year old and risk harm to myself than live with the guilt of standing by and watching him die. Since saving lives isn’t in my job description, I can’t reasonably be expected to have the equipment to perform CPR safely. But what knucklehead didn’t provide the lifeguards with what they need?
I was a lifeguard for about 8 years, and I only had to perform CPR once, on a guy who collapsed playing basketball. Aside from the people working with me that day, none of the other lifeguards I ever worked with had to perform CPR. It’s really not that common.
First, if the lifeguards needed equipment for any work they may need to do, and they do not have it, that is a huge problem, the fault of which might fall on the lifeguards themselves, or their employer.
But, insisting that someone who doesn’t go above and beyond to save someone else is selfish, etc etc, is pretty darned… elitist (looking for the word that describes a person who comfortably puts down other people from a position of safety and security. Having a bit of a brain cramp).
If catching a potentially deadly disease is a legitimate concern while giving CPR, and the people did not have the gear to ensure their protection, then, well, I’m not going to judge whether or not their level of fear was inappropriate, and certainly am not going to judge them.
I fantasize a lot about saving people, being able to rescue them, basically, being a hero. I’ve never been in a position where I’ve been needed to save someone, and honestly, who knows whether I’d actually be able to do what would be required in any given circumstance.
Calling people names for being affraid is a nasty thing to do, and reminds me too much of school bullies and and assholes who prey upon those with less self-confidence (perhaps because they’ve been put to the test and are keenly aware of their own limitations).
If that kid had died, I’m sure the lifeguards would feel awful about it, and I’m sure they’re grateful that someone else who was stronger (or more ignorant) was able to step up, so that they don’t have to go home every day and remember how their fear kept them from being able to help when help was needed.
The fact that it’s not that common isn’t the point. I’m sure what you say is true.
But the fact is that someone trained as a lifeguard, and paid to perform lifeguard duties, should be ready to do it every single day that he or she is on the job.
Certainly you expected this to be a rhetoriocal question, but I can see either side of the question…
Back to OP…Although many of you argue that it’s worth rescue-ing someone with a small/moderate risk of death or disease to yourself, there is a point at which the risk is simply too great. Obviously, many of us disagree at where that point is.
I personally believe that too many of you are trying to be heroes, when you’re really not. Our society watches too many movies.
I did a CPR course and the instructor said in a pinch you could use a piece of plastic - punch a hole in the middle to avoid skin to skin. The lifeguards should be supplied with those mouthpiece things surely? It might not happen often but when it does there’s a good chance to save a life with mouth to mouth from drowning.
I don’t think you’ll find a single person who’ll disagree with you. But can you actually see it happening? I image they’d more often be left behind, or lost, or used as scrunchies, or toys or whatever. It’d be interesting to hear from a lifeguard how feasable it would be, especially for lifeguards in remote areas who might not check in with a central office.
Telemark, care to weigh in?
Well, then, why the HELL don’t they have the proper equipment? That’s insane.
Yeah, I checked the wiki cite before posting, because it’d been so long since I was a lifeguard or since I’d trained lifeguards. Back in my day, the laws varied by jurisdiction so greatly it was best assumed that you were obliged to provide aid. Possibly, this has changed now.
Nonetheless, the lifeguard is employed to have a caretaker relationship with every person on the beach (/pool/wherever). So I think they were obliged.
See the wiki cite for an explicit exception that they’re not obliged if providing aid may be unsafe – which seems to have been the lifeguards’ objection here.
Nonetheless, I maintain that the lifeguards failed in their duty before the refused to give CPR. They failed when they allowed the child to start drowning in the first place. That’s what they’re there to prevent.
The fact that the lifeguards were not supplied with mouthguards is reprehensible. You can pick them up practically anyplace that has first aid equipment; the simplest ones are pieces of plastic, folded into a little holder about the size of a condom packet, and attachable to a keychain. They’re only a couple of bucks. And shame on the lifeguards, who probably panicked upon being presented with a bona fide emergency and hid blindly behind Textbook Protocol. Maybe this will teach them to think for themselves a little bit.
That being said, it’s surprising (and alarming) how many people will refuse to do CPR, even on their nearest and dearest. If I can’t get a 911 caller to perform mouth-to-mouth, I’ll try to get them to at least do chest compressions, which is better than nothing (not much better, but still…). Some of them won’t even do that. I blame Rescue 911. People think they should be able to dial 911 and an ambulance will magically appear at their door within seconds, and then they get mad at me when I try to talk them through first aid, yelling, “That’s the paramedics job, not mine, where the hell are they!”
Whoa. Had a little pent-up resentment there. Ok, I’m better now.
So they should universally (every single day, every single rescue, every single time) practice Universal safety, but they shouldn’t universally carry the (lightweight, handy and inconspicuous) equipment they need to do so?
I’m sorry, there’s no way I would train to be a lifeguard, accept Universal Precautions as the right way to do things, and then not have the equipment on hand I needed to do it. If I couldn’t spend the 25 cents myself, I’d refuse to work until the materials were there. If that means the park district needs to shut down the beach because they have no lifeguard, then good!
And I simply cannot believe that no one had a piece of plastic. No one had a sandwich in a ziplock or saran wrap? No one had a condom? No one had a travel pack of baby wipes in a plastic bag? WTF? Use some imagination, people - a baby is dying here!
No way. There is no possible way to prevent all accidents from happening and this may be just that. I lifeguarded at pools, which are fairly controlled enviornments and much easier to police, and people still managed to get into compromising situations while I was doing my job (very well, thank you very much). At a beach, a lifeguard can’t hope to prevent all possible accidents. They can do their best, but you can’t watch every 3 year old every second of the day.
Shit happens, no lifeguard is going to prevent every bad thing from happening. If the lifeguard knew they didn’t feel comfortable performing CPR without a mouth guard then the burden on them is to carry one with them at all times when on duty.
But I can also tell you that no amount of training prepares you for performing CPR for real. It’s the scariest thing I ever did, and I have almost no memory of actually performing CPR. I could have easily screwed up everything I was supposed to do. When confronted with a life or death situation, even well trained people can freeze up. There’s really no way of knowing until you face the situation for real, unfortunately.
I’m not saying they shouldn’t, I’m asking if it’s realistically feasable if they can. I can’t really see why not, but I don’t know the profession well enough.
Add to that question: Do any lifeguards currently carry them?
Additionally: Do you think they will start to, after this incident?
If the lifeguards can’t be expected to perform CPR without a mouthguard, and they can’t be expected to carry a mouthguard around because they perform CPR so infrequently, why bother having lifeguards in the first place?
Why not just put up big signs saying, “Sorry, but if you drown in the pool/pond you’re on your own”?
I’ve probably given CPR better than a hundred times in 15 years. One time without a mask or bag. ONE. That’s it. During which the victim and I shared lunch.
There’s a 99.75% chance that I won’t be doing that again. Ever.
That said, it approaches criminal that the lifeguards weren’t properly prepared, whether it’s thier fault or their employers’ is up to the lawyers.
You can beat your chest, you can posture, you can call people chickenshit, but if that (potentially) HIV+ three year old pukes bloody stomach contents into your mouth, which in turn gives you HIV, which, in a dozen years or so turns into AIDS and kills you, and you can’t see YOUR kids grow up. Would it have been worth it?
Not that the lifeguards had THAT in mind specifically, but it’s an understandable reaction.
It’s the reason there’s a CPR mask on my belt… Every. Single. Day.
I’m with Diogenes with this, 100%.
What kind of pussy society are we becoming when we won’t even provide CPR to a dying 3 year old without protective mouth gear? Any lifeguard who would trade the minute risk of catching a life-threatening disease from a 3-year old for the certain death of that 3-year old, is a useless tit. I fully expect my first responders to accept much greater danger than that to protect the public. If I put my child in a public pool, I expect that lifeguard to do EVERYTHING in his or her power to save my kid, even at significant risk to his own life. That just goes with the job.
When we start accepting this kind of risk-avoidance from first responders we help to degrade the code by which they are supposed to live. Firefighters rush into burning buildings because that’s what they do. Lifeguards dive into dangerous waters to save drowning people, because that’s what they do. Yes, they are expected to do it professionally and intelligently. Use lifelines and reach poles when you have them, because that’s the safest, smartest thing to do.
But to wring your hands and watch a child die who you are responsible for, because you might catch something from them is beyond reprehensible.
Well, more detail emerge from the pond management. Of course they have a bias, but they report the kid was breathing (or coughing, which in rescue parlance is good enough) when the lifeguards got to him, so they did not administer CPR.
CPR masks are cheap fuckers; if there’s a vague chance you might be called upon to MtM someone in your work, your employer should make sure you have one at grabbing distance.