# Ligers and Tigons and Mules...that's all? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 15, 2007, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337 "2007-09-15T20:28:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/1 "2007-09-15T20:28:20Z")
These are the only examples I can think of where inter-species breeding produces offspring. Surely there must be plenty of others, given all closely related species out there. ---
**Author:** ![Sternvogel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bc79bd/32.png) [@Sternvogel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sternvogel)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/2 "2007-09-15T20:38:33Z")
[This page](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrids) has quite a list of hybrids, including the hinny (offspring of a stallion and jenny, as opposed to the mule, whose parents are a mare and a jackass). ---
**Author:** ![SnakesCatLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4af34b/32.png) [@SnakesCatLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SnakesCatLady)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/3 "2007-09-15T20:38:52Z")
[QUOTE=sqweels] These are the only examples I can think of where inter-species breeding produces offspring. Surely there must be plenty of others, given all closely related species out there. [/QUOTE] Wolphins - Sea Life Park discovered, after putting a false killer whale and a dolphin in the same tank, that the two can breed. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/4 "2007-09-15T20:57:43Z")
I once saw a feline hybrid that was the offspring of a bobcat and a domestic cat. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/5 "2007-09-15T21:04:46Z")
Yes, yes, but what do you get if you cross an elephant and a rhino? ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/6 "2007-09-15T21:10:44Z")
Thanks for the link, **Sternvogel**. More hybrids than you can shake a stick at. Think of the fuel savings. ---
**Author:** ![Plynck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Plynck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Plynck)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/7 "2007-09-15T21:12:58Z")
[QUOTE=Mangetout] Yes, yes, but what do you get if you cross an elephant and a rhino? [/QUOTE] Elephino. But what do you get when you cross the Alps with elephants? ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/8 "2007-09-15T21:27:24Z")
[QUOTE=Plynck] But what do you get when you cross the Alps with elephants? [/QUOTE] Glory for Carthage? ---
**Author:** ![robardin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/43a26b/32.png) [@robardin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robardin)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/9 "2007-09-15T22:39:24Z")
I saw a show once on the Discovery Channel called [Humanzee](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanzee), speculating on the possbility that a Human/Chimp hybrid was possible – and _may have been done_ at some point in the past… Brrr! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/10 "2007-09-15T22:45:12Z")
[QUOTE=robardin] I saw a show once on the Discovery Channel called [Humanzee](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humanzee), speculating on the possbility that a Human/Chimp hybrid was possible – and _may have been done_ at some point in the past… Brrr! [/QUOTE] That was a stupid show, except they had some great video of a Liger-- they get BIG! There is no evidence that a human chimp hybrid has ever existed, although it certainly seems that it should be possible. I’m not aware of any large mammal species that are as closely related\* as chimps and humans are that can’t hybridize. And there are quite a few that are more distantly related and that can hybridize. \*genetic relatedness, not the arbitrary classification of humans and chimps in different genera. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/11 "2007-09-15T22:49:41Z")
WRT my last post, there is some evidence that our early ancestors hybridized with chimps in the distant past, but they would not be classified in the genus _Homo_, and so really can’t be called “human”. If that were the case, then there would have been two human/chimp line splits-- one at about 9M years ago, and then a merger and re-spit about 5-6M years ago. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/12 "2007-09-15T23:02:59Z")
[QUOTE=sqweels] These are the only examples I can think of where inter-species breeding produces offspring. Surely there must be plenty of others, given all closely related species out there. [/QUOTE] Occasional hybridization between closely related species is extremely common, and hybrids are often fully fertile. There are literally thousands of known interspecific hybrids. (Note that species status does not depend at all on whether hybrids are sterile, it merely requires that hybrids are relatively rare under natural conditions.) Many kinds of ducks produce fertile hybrids, and hybridization between Mallards and American Black Ducks is so common in the northeastern US that it threatens the existence of the latter. All species in the genus _Canis_ (wolves, coyotes, jackals, and domestic dogs) produce fertile hybrids. ---
**Author:** ![RedRosesForMe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/91b2a8/32.png) [@RedRosesForMe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedRosesForMe)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2007, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/13 "2007-09-15T23:03:26Z")
Can’t camels and llamas breed, albeit with a little help from scientists because they don’t actually run across each other in the wild too often. LLamel? Cama? I thought it was described as a more mild-mannered camel. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2007, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/14 "2007-09-16T01:06:45Z")
[QUOTE=Mangetout] Yes, yes, but what do you get if you cross an elephant and a rhino? [/QUOTE] |Elephant| |rhino| sin q in a direction mutually perpendicular to the two as determined by the right-hand rule. ---
**Author:** ![twickster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ec9cab/32.png) [@twickster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/twickster)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2007, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/15 "2007-09-16T01:36:50Z")
[QUOTE=Malacandra] |Elephant| |rhino| sin q in a direction mutually perpendicular to the two as determined by the right-hand rule. [/QUOTE] Let he who is without sin… ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2007, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/16 "2007-09-16T04:25:36Z")
Last time I was at the Ringling Brothers circus, they had a bunch of Zedonks and Zonkeys performing. Those are zebra/donkey hybrids, if the names didn’t already give that away! They LOOK like zebras, but are much more docile and far easier to train. Most animal trainers will tell you it’s a nightmare trying to train a zebra to do anything, even if that zebra was raised in captivity (that’s why, in old Tarzan movies, the “zebras” were usually horses painted with stripes). ---
**Author:** ![Sophistry\_and\_Illusion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b3f665/32.png) [@Sophistry\_and\_Illusion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sophistry_and_Illusion)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2007, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/17 "2007-09-16T15:16:44Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] …they had some great video of a Liger-- they get BIG! [/QUOTE] [You’re not kidding!](http://vitriolix.com/blogarchive/2006_06_01_vitriolix_archive.html) ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2007, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/18 "2007-09-16T15:59:02Z")
Take wolf-dog hybrids-would they tend to replace pure wolves? Also-those bizarre tyons: lions and tigers are geographically sepearte (I don’t think tigers were ever in Africa)-so how are these two different species fertile? ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2007, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/19 "2007-09-16T16:08:20Z")
[QUOTE=RedRosesForMe] Can’t camels and llamas breed, albeit with a little help from scientists because they don’t actually run across each other in the wild too often. LLamel? Cama? I thought it was described as a more mild-mannered camel. [/QUOTE] There are some great pictures of a baby “cama”, as well as nine other hybrids including a “zony” and a “ti-ligon”, [here](http://www.hemmy.net/2006/06/19/top-10-hybrid-animals/). ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2007, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337/20 "2007-09-16T16:34:25Z")
[QUOTE=ralph124c] Take wolf-dog hybrids-would they tend to replace pure wolves? Also-those bizarre tyons: lions and tigers are geographically sepearte (I don’t think tigers were ever in Africa)-so how are these two different species fertile? [/QUOTE] Given the enormous population advantage that domestic dogs have over wolves, that might very well be the case. Note, however, that both are considered members of the same species. Geographic separation, in and of itself, is not an impediment to inter-fertility-- not when it’s done in captivity, as was the case with lions and tigers. They last shared a common ancestor about 4M years ago (IIRC), so it’s probably not surprising that they can hybridize ([as can all the species in the genus _Panthera_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panthera_hybrid)). There was an excellent article on cat evolution in a recent Scientific American issue. It was on-line recently, but seems to no longer be. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ligers-and-tigons-and-mules-thats-all/419337.md?page=2)