# likable conservatives **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 4, 2003, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535 "2003-09-04T15:24:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![vanilla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f19dbf/32.png) [@vanilla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vanilla)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/1 "2003-09-04T15:24:04Z")
This was more of a IMHO, but its political, so here it is. A lot of people “dislike” wild-assed “conservatives” such as Coulter, Rush, Savage(am i right? dunno who he is). Is there anyone who is a conservative whom any left=leaning folk think is a-okay, or respectable? ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/2 "2003-09-04T15:44:23Z")
I’ve always liked George Will. I like William Safire, too, but I don’t know that I’d want to talk to him, in the fear that he’d correct my grammar. Also, by all accounts, Ben Stein is supposed to be cool. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/3 "2003-09-04T16:04:07Z")
Hmm. Not that I can think of; it’s hard for me to like someone I don’t respect, and it’s hard for me to respect someone who’s fundamentally selfish and dishonest. In my opinion it’s impossible to hold a conservative position without first mastering the art of lying to oneself. And it’s impossible to be a public conservative (e.g. a pundit)–which involves lying to others–without being fundamentally disrespectful of your audience. I expect to get splattered for this, but it’s not my intention to rankle; the above is my honest opinion. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/4 "2003-09-04T16:17:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Captain Amazing \* > I like William Safire, too, but I don’t know that I’d want to talk to him, in the fear that he’d correct my grammar. With sentence structure like that, your fear is well grounded.🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Hugh\_Jass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/4da419/32.png) [@Hugh\_Jass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hugh_Jass)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/5 "2003-09-04T16:42:29Z")
I respect P.J. O’Rourke a great deal. ---
**Author:** ![Skip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ebca7d/32.png) [@Skip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skip)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/6 "2003-09-04T16:46:15Z")
Barry Goldwater always seemed like a straight shooter from everything I’ve read about him. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/7 "2003-09-04T17:02:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by lissener \* > \*\*Hmm. Not that I can think of; it’s hard for me to like someone I don’t respect, and it’s hard for me to respect someone who’s fundamentally selfish and dishonest. In my opinion it’s impossible to hold a conservative position without first mastering the art of lying to oneself. And it’s impossible to be a public conservative (e.g. a pundit)–which involves lying to others–without being fundamentally disrespectful of your audience. > > I expect to get splattered for this, but it’s not my intention to rankle; the above is my honest opinion. \*\* I won’t splatter you for it. Given that IMO the blind idealism edorsed by your average dem-policy creator makes me think they wouldn’t know reality if it bit them in the ass, I’d say you’d _have_ to think we’re lying to ourselves if you see things through their rose-colored glasses all the time. :rolleyes: As for the OP I spend as little time as possible listening to people of any political bent spout off on their political opinions. Some might find it entertaining to embrace a spokesperson, but I don’t get anything from it. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/13edae/32.png) [@Dewey\_Cheatem\_Undhow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Cheatem_Undhow)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/8 "2003-09-04T17:08:40Z")
Hell, I’m a conservative and I don’t like most of the TV/radio punditry on the right or the left. This brings me to what I will humbly call **Dewey’s Axiom of Credible Punditry** : a media pundit’s credibility is directly correlated to the medium in which he or she first became a pundit, with TV/radio being an indicia of stupidity, and print work being an indicia of intelligence. To wit: Ann Coulter – started punditry career as a talking head during Clinton impeachment. Idiot. Savage – started in radio. Idiot. Rush – Radio. Not as idiotic as commonly thought, but not a well of wisdom either. Hannity – radio. Idiot. O’Reilly – TV. Idiot. COMPARE TO: George Will – columnist. Smart. William F. Buckley – magazine founder and columnist. Smart. Robert Novak – columnist. Smart. William Safire – columnist. Smart (occasionally kind of loopy). Thomas Sowell – columnist, author. Smart. Rich Lowry – editor at NR. Smart. P.J. O’Rourke – writer. Fucking brilliant. etc, etc, etc. It works for the left, too: James Carville – TV. Idiot. Paul Begala – TV. Idiot. Michael Moore – film. Idiot. Al Franken – TV (Started punditry as Comedy Central convention correspondent). Idiot. Bill Maher – TV. Idiot. COMPARE TO: Michael Kinsley – former editor of TNR. Smart. Christopher Hitchens – former editor of TNR. Smart. (Moving right lately, though) Paul Krugman – columnist. Smart. (Sometimes fact-challenged). Molly Ivins – columnist. Smart. (But not as clever as she’s made out to be). etc, etc, etc. The only place the axiom truly breaks down is with Maureen Dowd, who writes a column but is still a blithering idiot. ---
**Author:** ![annaplurabelle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/919ad9/32.png) [@annaplurabelle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/annaplurabelle)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/9 "2003-09-04T17:34:32Z")
From a moderate/libertarian POV: P.J. O’Rourke. What’s not to like? ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/10 "2003-09-04T17:41:53Z")
I hate to think I might disagree with you, Livia, but I have to search out the things that O’Rourke has said that have outright horrified me. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/11 "2003-09-04T17:44:38Z")
I actually agree with Dewey’s list pretty much down the line, but he did leave out one prime example: Peggy Noonan, writer, not an idiot but a raving loony. In fact, pretty much the entire WSJ editorial staff qualifies. That more than counteracts Dowd, Arianna Huffington (changed “sides” suspiciously, therefore a ho) and George Stephanopoulos (same) combined. I take exception to George Will - even when he’s writing about baseball, he seems to be sucking a lemon while doing it, and he’s too transparent to be so pedantic. Toss in John McLaughlin on the likable list for his crusty type of avuncularity. But on the whole, it doesn’t matter how polite you are or how big your smile if you’re pushing hatred and divisiveness. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/12 "2003-09-04T17:47:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by ElvisL1ves \* > \*\*. . . it doesn’t matter how polite you are or how big your smile if you’re pushing hatred and divisiveness. \*\* Yeah, what he said. ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/13 "2003-09-04T18:02:37Z")
I’ll toss out Gerald Ford, Richard Riordan, and George Bush Sr. as examples of conservatives with good heads on their shoulders. ---
**Author:** ![Age\_Quod\_Agis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d07c76/32.png) [@Age\_Quod\_Agis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Age_Quod_Agis)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/14 "2003-09-04T18:07:45Z")
> [@](#): > > _ElvisL1ves:_ > . . . it doesn’t matter how polite you are or how big your smile if you’re pushing hatred and divisiveness. > > _lissener:_ > Yeah, what he said. Who would do a thing like that? > [@](#): > > _lissener:_ > . . . it’s hard for me to like someone I don’t respect, and it’s hard for me to respect someone who’s fundamentally selfish and dishonest. In my opinion it’s impossible to hold a conservative position without first mastering the art of lying to oneself. And it’s impossible to be a public conservative (e.g. a pundit)–which involves lying to others–without being fundamentally disrespectful of your audience. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/15 "2003-09-04T18:44:42Z")
Who? Surely you’ve heard of Ann Coulter, for the most notable current example. Does “We must invade their lands, kill all their leaders, and convert them to Christianity” ring a bell with you? ---
**Author:** ![Skammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skammer/32/143_2.png) [@Skammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skammer)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/16 "2003-09-04T18:49:32Z")
**Elvis** , I think **Age Quod Agis** was making a point by quoting **lissener** after his question. ---
**Author:** ![stpauler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@stpauler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stpauler)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/17 "2003-09-04T19:05:35Z")
(More libertarian here, leaning left tho’) I’ve found myself agreeing with **Senator John McCain** a lot of the time. (But with him, it’s sometimes just meeting half-way) ---
**Author:** ![annaplurabelle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/919ad9/32.png) [@annaplurabelle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/annaplurabelle)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/18 "2003-09-04T19:18:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by lissener \* > \*\*I hate to think I might disagree with you, Livia, but I have to search out the things that O’Rourke has said that have outright horrified me. \*\* Isn’t some satire supposed to be horrifying? Still, I might know what you mean. [This one](http://www.nationallampoon.com/flashbacks/foreigners/foreigners.html) (from the Lampoon in the 70’s) seems horrific when I read it by today’s standards. I think his later stuff (Eat the Rich, CEO of the Sofa???) is pretty mild, though. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/19 "2003-09-04T19:19:33Z")
If so, the question doesn’t make sense - **lissener** made his point clear. ---
**Author:** ![Kempis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kempis/32/19248_2.png) [@Kempis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kempis)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2003, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535/20 "2003-09-04T19:20:51Z")
I suppose it depends on what makes a person likeable in your own opinion. If social conservatism rankles your hide, then a pro-choice conservative who thinks lowering taxes boosts the economy might be likeable. We have a lot of them out here in California… Dick Riordan, Schwarzeneggar. Can anyone rattle off some strong social conservatives who have left-leaning economic ideas? I’m having trouble thinking of many. Actually, any. 🙂 I think there’s some in the Catholic bishoporic… To go the other way, I’m a conservative and I like Dick Morris. His attitude towards women is offensive but his political insights are ballsy. -k “hatred and devisiveness” - kettle and pots [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/likable-conservatives/199535.md?page=2)