# Linguistic Puzzle: "these cups need washed" **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 17, 2006, 6:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/linguistic-puzzle-these-cups-need-washed/352957 "2006-04-17T06:32:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Rodgers01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@Rodgers01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rodgers01)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/linguistic-puzzle-these-cups-need-washed/352957/41 "2006-04-19T00:12:53Z")
> [@rocksolid](#): > > As a Scotsman myself i can confirm that the ‘error’ being discussed here is commonplace in my homeland. > > In fact, despite priding myself on my ‘proper’ English it had never ever occured to me that it was wrong in any way! > > I’m from Edinburgh, and if ever there was a place in Scotland likely to use correct grammer, it is here! I’m pretty sure it’s common throughout Scotland. > > Interested to know what references you cite for correct grammer and indeed if anyone can confirm this is incorrect language. It’s probably just due to the fact that i’m so used to it but it sounds perfectly correct to me. Well, I can’t contradict you since you naturally know more about the place than I do, but I don’t remember ever hearing it there (I was in Edinburgh for ~six months). Granted, I had to pay close attention to understand what any of the Scots were talking about (and even then, with the thicker accents, I only got about 2/3 of what was said), so maybe minor things like this just escaped my notice. 🙂 (Yes, I am lamentably terrible at understanding different accents – strange, since I generally have a good ear for learning other languages. ☹ ) ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/linguistic-puzzle-these-cups-need-washed/352957/42 "2006-04-19T00:30:24Z")
> [@LateComer](#): > > The to be in those cases are extraneous. _Are_ or _is_? > [@](#): > > Anyway, if that drives you nuts, how about this: > > “I’m going to go down to Joe’s house tonight.” becomes > “I’m going down Joe’s.” in Pittsburghese and > “I’m going down to the store.” becomes > “I’m going down the store.” The last one brings to mind a picture of you walking down the outside wall of the store. ---
**Author:** ![Lsura](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7993a0/32.png) [@Lsura](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lsura)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/linguistic-puzzle-these-cups-need-washed/352957/43 "2006-04-19T01:55:43Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > Oh, \*\*\*southern \*\*\*Ohio (aka Ahia). That explains why I’ve never heard it. But I guarantee it’ll creep up this way before long. I hear it all the time in Youngstown. Of course, it may leap out at me because I’m not from this area, so it sounds very odd to me. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/linguistic-puzzle-these-cups-need-washed/352957/44 "2006-04-19T03:50:16Z")
The hills of Western Pennsylvania (my maternal grandmother’s ancestral stomping grounds) were home to Scotch-Irish settlers from early on. Apologies to our cousins in Scotland for using a phrase that includes “Scotch,” but that just happens to be the accepted form in America when speaking of people of Scots descent who migrated here from Ulster in Colonial times. ---
**Author:** ![Neur0mancer\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/46a35a/32.png) [@Neur0mancer\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neur0mancer_1)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 6:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/linguistic-puzzle-these-cups-need-washed/352957/45 "2006-04-19T06:17:33Z")
the pittsburgh accent owes nature to a combination of influences. the scotch and irish frontiersmen who settled in western pennsylvania in the early eighteenth century, and subsquently moved south and merged with southerners moving north up the appalachians. This is why the phenomenon of dropping the verb ‘to be’ can be heard in scottish as well as southern dialects. ---
**Author:** ![Neur0mancer\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/46a35a/32.png) [@Neur0mancer\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neur0mancer_1)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/linguistic-puzzle-these-cups-need-washed/352957/46 "2006-04-19T06:20:40Z")
the pittsburgh accent owes it’s nature to a combination of influences. Scotch and Irish frontiersmen settled in western pennsylvania in the eighteenth century and then moved down the appalachians and merged with settlers moving northwards up the appalachians. This is why the phenomenon of dropping the verb ‘to be’ can be heard in scottish as well as southern dialects. ---
**Author:** ![Zabali\_Clawbane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ecd19e/32.png) [@Zabali\_Clawbane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zabali_Clawbane)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/linguistic-puzzle-these-cups-need-washed/352957/47 "2006-04-19T06:43:39Z")
The examples in the OP would be grammaticaly correct if they had an “ing” suffix instead of the past tense “ed”. The phrases “those cups need washing.”“these papers need filing” and “that contract needs signing” are perfectly correct. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Bongmaster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Bongmaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bongmaster)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2006, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/linguistic-puzzle-these-cups-need-washed/352957/48 "2006-04-19T15:15:27Z")
> [@Xema](#): > > The fully correct Pittsburgh version is actually “those cups need warshed”. I noticed the same thing from people when I lived in Ohio…I live near Philadelphia and never heard people around here say it like that. I can’t stand that particular phrase…do they not like the words “to be?” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/linguistic-puzzle-these-cups-need-washed/352957.md?page=2)