# Lion vs Bear **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 19, 2006, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387 "2006-05-19T09:17:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![bouv](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bc8723/32.png) [@bouv](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bouv)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2006, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/21 "2006-05-20T01:32:07Z")
> [@OneCentStamp](#): > > I don’t think an elephant would have the disposition, speed or tools, but how about a rhino or hippo? Hippos are supposed to be incredibly ill-tempered and vicious; so are rhinos, and both can clear two tons. I would still go with elephant. No disposition? They can get pretty angry pretty quick. And when you’re the largest land animal on the planet (by a fairly wide margin, too) you don’t need speed. And no tools? I think four foot long tusks and the ability to _crush_ most other animals are pretty darn good tools. Granted, you’d need a very large cage, but if the elephant was mad enough, I doubt any animal going up against it would stand much of a chance (assuming the battle was on land.) I mean, how many bites from even the most venomous snake would it take to bring down an elephant? Of course, it might be hard for the elephant to actually kill a snake, since it can slither around it’s legs, so we still have an interesting conundrum. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2006, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/22 "2006-05-20T01:36:02Z")
> [@bouv](#): > > I would still go with elephant. No disposition? They can get pretty angry pretty quick. And when you’re the largest land animal on the planet (by a fairly wide margin, too) you don’t need speed. And no tools? I think four foot long tusks and the ability to _crush_ most other animals are pretty darn good tools. I wouldn’t bet on an elephant against a rhinoceros. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2006, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/23 "2006-05-20T04:02:54Z")
Can we get the bear to go mano-y-mano with a [liger](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liger) (cross between a male lion and a female tiger) and still meet the OP? If so we get closer to a more interesting fight as ligers weigh in at 1100 pounds. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2006, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/24 "2006-05-20T04:58:17Z")
> [@bouv](#): > > And no tools? I think four foot long tusks and the ability to _crush_ most other animals are pretty darn good tools. Elephants can use tools; logs, for example or even smaller elephants. Then there’s trained war elephants, that could use things like swinging iron chains as weapons. OTOH, I’m sure I’ve read about lions and/or tigers killing elephants; I think by jumping on top and ripping away. ---
**Author:** ![Schuyler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/54ee81/32.png) [@Schuyler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Schuyler)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2006, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/25 "2006-05-20T07:11:28Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > I wouldn’t bet on an elephant against a rhinoceros. I’m going to have to give the nod to the elephant on this one: [Elephants kill endangered rhino](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/642731.stm) - vet Dave Cooper is quoted as saying “The rhinos were ripped to pieces” [CLASH OF THE TITANS - managing the delinquent young elephants of Pilanesberg National Park](http://www.und.ac.za/und/lesci/elephant/clash_of_the_titans.htm) (has links to some elephant-caused rhino injuries/deaths) ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2006, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/26 "2006-05-20T09:06:57Z")
I find it somewhat interesting that a gang of young powerful makes will abuse their power to cause unnecessary mayhem, and they only modify their behaviour when adults are brought in. Lack of role models and all that stuff. ---
**Author:** ![kimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f0a364/32.png) [@kimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kimera)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2006, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/27 "2006-05-20T20:40:22Z")
Not quite what you were looking for, but [here](http://youtube.com/watch?v=h7MuFDVEUro&search=bear%20cougar) is a video of a momma cougar fighting a grizzly bear. ---
**Author:** ![yelimS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/54ee81/32.png) [@yelimS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yelimS)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2006, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/28 "2006-05-20T22:37:12Z")
> [@OneCentStamp](#): > > Wow, I didn’t even think of that approach. > > But then again, there are martens and other small mammals that are quick enough to fight and kill poisonous snakes, yet would be pounded into glop by a bear. Maybe we have more of a rock-paper-scissors situation here. Also called the cycle of life. I guess other planets have had rock-paper situations, or scissor-scissor or whatever, but they probably didn’t last long. I notice there are some arguing for a fair fight, saying for example that if the tiger weighs 500 pounds, so should the bear. But since big differences aren’t principally different from the small ones, if this argument is taken to it’s logical (and neccessary) extreme, you’ll end up having two identical critters fighting each other, and the battle will end in some kind of draw. So, evening the odds kills all discussion, the question is still: what animal is the most bad-ass: bear or tiger? Polar bears always win, except when wrestling vikings. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2006, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/29 "2006-05-21T08:44:08Z")
My guess is that bear must have been young and inexperienced, probably didn’t expect the cougar to go to such lengths to protect her cub. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2006, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/30 "2006-05-21T12:40:52Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Can we get the bear to go mano-y-mano with a [liger](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liger) (cross between a male lion and a female tiger) and still meet the OP? If so we get closer to a more interesting fight as ligers weigh in at 1100 pounds. If only I’d thought of that in, say, post #5. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dfb087/32.png) [@Scoundrel\_Swanswater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scoundrel_Swanswater)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2006, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/31 "2006-05-22T14:52:47Z")
I think Discovery had a show on this once. The outcome was that if it was a grizzly and it could get in a good strike it would just break the spine of the lion (or tiger or liger). ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2006, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/32 "2006-05-22T15:23:33Z")
> [@casdave](#): > > I doubt many animals would be able to take on an Orca, even Great Whites are not known for being much of a threat to them, just as long as it all takes place in water. I should hope so. Killer whales are like twice as big as white sharks. I mean, that’s a whole new weight division. As to the OP, comparing the results of a tiger vs. sun bear fight to a tiger vs. grizzly bear fight is like saying that because I can pick up a bicycle, I can pick up a Buick. A grizzly bear is frickin’ huge. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2006, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/33 "2006-05-22T15:42:10Z")
No less of an authority than Walt Disney resolved this in the wizarding duel in The Sword and the Stone - Merlin prevailed by turning himself into a microbe (or was it a virus) and infected his opponent (who, I think, was a dragon at the time). There you have it. What do I win? ---
**Author:** ![Gaudere](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e495f1/32.png) [@Gaudere](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gaudere)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2006, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/34 "2006-05-22T16:41:03Z")
[Moderator Hat ON] To IMHO. [Moderator Hat OFF] ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2006, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/35 "2006-05-22T17:42:29Z")
> [@Blake](#): > > Granted these are sun bears and sloth bears, but even so they are still so defenceless that big cats eat them whenever they can find them. Even if we increase the size of the bear to brown bear size it still isn’t going to be any match for a big cat. That’s kind of like say that because I can beat up a house cat with ease, a tiger isn’t going to be any match for me. A pissed off grizzly that’s looking for a fight is about as much like a sun bear as Mike Tyson in his prime is like a 2 year old girl. According to Wikipedia, Eurasian brown bears steal kills from tigers: > [@](#): > > Brown Bears have also been found stealing the kills of Tigers, Wolves, and Pumas. In areas where Brown Bears and Siberian Tigers coexist, brown bears are opportunists who often follow tigers’s tracks to dispute its kill. [(link)](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brown_Bear) For whatever that’s worth. If that’s in fact accurate, I submit that bears wouldn’t follow tigers to steal their kills if they were likely to end up as lunch themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Bytegeist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9dc877/32.png) [@Bytegeist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bytegeist)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2006, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/36 "2006-05-22T20:49:43Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > According to Wikipedia, Eurasian brown bears steal kills from tigers: > [@](#): > > Brown Bears have also been found stealing the kills of Tigers, Wolves, and Pumas. In areas where Brown Bears and Siberian Tigers coexist, brown bears are opportunists who often follow tigers’s tracks to **dispute its kill**. “Dispute”? What an odd choice of word. Do the disputes go something like this? > [@](#): > > **Bear** : Hey Tiger, get away from my gazelle. > **Tiger** : What the — ? _Your_ gazelle? Are you nuts? P\*ss off! > **Bear** : I’ve been hunting this gazelle all morning, and I’m famished. Scoot. > **Tiger** : What the hell are you talking about? You were a mile away. I saw you lounging by the lake. Smelt you too, if you know what I mean. > **Bear** : I was calculating. _Strategizing._ Biding my time before I made my move. A good hunt has to be planned. You should know that. > **Tiger** : You didn’t _hunt_ anything! I did that! > **Bear** : No you didn’t. > **Tiger** : Wh—? Yes I did! > **Bear** : Nope. This is my kill. > **Tiger** : Oh, you liar! Then why I am I standing right over a gazelle with its neck ripped open? Why is my mouth all bloody? > **Bear** : Obviously you’re not flossing enough. You really should take better care of your gums. > **Tiger** : Oh for — I can’t believe this is happening again. It’s the third time this week. > **Gazelle** : Can I go now? > **Bear and Tiger** : Quiet! ---
**Author:** ![JThunder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e95f7d/32.png) [@JThunder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JThunder)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2006, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/37 "2006-05-22T21:49:59Z")
Full-sized Ditka or mini-Ditka? ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2006, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387/38 "2006-05-22T22:58:28Z")
> [@OneCentStamp](#): > > Followup question and partial hijack: if not a full grown Kodiak brown bear, what land animal _would_ be the ultimate cage fighter? A bat, man. If it was prepared. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lion-vs-bear/357387.md?page=1)