# Little Big Man **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 21, 2010, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313 "2010-05-21T23:04:56Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2010, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/1 "2010-05-21T23:04:56Z")
I saw it last night on AMC. I had seen it many years before, but my age had made me appreciate things I didn’t see before. It was surely a pro-Indian movie; made the white man seem evil as all hell. But then again, it made the Indians look stupid as well (the contrarian; the gay Indian out of place) especially with the final scene with Chief Dan George “dying” on top of the hill. I thought Custer was Hilarious! “The poison rises from the gooonads” great stuff… So was it a farce or social commentary? Great funny and deep flick all around… ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2010, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/2 "2010-05-21T23:54:51Z")
As I recall, the book was more even handed, and allowed the Indians to be petty and brutal as well. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2010, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/3 "2010-05-21T23:56:13Z")
> [@jtgain](#): > > I saw it last night on AMC. I had seen it many years before, but my age had made me appreciate things I didn’t see before. > > It was surely a pro-Indian movie; made the white man seem evil as all hell. But then again, it made the Indians look stupid as well (the contrarian; the gay Indian out of place) especially with the final scene with Chief Dan George “dying” on top of the hill. > > I thought Custer was Hilarious! “The poison rises from the gooonads” great stuff.. > > So was it a farce or social commentary? Great funny and deep flick all around.. It was a farcical social satire that is truly way deeper than it looks at first glance. One of my favorite movies. ---
**Author:** ![Anduinel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/848f3c/32.png) [@Anduinel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anduinel)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/4 "2010-05-22T00:00:55Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > As I recall, the book was more even handed, and allowed the Indians to be petty and brutal as well. Yeah. It starts with the same tribe who slaughtered Little Big Man’s tribe being the ones who adopt him (though only reluctantly, after he’s pretty much abandoned to them by his sister). And pretty much continues from there with just about everyone having their good and their despicable qualities, though I don’t recall the book having that much good to say about Custer either way. ---
**Author:** ![Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a9a28c/32.png) [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oslo_Ostragoth)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/5 "2010-05-22T05:28:58Z")
Awesome book, awesome movie. Do it in that order. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/6 "2010-05-22T05:58:43Z")
I had a LONG drawn out discussion typed out and then I realized I was mistaking **Little Big Man** with **Jerimaih Johnson**. 15 min wasted - I suck ☹ ---
**Author:** ![eenerms](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/cdc98d/32.png) [@eenerms](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eenerms)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/7 "2010-05-22T06:09:15Z")
I remember wanting to read the book when I was in Junior High,(ca.1970’s) I had to get my parents permission to check it out of the library!! Still don’t know what that was about.😕 ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/8 "2010-05-22T06:13:41Z")
FYI, there is a sequel to the book by the same author, _Return of Little Big Man_, further Wild West adventures. ---
**Author:** ![LawMonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/d6d6ee/32.png) [@LawMonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LawMonkey)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 6:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/9 "2010-05-22T06:22:18Z")
> [@zoid](#): > > I had a LONG drawn out discussion typed out and then I realized I was mistaking **Little Big Man** with **Jerimaih Johnson**. > > 15 min wasted - I suck > ☹ I’ve just watched both of these in the last week or so. 🙂 Enjoyed both, though JJ was a bit too slow in the pacing for me. I’m sort of exploring one of Little Big Man’s stages of life right now myself, so not going to say much more. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/10 "2010-05-22T06:28:20Z")
> [@zoid](#): > > I had a LONG drawn out discussion typed out and then I realized I was mistaking **Little Big Man** with **Jerimaih Johnson**. > > 15 min wasted - I suck > ☹ You want [the other thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=562435). You can just copy and paste what you wrote. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![C.Montgomery\_Burns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ecd19e/32.png) [@C.Montgomery\_Burns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C.Montgomery_Burns)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/11 "2010-05-22T14:22:26Z")
I always really enjoyed this movie, despite it being way over-the-top about “Indians are without sin and white people are evil simpletons”. But that depiction was fairly common in the late 60s/early 70s. Did you ever notice that out of all the different things Jack did, the only time he wasn’t a failure was when he was with the Cheyenne? His wife was stolen from him and his store was ran into the ground by a crooked partner. He could shoot, but quit when he saw someone get shot, and his sister abandoned him in disgust. He tried to be a scout for General Custer, but started fighting with the soldiers about slaughtering Indians. The preacher who took him in was a cruel jerk, and his wife was…a real piece of work. He was too honest to work with Merriwether the swindler. He was even a failure at being a worthless drunk and a hermit. ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/12 "2010-05-22T17:56:46Z")
> [@C.Montgomery\_Burns](#): > > But that depiction was fairly common in the late 60s/early 70s. In the 60s and 70s? It’s current now! See Avatar, etc. Little Big Man is the source of my favorite quote, which is applicable at least daily when you work in IT: \*“Some days, the magic works; some days it doesn’t”. \* ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/13 "2010-05-22T18:35:12Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > In the 60s and 70s? It’s current now! See Avatar, etc. > > Little Big Man is the source of my favorite quote, which is applicable at least daily when you work in IT: \*“Some days, the magic works; some days it doesn’t”. > \* That was awesome. He asked if he was still in this world and Jack Crabb said, “Yes, Grandfather”. The look on his face was priceless. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/14 "2010-05-22T18:42:02Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > FYI, there is a sequel to the book by the same author, _Return of Little Big Man_, further Wild West adventures. Give credit where credit is due. The author is Thomas Berger, who also write **Neighbors** (don’t judge it by the movie – if you read the book first, you’ll realize the movie is pretty good), and **Regiment of Women**. He’s an excellent writer. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/15 "2010-05-22T19:54:07Z")
I liked Dustin Hoffman’s little touch of using a cracker rural accent when speaking English, but using his normal accent when he is supposed to be speaking Cheyenne. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/16 "2010-05-22T20:51:16Z")
‘Now you just set there, and you’ll learn somethin’.’ ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/17 "2010-05-22T20:58:36Z")
Watching the movie now. I love Old Lodge Skins’s reaction when he finds out Caroline isn’t a man. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/18 "2010-05-22T21:02:44Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > In the 60s and 70s? It’s current now! See Avatar, etc. And it was a common thread through all of John Ford’s westerns, so it’s been around a lot longer than that. Although, granted, Ford was the exception; his view of Anglo-Native relations didn’t become commonplace till the 60s. ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/19 "2010-05-22T22:16:45Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > And it was a common thread through all of John Ford’s westerns, so it’s been around a lot longer than that. Although, granted, Ford was the exception; his view of Anglo-Native relations didn’t become commonplace till the 60s. “Indians are without sin and white people are evil simpletons” was absolutely not a common thread among John Ford westerns, and can only be generously applied to a small handful of his films (with still a couple of fingers left over). ---
**Author:** ![Ionizer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/5daacb/32.png) [@Ionizer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ionizer)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2010, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313/20 "2010-05-22T22:36:44Z")
I, too, saw this for the first time the other night (!). GREAT show, and now I absolutely must see it again as second (or third+) times are when things are better caught or comprehended - by me anyways. I was gonna start a thread re: the ‘gay’ Indian and if that type of thing was common and/or tolerated amongst various tribes. I got some more thinking to do on that, though. I also have all kinds of tribal folks locally (including next-door neighbor) that I could chat with should the opportunity present itself. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-big-man/540313.md?page=2)