# Little Women's Jo Vs Scarlet O'Hara **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 4, 2009, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937 "2009-12-04T02:58:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2009, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/21 "2009-12-05T04:19:49Z")
I’d ask about Rhett vs. Laurie, but we already know that Rhett would have Laurie hung by his nads. But then Amy would come and kick Careen’s ass to make up for it. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2009, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/22 "2009-12-05T04:26:22Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > I’d ask about Rhett vs. Laurie, but we already know that Rhett would have Laurie hung by his nads. But then Amy would come and kick Careen’s ass to make up for it. Careen wanted to be a nun, for Christ’s sake. Am I mixing my metaphors or something? ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2009, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/23 "2009-12-05T13:45:02Z")
Yeah, let’s not kick the nun’s ass. Now, If Jo wanted to take on Suellen, I would pay to see that. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/24 "2009-12-06T01:49:45Z")
I think everyone else is confusing cunning (Scarlett) and beautiful with strength. Look at June Allyson’s Jo: short, but stout. She could kick Scarlett all over the place. Scarlett, only learned to work hard much too late, and it didn’t last long. Once she married Frank, it was right to the office type of work. Jo, however, was used to the hard stuff. Also, go ahead and wipe up the floor with the nun. I, Protestant, have never met any of the Ingrid Bergman type nuns: gracious, and beautiful for a kicker. I have only met the ill natured kind. hh ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/25 "2009-12-06T01:58:10Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > I think everyone else is confusing cunning (Scarlett) and beautiful with strength. I believe the first sentence of GWTW is, “Scarlet O’Hara was not beautiful.” It is certainly in the first paragraph. ---
**Author:** ![LVBoPeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/858c86/32.png) [@LVBoPeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LVBoPeep)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/26 "2009-12-06T02:00:12Z")
What Scarlett lacks (if anything) in strength, I believe she’ll make up for it with pure spite. ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/27 "2009-12-06T02:18:57Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > How would any of them do against zombies? Scarlet would fight through the zombie horde with a shovel. Melanie would have the pistol she lifted from a dead Yankee, and Rhett would be covering them with his rifle. The zombies wouldn’t know what hit them. Also, I agree that Scarlet would kick Jo’s ass. She’s got the fighter’s instinct, the cunning, she’s willing to fight dirty, and she’s got the power of pure spite. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/28 "2009-12-06T04:17:54Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I believe the first sentence of GWTW is, “Scarlet O’Hara was not beautiful.” It is certainly in the first paragraph. In the first paragraph, it does indeed say that. However, i believe, no cite, that it does say something quite the opposite later. Not a big problem, because I love the book, but I seem to recall having noted the dichotomy. hh Besides, anybody who doesn’t think the Scarlett of the movie wasn’t beautiful is one sick puppy. But, OTOH, I thought that India was pretty hot. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/29 "2009-12-06T04:27:41Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > Besides, anybody who doesn’t think the Scarlett of the movie wasn’t beautiful is one sick puppy. Sir, there are films and there are books. ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2009, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/30 "2009-12-06T22:32:33Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > In the first paragraph, it does indeed say that. However, i believe, no cite, that it does say something quite the opposite later. Not a big problem, because I love the book, but I seem to recall having noted the dichotomy. Well, Scarlett is not “beautiful,” but certainly she’s arresting enough to turn men’s heads and get more attention than she knew what to do with (although, she could handle a lot.) I think MM’s point was maybe her features were too sharp to be defined as “beautiful” at the time, but she had marriage proposals from nearly all the young men of the County. I’ve always admired Scarlett. Yes, she was a pure-d bitch who ended up being shunned by the people that mattered, but unlike Ashley, who nattered on about the Gotterdammerung and got all nostalgiac for the Good Ol’ Days, she buckled down and dealt with the new things the best she could to save her family. Keep in mind, if there had been no war, she would have probably spent her life as Charles Hamilton’s wife, tending to his plantation, with occasional trips to Atlanta, and hounded him into an early grave. She certainly wasn’t supposed to pick cotton, shoot Yankees, and open up lumber mills. As she observes angrily, her mother’s teachings on how to be a Great Lady did her absolutely no good in the new world. ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/31 "2009-12-07T03:08:57Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > Well, Scarlett is not “beautiful,” but certainly she’s arresting enough to turn men’s heads and get more attention than she knew what to do with (although, she could handle a lot.) I think MM’s point was maybe her features were too sharp to be defined as “beautiful” at the time, but she had marriage proposals from nearly all the young men of the County. > > I’ve always admired Scarlett. Yes, she was a pure-d bitch who ended up being shunned by the people that mattered, but unlike Ashley, who nattered on about the Gotterdammerung and got all nostalgiac for the Good Ol’ Days, she buckled down and dealt with the new things the best she could to save her family. Keep in mind, if there had been no war, she would have probably spent her life as Charles Hamilton’s wife, tending to his plantation, with occasional trips to Atlanta, and hounded him into an early grave. She certainly wasn’t supposed to pick cotton, shoot Yankees, and open up lumber mills. As she observes angrily, her mother’s teachings on how to be a Great Lady did her absolutely no good in the new world. I mostly agree with this, except one thing. If there had been no war, she would have never married Charles Hamilton. Not even in a fit of pique. Scarlet is my hero for precisely those reasons. She’s flawed, but she kept her family (including Melanie) alive and she may not have always done the “right” thing, but she always did what it took to survive. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/32 "2009-12-07T03:51:09Z")
> [@pepperlandgirl](#): > > I mostly agree with this, except one thing. If there had been no war, she would have never married Charles Hamilton. Not even in a fit of pique. Agreed. Now, the Tarleton twins. After some thought, Mrs. Plant thinks it would have been one of them. I wonder if it wouldn’t have been something kinky with both of them, but I don’t think Scarlet thought that far ahead. She was all about attracting suitors and being courted, not deciding upon a single one and being a wife like her Mother. ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/33 "2009-12-07T17:40:52Z")
> [@pepperlandgirl](#): > > I mostly agree with this, except one thing. If there had been no war, she would have never married Charles Hamilton. Not even in a fit of pique. No? There still would have been a barbecue, Ashley would still be marrying Melanie, and Scarlett would still have overheard Honey trash-talking her. The war only pushed her to urge Charles not to wait on the wedding after he proposed…she still wanted to “hurt” everyone like a typical humiliated 16 year old girl. The only thing I could see is that if there had been no war, there would have been a protracted engagement, and either Scarlett would have come to her senses or Mammy and Mother would have urged her to go through with the wedding for propriety’s sake. ---
**Author:** ![Sigmagirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c89c15/32.png) [@Sigmagirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigmagirl)\ **Post date:** [December 7, 2009, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/34 "2009-12-07T18:44:16Z")
Charles would never had had the nerve to propose if he wasn’t going away to enlist. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/35 "2009-12-08T01:55:39Z")
Think of how many zombies could come after Scarlett. Three would have particular reasons to want to ‘brain’ her- her first two husbands and the Yankee bummer she (quite justifiably) killed, and possibly even Melanie. Then there’s her mother, her father, her daughter, the Tarleton twins, Jonas Wilkerson, and numerous others that she’d know by name, not to mention a few hundred thousand soldiers buried in Georgia and the surrounding states. Gives all new meaning to “The South shall rise again”. Still, once she got through the “it’s Pa but not really Pa” phase I think she’d do just fine making a stand in her mansion. She can afford a Gatlin gun and dynamite’s on the market by the time the book ends, and Ashley’s years of combat should have _some_ use. She might even win Rhett back, though the showdown would be when Rhett is confronted with zombie Bonnie. ---
**Author:** ![Sigmagirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c89c15/32.png) [@Sigmagirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sigmagirl)\ **Post date:** [December 8, 2009, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/36 "2009-12-08T14:00:12Z")
Ellen would be on Scarlett’s side. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/37 "2009-12-09T22:31:08Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > No? There still would have been a barbecue, Ashley would still be marrying Melanie, and Scarlett would still have overheard Honey trash-talking her. The war only pushed her to urge Charles not to wait on the wedding after he proposed…she still wanted to “hurt” everyone like a typical humiliated 16 year old girl. Plus the book makes it clear that she thinks it through more than just “this’ll show Ashley!” Even before the war Scarlett was greedy and spoiled and cunning, and while not particularly sexy or exciting Charles is very wealthy, easily controlled, adores her, and an orphan: tell me that’s not a teenaged girl’s dream match! None of these things escaped her attention when she accepted his proposal. Her parents (an odd match themselves: May-December, Huguenot-Irish Catholic, Old Money-New Money, etc.) probably approved for the same reasons even though they’d never heard her make a complete sentence about Hamilton before telling them she was going to marry him. ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2009, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/38 "2009-12-09T22:36:17Z")
> [@Sigmagirl](#): > > Charles would never had had the nerve to propose if he wasn’t going away to enlist. This. I don’t think Charles would have proposed to her at all, let alone as quickly as he did, in “normal circumstances”. And even if he had, I’m not convinced Scarlet would have gone through with the wedding. She would have at least extended the engagement as long as humanly possible, waiting for Ashley to come to his senses. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2009, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/39 "2009-12-10T04:01:01Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > Plus the book makes it clear that she thinks it through more than just “this’ll show Ashley!” Even before the war Scarlett was greedy and spoiled and cunning, and while not particularly sexy or exciting I don’t agree with “not particularly sexy or exciting.” She wasn’t beautiful, but your average Tarleton twin(1)doted on her; indeed, followed her about as their hounds followed them. She was what, fifteen in 1862? Going from being the Belle of the Ball 24 7 to Sherman’s Retreat, er, March to the Sea and Reconstruction never gave her a chance to settle down and straighten out. But I digress. 🙂 (1)Late teens who dealt with whiskey, firearms, being expelled from exclusive colleges and hiding their evil deeds and themselves from their Mother. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2009, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937/40 "2009-12-10T04:04:49Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I don’t agree with “not particularly sexy or exciting.” She wasn’t beautiful, but your average Tarleton twin(1)doted on her; indeed, followed her about as their hounds followed them. The not particularly sexy or exciting is in reference to Charles Hamilton. Two commas added below. > [@](#): > > and\*\*,\*\* while not particularly sexy or exciting\*\*, \*\*Charles is very wealthy, easily controlled, adores her, and an orphan [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/little-womens-jo-vs-scarlet-ohara/519937.md?page=3)