# Live Dog Vivisected in High School Biology Class. By the Teacher. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 16, 2005, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049 "2005-05-16T11:45:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 11:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/1 "2005-05-16T11:45:25Z")
Check the link. [http://www.local6.com/news/4480144/detail.html](http://www.local6.com/news/4480144/detail.html) another [http://www.sltrib.com/utah/ci\_2731883](http://www.sltrib.com/utah/ci_2731883) an editorial [http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/ci\_2737237](http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/ci_2737237) Mr. Doug Bjerregaard, I cannot fathom why you didn’t imagine this would explode in your face. ---
**Author:** ![user\_v1.05](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/5daacb/32.png) [@user\_v1.05](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/user_v1.05)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 11:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/2 "2005-05-16T11:55:50Z")
> [@Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor](#): > > Mr. Doug Bjerregaard, I cannot fathom why you didn’t imagine this would explode in your face. He’s an aged substitute teacher. No doubt he is bat-shit insane. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/3 "2005-05-16T12:25:55Z")
Vivisection used to be a regular part of the curriculum. In high school back in the 70’s, we pithed and vivsected frogs. In Bio II, there was a similar lab with a turtle. Given that this took place a veterinarian’s office, I’ll presume that the animal was properly anesthetized; even so, to do such a lab with high school students today was asking\_no, make that begging\_for a media shitstorm. ---
**Author:** ![Amp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Amp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amp)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/4 "2005-05-16T12:39:22Z")
So the principal was properly informed and stood behind it. Permission slips letting parents know what was going on were sent out and sent back in signed. This all seems on the up and up. Where is the problem? I don’t understand. ---
**Author:** ![RandomLetters](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8edcca/32.png) [@RandomLetters](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RandomLetters)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/5 "2005-05-16T12:40:02Z")
Can I just say I wish I had a teacher that cool, when I was back in High School? ---
**Author:** ![Spatial\_Rift\_47](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a8b319/32.png) [@Spatial\_Rift\_47](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spatial_Rift_47)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/6 "2005-05-16T13:06:36Z")
I would be with **Amp** on this one, except there weren’t any actual signed permission forms. As the second article states: > [@](#): > > A school secretary contacted parents of the nine biology students and eight gave verbal approval. One did not. A little less than up and up, if you ask me. That said, I think those eight parents should have spoken up beforehand, rather than now. ---
**Author:** ![Liz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/liz/32/17737_2.png) [@Liz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liz)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/7 "2005-05-16T13:11:20Z")
Hell, I’m a PeTA member and I don’t see a problem with this. The dog was going to be euthanized regardless of the vivisection; and, as long as the animal was sedated and felt absolutely no pain, then why not let the kids learn something from it? ---
**Author:** ![chaoticbear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f07891/32.png) [@chaoticbear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chaoticbear)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/8 "2005-05-16T14:13:57Z")
I don’t really see the problem either. The dog couldn’t feel it. He was going to be euthanized anyway. This took place in a vet’s office, so there’s no worry about whether or not things were done right. And these kids were in an Advanced Human Anatomy course. How _else_ are they going to learn - not memorize names of - things if not through dissection? Where are all the people crying about the cat that I spent half a semester dissecting earlier this year? ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/9 "2005-05-16T14:40:27Z")
> [@chatelaine](#): > > The dog was going to be euthanized regardless of the vivisection; and, as long as the animal was sedated and felt absolutely no pain, then why not let the kids learn something from it? > [@](#): > > sedation > > n 1: a state of reduced excitement or anxiety that is induced by the administrative of a sedative agent 2: the administration of a sedative agent or drug. Sedation does not in any way address pain perception. I sometimes will suture a laceration with a combination of sedation and local anesthesia. Dissection under sedation? The animal would be writhing and screaming. WAG the dog was given an anesthetic agent and the teacher is mis-speaking. > [@chaoticdonkey](#): > > He was going to be euthanized anyway. When I was in veterinary school, we did non-survival surgeries on research beagles. They were purpose bred animals purchased from a USDA source. When a classmate investigated the possibility of getting dogs from the local shelter that were going to be euthanised anyway, the shelter refused (PR reasons). > [@chaoticdonkey](#): > > This took place in a vet’s office, so there’s no worry about whether or not things were done right. You have way more faith in an individual based only on his/her occupation than I do. I speak from experience. There are bad people who are doctors, janitors, priests, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Shirley\_Ujest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/45deac/32.png) [@Shirley\_Ujest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shirley_Ujest)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/10 "2005-05-16T14:41:47Z")
I don’t see a problem with this. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Bird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Little\_Bird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Bird)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/11 "2005-05-16T14:55:17Z")
I see no problem here, either. The second article said all the kids were fine with it. If it was done on a frog no one would have had any issues. I wish people would get away from “cute and fuzzy = protected.” ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/12 "2005-05-16T15:12:41Z")
> [@Little Bird](#): > > I wish people would get away from “cute and fuzzy = protected.” But the law does treat mammals differently from other animals in regards to what is _legal_. I think from an animal welfare point of view, what was done _may_ have been illegal. If a lab uses dogs or cats they have very specific legal issues and have forms to file. I doubt that was done here. While I have no problem with dissection of a dog/cat/human cadaver in an educational setting, I do have a problem with a teacher not following the law. ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/13 "2005-05-16T15:18:45Z")
I do not have the time to go through the aplicable USDA laws regarding animal welfare, however I will offer this webpage: [http://www.nal.usda.gov/awic/legislat/usdaleg1.htm](http://www.nal.usda.gov/awic/legislat/usdaleg1.htm) > [@](#): > > Public Law 91-579 Animal Welfare Act of 1970 > Enacted December 24, 1970, Public Law 91-579 expands the list of animals covered by the Act to include all warm-blooded animals determined by the Secretary of Agriculture as being used or intended for use in experimentation or exhibition except horses no t used in research and farm animals used in food and fiber research. Exhibitors are incorporated into the act and research facilities are defined. Retail pet stores, state and county fairs, rodeos, purebred dog and cat shows, and agricultural exhibition s are exempt from the Act. The Secretary is directed to develop regulations regarding recordkeeping and humane care and treatment of animals in or during commerce, exhibition, experimentation, and transport. There is also mention of inspections, and appropriate anesthetics, analgesics, and tranquilizers. There are further regulations on dog and cat commerce. I doubt from what I have read about the teaching exercise that it was “kosher”. I cannot condone a teacher ignoring the law. ---
**Author:** ![CynicalGabe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@CynicalGabe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CynicalGabe)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/14 "2005-05-16T15:52:41Z")
> [@user v1.05](#): > > He’s an aged substitute teacher. No doubt he is bat-shit insane. Have you ever met one who isn’t? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Prancer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8dc957/32.png) [@Prancer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prancer)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/15 "2005-05-16T15:54:39Z")
The biggest problem I have with it is I know it would’ve been horrible for me to go through as a high school student. I almost threw up when I had to hold a jar that had a preserved dog’s heart infected with heartworms in it on a Girl Scout trip to the local vet’s. I had nightmares of dropping that jar for weeks. I just read the first story. Did the others mention if the students could opt out or the experience with no penalties? ---
**Author:** ![picunurse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7bcc69/32.png) [@picunurse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/picunurse)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/16 "2005-05-16T16:00:59Z")
> [@Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor](#): > > Check the link. > [http://www.local6.com/news/4480144/detail.html](http://www.local6.com/news/4480144/detail.html) > > another > [http://www.sltrib.com/utah/ci\_2731883](http://www.sltrib.com/utah/ci_2731883) > > an editorial > [http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/ci\_2737237](http://www.sltrib.com/opinion/ci_2737237) > Mr. Doug Bjerregaard, I cannot fathom why you didn’t imagine this would explode in your face. I read a different version, which I can’t find now. It said that the class went to a Vet’s office where the procedure was being done. The teacher didn’t do any cutting, the Vet did it. The kids were told in advance and given the choice to opt out. I’ll continue to look for it. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/17 "2005-05-16T16:12:57Z")
I don’t see any problem here. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/18 "2005-05-16T16:22:26Z")
“Hi, I’m Troy McClure, you may remember me from educational films like _A Visit to the Slaughterhouse_ …” Somehow this seems very Simpsons-like. (What kind of Sub makes such an elaborate lesson preparation?) ---
**Author:** ![Amp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Amp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amp)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/19 "2005-05-16T16:27:20Z")
> [@Paul in Saudi](#): > > (What kind of Sub makes such an elaborate lesson preparation?) The kind that really care about the children man. The children. ---
**Author:** ![Trunk](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/87869e/32.png) [@Trunk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trunk)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2005, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049/20 "2005-05-16T16:30:45Z")
Who’s a vivisected doggie? You are. You’re a vivsected doggie! Yes hims is. Hims is such a cute widdew vivisected doggie. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/live-dog-vivisected-in-high-school-biology-class-by-the-teacher/304049.md?page=2)