# Living Fossils.. Large ones **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 3, 2003, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954 "2003-07-03T04:55:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/1 "2003-07-03T04:55:48Z")
I remember reading in The Lost World (Crichton not Doyle) that there was some kind of giant reptilian creature that the local pygmy tribes would tell stories about in a jungle in central Africa. I’m aware that it was a work of fiction, but it was mentioned on the same lines as the Loch Ness Monster, and I heard the same story elsewhere also. Has anyone heard of this? And has anyone heard of an expedition that discovered any evidence of it? ---
**Author:** ![Drabble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8491ac/32.png) [@Drabble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drabble)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 5:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/2 "2003-07-03T05:12:48Z")
I feel it mostly has to do with people uncovering fossils, and then imagining what it must have been like. Most people can tell dino bones are reptilian, and pygmys would have a good idea with how much they take apart wild animals to eat…there must be smaller reptiles around them they have taken apart ---
**Author:** ![MaryEFoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@MaryEFoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaryEFoo)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/3 "2003-07-03T05:46:00Z")
Try the word “cryptozoology”. There have been expeditions IIR. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/4 "2003-07-03T05:49:53Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dutchboy208 \* > \*\*I remember reading in The Lost World (Crichton not Doyle) that there was some kind of giant reptilian creature that the local pygmy tribes would tell stories about in a jungle in central Africa. I’m aware that it was a work of fiction, but it was mentioned on the same lines as the Loch Ness Monster, and I heard the same story elsewhere also. Has anyone heard of this? And has anyone heard of an expedition that discovered any evidence of it? \*\* There was a dinosaur hunter (amature palentologist) who claimed that his expedition had found it, but all his film got ruined when his canoe overturned, so he couldn’t provide any pictures.:dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/5 "2003-07-03T05:53:45Z")
The pygmies claimed the creature was alive, not a fossil, IIRC, and I’m doubtful that they would identify bones as reptilian; the first dinosaur bones discovered in the West were believed to be the bones of giant prehistoric hominids by those who found them, and the pygmies would have much less of a scientific background… ---
**Author:** ![detop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bcef8e/32.png) [@detop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/detop)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 6:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/6 "2003-07-03T06:45:21Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by MaryEFoo \* > \*\*Try the word “cryptozoology”. There have been expeditions IIR. \*\* Try “Mbokele Mbembe” instead. ---
**Author:** ![Dragon\_Phoenix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bcef8e/32.png) [@Dragon\_Phoenix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dragon_Phoenix)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/7 "2003-07-03T06:49:06Z")
[http://www.mokelembembe.com/](http://www.mokelembembe.com/) ---
**Author:** ![Rocketeer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocketeer/32/4437_2.png) [@Rocketeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rocketeer)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/8 "2003-07-03T15:14:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Tuckerfan \* > \*\*There was a dinosaur hunter (amature palentologist) who claimed that his expedition had found it, but all his film got ruined when his canoe overturned, so he couldn’t provide any pictures.:dubious: \*\* Would that have been Professor George Edward Challenger? I seem to recall that some accident resulted in loss of nearly all photographic evidence that supported his (frankly) incredible account of his findings in the Amazonian jungle, and that the Royal Society is currently fitting out an expedition to independently investigate his claims. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/9 "2003-07-03T17:26:37Z")
Two very interesting accounts of searches for the Mokele-Mbembe, by two of the best travel writers around: [Drums Along the Congo: On the Trail of Mokele-Mbembe, the Last Living Dinosaur](http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0395587077/ref=pd_ts_travel_11/103-7199043-4945443?v=glance&s=travel&n=639550), by Rory Nugent [No Mercy: A Journey to the Heart of the Congo](http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0679737324/qid=1057253260/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-7199043-4945443?v=glance&s=books), by Redmond O’Hanlon ---
**Author:** ![everton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecb155/32.png) [@everton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/everton)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/10 "2003-07-03T18:11:22Z")
A little while ago I saw a BBC documentary about some British naturalists searching the Congo for mokele-mbembe. [This is what the BaAka people told them.](http://www.bbc.co.uk/nature/programmes/tv/congo/picpops/bli_prog2_1.shtml) ---
**Author:** ![j.c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/73ab20/32.png) [@j.c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j.c)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/11 "2003-07-03T19:56:19Z")
Everton, thanks! That was a great link. I, like Drabble, always assume people like the BaAka may have some fanciful notions, but also a good idea of what animals live in their area and what those animals do. On the other hand, I feel that British naturalists, for instance, are not always the best listeners. This is a great story of solving of mystery. ---
**Author:** ![everton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecb155/32.png) [@everton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/everton)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2003, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-fossils-large-ones/185954/12 "2003-07-03T21:00:16Z")
It’s easy to imagine how these things can go awry. [This site](http://www.mokelembembe.com/), for instance, tells about a story from as recently as 1997 about some explorers visiting the Likouala region in which some locals were asked to describe mokele-mbembe and they drew a picture of a sauropod. Was that an accurate picture of an animal they’d or a version of a camp-fire legend they knew, or one they’d only heard about from their ancestors, mixed up with something the last bunch of explorers had seemed to want to hear from them? The guys making the documentary were primed with the dinosaur hunter imagery we all might have in mind. The BaAka were happy to take them to a good place to see their monster (presumably for a small fee). En route, one of the BaAka guys saw the field guide sticking out of a rucksack. The naturalists hadn’t shown them the book (because it didn’t have any pictures of dinosaurs in), but the BaAka guys were amazed by it. They’d never seen a book before, much less one full of pictures of their local stock. They were pointing at each picture in turn, reciting the local names for them and swapping anecdotes about how to hunt them, whether they made good eating or not etc. When the got to the relevant page they leaped up and pointed at the picture of the rhino, telling the naturalists that that was the animal they were supposed to be looking for. It didn’t look like a set-up to me. On some previous occasion, you can imagine them trying to describe a rhino to outsiders, calling it big and dangerous, and impossible to hunt. No doubt they’d add bits of stuff from their camp fire stories about magical powers and the like. The outsiders would ask “Big? How big?” “Really big.” “What, as big as a tree?” “Er, yeah, if you like. Some of them are as big as a tree.” And so the legend is born.