# Living while black in America **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 9, 2018, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611 "2018-07-09T21:17:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 45
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 7:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/883 "2018-09-13T07:49:54Z")
Huh, interesting. Thanks, **pool** , for eradicating some ignorance there. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/884 "2018-09-13T11:03:50Z")
**pool** , thank you. Now, in that I found this, “We did not adjust for paternal age due to a high percentage of missing information, especially for children of black mothers (19%)”. Ignoring that incredibly sloppy writing - does that 19% refer to all missing information, or just black mothers? - I believe that this is a reflection of decades of policies that destabilized black families and discourage black women from marrying their children’s fathers. Of course, I could be wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Huey\_Freeman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/huey_freeman/32/251_2.png) [@Huey\_Freeman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huey_Freeman)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/885 "2018-09-13T13:42:29Z")
> [@pool](#): > > Dude you are a fucking idiot and don’t know what the hell you’re talking about. My ex used to work with developmentally disabled men, women, and children. There are tons of black kids and for that matter mixed kids that have autism. The overwhelming majority of their patients were black, but that is anecdotal. > > Autism isn’t as simple as genetics, there are thought to be environmental and autoimmune aspects as well, its a multi-faceted phenomenon, its not that well understood a disorder. There is also an interesting trend of rising rates among immigrant children or children of immigrant mothers, which I think helps to suggest there is a lot of unknown environmental risk factors. > > Not to mention that people with less money are probably not as likely to have their children, diagnosed or they may be diagnosed at a much later age. > > [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4067639/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4067639/) > > Actually every source I’ve been able to find also says that black males also have higher rates of mental retardation, although I’m not as inclined to include that as though it can be concomitant with autism it can also be a separate medical issue. > > [https://www.cdc.gov/MMWR/PREVIEW/mmwrhtml/00040928.htm](https://www.cdc.gov/MMWR/PREVIEW/mmwrhtml/00040928.htm) > > You have an obvious bitter resentment towards white people, and in my opinion are a fucking troll at worst, and at best a complete moron. So, what exactly are you disputing? That inbred strains of rats and mice aren’t use to model autism? Is that what you’re disputing? I sure hope so because I have a shit-ton of Pubmed cites to drop. I’m\* begging \*you to dispute that. Or are you disputing that whites do not exceed people of color in the rates of autism? Well, you’re wrong on boh counts. Your cites are either ancient (1996, really?) or either describe “foreign-born” blacks as having high rates of autism. Why didn’t “foreign born blacks” give you pause? These aren’t the blacks your demographic group wrested from Western Africa because they were too lazy to pick their own crops, these are blacks that have primarily immigrated to this country from Somalia. Indeed, in 2014, the government published a [study](https://factor.niehs.nih.gov/2014/1/spotlight-ASDSomali/index.htm) examining the prevalence of autism in Minnesota. The study found that the rates of autism in blacks (1 in 62) and hispanics (1 in 80) was lower than whites (1 in 36) and Somalians (1 in 32). ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/886 "2018-09-13T13:54:42Z")
Either way, you’re off base to say my kids are “cursed” with autism. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/887 "2018-09-13T14:41:23Z")
> [@Huey\_Freeman](#): > > So, what exactly are you disputing? That inbred strains of rats and mice aren’t use to model autism? Is that what you’re disputing? I sure hope so because I have a shit-ton of Pubmed cites to drop. Thanks for the recent data, but can you explain about the inbred strains? Because it is my understanding that when researches want a strain of subject animals with a specific characteristic, they keep breeding individuals with the characteristic together. How are autism mice more inbred than other strains of research mice? Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/888 "2018-09-13T16:08:26Z")
> [@j666](#): > > **pool** , thank you. > > Now, in that I found this, “We did not adjust for paternal age due to a high percentage of missing information, especially for children of black mothers (19%)”. Ignoring that incredibly sloppy writing - does that 19% refer to all missing information, or just black mothers? AFAICT it means that the researchers could not determine the age of the father in 19% of the cases of black children with autism. If that is any clearer. So if they had X number of cases of autism in children, Y were black children, .19 \* Y = number of cases of black children whose paternal age could not be determined. Apparently 19% of Y was a large enough number to mean that the impact of paternal age on X could not be determined with enough confidence to draw conclusions. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/889 "2018-09-13T16:51:33Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > AFAICT it means that the researchers could not determine the age of the father in 19% of the cases of black children with autism. If that is any clearer. So if they had X number of cases of autism in children, Y were black children, .19 \* Y = number of cases of black children whose paternal age could not be determined. Apparently 19% of Y was a large enough number to mean that the impact of paternal age on X could not be determined with enough confidence to draw conclusions. > > Regards, > Shodan Oddly enough, I KNOW how to do simple math. What I don’t know is. does the 19% refers to all cases, or just cases with black mothers? There is no information included to determine that. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/890 "2018-09-13T16:57:49Z")
It means cases with black mothers - 19% of them did not report the age of the father. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/891 "2018-09-13T17:57:42Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > It means cases with black mothers - 19% of them did not report the age of the father. > > Regards, > Shodan How do you know? ---
**Author:** ![Ruken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f475e1/32.png) [@Ruken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ruken)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/892 "2018-09-13T18:18:50Z")
> [@j666](#): > > How do you know? Because he’s a native English speaker and the sentence isn’t ambiguous. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/893 "2018-09-13T19:57:11Z")
> [@Huey\_Freeman](#): > > Let me get this straight. You have a kid with autism, so you have compassion toward autistic people and call out what you perceive as bigotry. This is commendable and kudos to you. But just a few posts later, you derisively label an entire people and culture as inferior and backward. This is so predictable for white folks. White folks are the only people to walk the earth who have no compassion for anyone except people who look like themselves or their loved ones. It’s like there is an inhumane deficit of empathy and compassion from white people toward those who are different. Fucking predictable. That’s fine. I’ll treat you like ya’ll treat us. Do you know why you have not\* one\* but\* two \*kids with autism? It’s because they are inbred. In a way, the high rates of autism in white folks is a testament to the power of whiteness. White folks are pathologically attracted to themselves - their blue eyes, their blond hair, their aquiline noses, their pale skin, their perceived status, their privilege - and are sexually repulsed by everything else that isn’t white or very similar to European features. Hey, did you know mouse and rat models of autism use inbred strains? Go ahead, look it up because [autism speaks](https://www.autismspeaks.org/science/grants/genetics-restricted-repetitive-behavior-inbred-mouse-model). It’s a shame, too. If you had a child with a person of color, your children would likely not be autistic (and you would be as hateful toward people of color). In your quest to bequeath the power of whiteness and white privilege to your progeny, you have, instead, cursed them to live as a disabled minority under the federal protection of the Americans with Disabilities Act. The truth hurts. Do you know the only ethnic group that surpasses you white folks in the rates of autism? Somalis. And that’s because they culturally marry their first cousin. You can look that up, too. Lol. Oh the irony! Let me ask you this who actually worked to end global slavery? Who sold Africans to begin with? I’d be confused as well if some of my ancestors sold some of my other ancestors. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/894 "2018-09-13T20:26:49Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Lol. Oh the irony! Let me ask you this who actually worked to end global slavery? Abolitionists. > [@](#): > > Who sold Africans to begin with? Slavers. > [@](#): > > I’d be confused as well if some of my ancestors sold some of my other ancestors. God what a hateful post overall. This may be the most hateful post I’ve ever seen you make. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/895 "2018-09-13T20:42:14Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > God what a hateful post overall. This may be the most hateful post I’ve ever seen you make. Consider the source. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/896 "2018-09-13T21:28:03Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > This is all very interesting and I don’t doubt the scientific validity of what you describe. It makes sense. > > There’s only one thing I dispute about it, but it’s a doozy. I don’t believe autism is a “curse”. If there were some sort of pill or other treatment that was guaranteed to “cure autism” (I guess that would mean making someone neurotypical), I would not authorize it for my kids, although I’d let them make their own choice upon attaining majority. This is not true of how I’d feel about other disabilities: I’m fairly sure I’d be eager to give a blind child vision or enable a wheelchair-bound child to walk. But my wife and I agree on this, as does every parent of a child with autism I have met (which is quite a few). Whereas I doubt this is a common feeling among parents of kids who are blind or in a wheelchair. > > ETA: This idea that only impact, rather than intention, matters is one that was also discussed on the latest Sam Harris Waking Up podcast. It’s a terrible and very dangerous idea, as it seems to be increasingly influential. Are autistic children capable of the same parent-bonding early in life that (many) believe is so important to later-in-life development and positive, healthy relationships in adulthood? I ask you this as you have an autistic child. Im guessing your answer will be some variety of “yes”, based on the above post. What makes a condition a “disability” rather than just a characteristic? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/897 "2018-09-13T21:35:11Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Are autistic children capable of the same parent-bonding early in life that (many) believe is so important to later-in-life development and positive, healthy relationships in adulthood? I ask you this as you have an autistic child. Im guessing your answer will be some variety of “yes”, based on the above post. What makes a condition a “disability” rather than just a characteristic? I’m not **SlackerInc** , but I would imagine it depends on where they are on the spectrum. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/898 "2018-09-13T21:37:52Z")
> [@Huey\_Freeman](#): > > Let me get this straight. You have a kid with autism, so you have compassion toward autistic people and call out what you perceive as bigotry. This is commendable and kudos to you. But just a few posts later, you derisively label an entire people and culture as inferior and backward. This is so predictable for white folks. White folks are the only people to walk the earth who have no compassion for anyone except people who look like themselves or their loved ones. It’s like there is an inhumane deficit of empathy and compassion from white people toward those who are different. Fucking predictable. That’s fine. I’ll treat you like ya’ll treat us. Do you know why you have not\* one\* but\* two \*kids with autism? It’s because they are inbred. In a way, the high rates of autism in white folks is a testament to the power of whiteness. White folks are pathologically attracted to themselves - their blue eyes, their blond hair, their aquiline noses, their pale skin, their perceived status, their privilege - and are sexually repulsed by everything else that isn’t white or very similar to European features. Hey, did you know mouse and rat models of autism use inbred strains? Go ahead, look it up because [autism speaks](https://www.autismspeaks.org/science/grants/genetics-restricted-repetitive-behavior-inbred-mouse-model). It’s a shame, too. If you had a child with a person of color, your children would likely not be autistic (and you would be as hateful toward people of color). In your quest to bequeath the power of whiteness and white privilege to your progeny, you have, instead, cursed them to live as a disabled minority under the federal protection of the Americans with Disabilities Act. The truth hurts. Do you know the only ethnic group that surpasses you white folks in the rates of autism? Somalis. And that’s because they culturally marry their first cousin. You can look that up, too. The presentation and reception of your arguments are all seriously injured by your myopic view of “white people”. You ironically paint with the same broad brush that you so viciously attack in the amorphous blob you call white people. It does you a disservice because you clearly devote a lot of thought to your posts. There isnt all that much that separates you, a black man, and me (for example) a white man, _inherently_. It is culturally and historically that we have such sharply deviating paths. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/899 "2018-09-13T21:44:50Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Why the hell should they? This is their home too. Let the racist assholes leave – they’re the ones with the problem. Amen to that. If the racist assholes don’t like living here in a civilized manner, then THEY can GTFO. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/900 "2018-09-13T21:55:07Z")
> [@Ruken](#): > > Because he’s a native English speaker and the sentence isn’t ambiguous. Yes, it is. There are two groups, and the sentence does not clearly indicate to which the percentage refers. You can keep arguing, but it won’t make you right. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/901 "2018-09-13T22:01:01Z")
This has been bothering, and every time I see the post quoted, it bothers me more. > [@Huey\_Freeman](#): > > … White folks are pathologically attracted to themselves - their blue eyes, their blond hair, their aquiline noses, … Where do you live? That describes maybe three people I know, and two of them are related. You’re starting to humiliate yourself. [Yes, the rest of the post was much, much meaner, but this is the Pit. It’s supposed to be mean. It doesn’t have to be completely inaccurate.] ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2018, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/902 "2018-09-13T22:29:07Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Abolitionists. > > Slavers. > > God what a hateful post overall. This may be the most hateful post I’ve ever seen you make. Perhaps you should parse with the same precise and critical eye the post I was responding to. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611.md?page=44) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611.md?page=46)