# Living while black in America **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 9, 2018, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611 "2018-07-09T21:17:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 49
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/963 "2018-09-14T22:44:22Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > So you maintain that it’s the correct impulse? :dubious: > > And if it doesn’t matter that we’re Democrats, what was the purpose of your comment about voting? I wouldn’t have until this thread, but this has been eye-opening. But don’t deflect - if you didn’t think it would alter the sentence you did quote, why did you leave it out? As for voting, I was talking about your entire coterie of pigmently challenged pigmaphobics, not just your family. If they refrain from voting for racists, they will fall on my spectrum of allowed voters. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/964 "2018-09-14T23:13:39Z")
> [@j666](#): > > I wouldn’t have until this thread, but this has been eye-opening. > > But don’t deflect - if you didn’t think it would alter the sentence you did quote, why did you leave it out? Because I wanted a laser focus on something you seemed to have missed. That doesn’t change the fact that it’s wrong to paint all white people with the same brush. Or even white men: as I have pointed out before, there are as many non-Hispanic white male voters in the U.S. as black male, black female, Hispanic male, and Hispanic female voters combined. If white men were the mirror image of black women in voting patterns, we’d be in a heap of trouble since only one in 25 black women votes Republican but among white men it’s about 9 in 25 voting Democratic. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/965 "2018-09-14T23:20:25Z")
> [@j666](#): > > Of course there is. I can continue to engage you, pointing out your poor arguments and hypocrisy, your casual and explicit racism, probably sexism and assorted phobia, and there is not a damn thing you will do about it, because you will not leave this post as long as there is one person disagreeing with you and pointing out your errors. > > Shit for brains. You haven’t done any of those things yet. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2018, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/966 "2018-09-14T23:21:32Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Because I wanted a laser focus on something you seemed to have missed. That doesn’t change the fact that it’s wrong to paint all white people with the same brush. Or even white men: as I have pointed out before, there are as many non-Hispanic white male voters in the U.S. as black male, black female, Hispanic male, and Hispanic female voters combined. If white men were the mirror image of black women in voting patterns, we’d be in a heap of trouble since only one in 25 black women votes Republican but among white men it’s about 9 in 25 voting Democratic. You expect consistency from that fool? ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 1:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/967 "2018-09-15T13:50:56Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Because I wanted a laser focus on something you seemed to have missed. That doesn’t change the fact that it’s wrong to paint all white people with the same brush. Or even white men: as I have pointed out before, there are as many non-Hispanic white male voters in the U.S. as black male, black female, Hispanic male, and Hispanic female voters combined. If white men were the mirror image of black women in voting patterns, we’d be in a heap of trouble since only one in 25 black women votes Republican but among white men it’s about 9 in 25 voting Democratic. I did not miss it; I find it irrelevant, and much diluted by the rest of the sentence. I did not bring up political party, because that is not the issue; the issue is racism, or more specifically in this digression, pigmaphobia. As for painting all white people with a broad brush, well, payback’s a bitch. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/968 "2018-09-15T13:58:34Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > You haven’t done any of those things yet. > [@octopus](#): > > You haven’t done any of those things yet. Yes, I have, repeatedly. You refuse to acknowledge the specific issues I have pointed out in your posts, just reverting to the eight-year-old’s technique of “Did not!” and “You are too!”, personal insults, and projection. > [@octopus](#): > > You expect consistency from that fool? Case in point. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/969 "2018-09-15T16:48:29Z")
> [@j666](#): > > I did not miss it; I find it irrelevant, and much diluted by the rest of the sentence. > > I did not bring up political party, because that is not the issue; the issue is racism, or more specifically in this digression, pigmaphobia. > > As for painting all white people with a broad brush, well, payback’s a bitch. Fighting ancient racism with current racism is why the far left is an intellectual and moral joke. ---
**Author:** ![holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e95f7d/32.png) [@holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/holmes)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/970 "2018-09-15T17:26:53Z")
Ancient? I am 55 years old. I have been alive longer than Black people have had full rights in this country. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/971 "2018-09-15T18:38:58Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Fighting ancient racism with current racism is why the far left is an intellectual and moral joke. Who’s talking about ancient racism, other than you? No one is talking about ancient anything. You can’t just make these random claims on a message board _ **because everyone can just scroll back and read the posts.** _ Again, just dishonesty and deflection. Okay, maybe I missed something. Please, find posts in this thread about ancient racism. Then we can discuss how they related to my post to which you were replying. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/972 "2018-09-15T18:54:51Z")
> [@holmes](#): > > Ancient? I am 55 years old. I have been alive longer than Black people have had full rights in this country. Well, there is that. You got a great point. > [@j666](#): > > Who’s talking about ancient racism, other than you? No one is talking about ancient anything. > > You can’t just make these random claims on a message board _ **because everyone can just scroll back and read the posts.** _ Again, just dishonesty and deflection. > > Okay, maybe I missed something. Please, find posts in this thread about ancient racism. Then we can discuss how they related to my post to which you were replying. Look, you, Huey, MrDibble all have valid points. But you won’t make progress quicker by promoting or engaging in group stereotypes while denouncing others that do what you are doing. The hypocrisy is counterproductive. ---
**Author:** ![j666](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de0a6/32.png) [@j666](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/j666)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/973 "2018-09-15T19:06:55Z")
This is the fucking Pit, not GD. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/974 "2018-09-15T19:36:12Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > One of the things that I feel about deafness is that the decision of parents of children with this disability to not seek treatment is similar to the decision of parents of children with autism to not seek treatment. So I do not believe you feel exactly the same as I do about deafness. > > Both deafness and autism are disabilities. I take it you’re not familiar with the Deaf Community. They get VERY angry at the notion of Deafness being seen as a disability. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/975 "2018-09-15T20:25:05Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > I take it you’re not familiar with the Deaf Community. They get VERY angry at the notion of Deafness being seen as a disability. If deafness is not a disability, then what is? Does the word “disability” have any meaning? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/976 "2018-09-15T20:29:30Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > Because I wanted a laser focus on something you seemed to have missed. That doesn’t change the fact that it’s wrong to paint all white people with the same brush. Or even white men: as I have pointed out before, there are as many non-Hispanic white male voters in the U.S. as black male, black female, Hispanic male, and Hispanic female voters combined. If white men were the mirror image of black women in voting patterns, we’d be in a heap of trouble since only one in 25 black women votes Republican but among white men it’s about 9 in 25 voting Democratic. Well, here’s the thing, for the vast majority of history, white males have in fact voted as a block to ensure the continuation of white male power. It is not all that surprising that many white males still vote in ways to protect that legacy. What should be surprising is that we have become civilized enough, that white males have enough power and wealth to consider sharing it with others, that white males have been willing to vote in ways that enable other demographics to more fully participate in our society. That the party that has held onto its racist ways is not favored by the minorities who have had a long history of oppression at the hands of white males should not surprise you all that much. Sure, selfish, greedy white males with short attention spans and outlooks will vote for the party that promises to keep them on top. So, yeah, the demographics who have been, and still are oppressed are going to vote in block for the party that seems to be less likely to continue that oppression. You aren’t going to get the same solidarity of voting in people who are not fighting against oppression. So, sure, you got plenty of white males that will vote as a block to try to keep minorities in their place, but they are not driven there by some random internet tweet, they go there because they are racist, and want to hang out with like minded people. Any claims that they were driven there are just rationalizations to do what they wanted to do anyway. If they were worried about social inequalities, then they would not cry and complain and run to the racists for support because someone one twitter hurt their feelings. You are not being driven from the liberal side, that is just your inner concern troll trolling. You are looking for excuses and justifications that you can put forward to try to rationalize your association with very hateful bigots, racists, homophobes and misogynists. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [September 15, 2018, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/977 "2018-09-15T21:12:26Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Only your white ancestors? I call fiction. You honestly believe black Africans weren’t and aren’t slavers? Not the South African ones, no, learn some actual fucking slavery history - but that’s irrelevant, anyway, because AFAIK my Black African ancestry is 0%. > [@](#): > > None of what you says makes any sense. Well, we’ve already established you’re almost certifiably stupid, so that’s no surprise. ---
**Author:** ![mikecurtis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikecurtis/32/3284_2.png) [@mikecurtis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mikecurtis)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2018, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/978 "2018-09-16T02:02:56Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > If deafness is not a disability, then what is? Does the word “disability” have any meaning? Throughout our history such things as dark skin, short stature, being female, being gay, etc., have been considered disabilities; so no, I would say the term holds no valid meaning. And, humans have extremely poor hearing (and eyesight for that matter) compared to the rest of the animal kingdom and especially when the spectrum of what could be heard (and seen) is taken into consideration, so we’re all disabled in that regard. Compared to [the great wax moth](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galleria_mellonella) and [the mantis shrimp](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mantis_shrimp) we’re pikers. and I dont hear any uproar that we are insensitive and cruel parents and family members for not insisting that we all fix that. Why aren’t the scientists working on artificial moth ears and mantis shrimp eyes? Dont they know how unfair it is to go around with plain ol’ human ones. it’s a disgrace! and as far as you self righteous judgemental busybodies are concerned, how dare you look down on someone for accepting another for who they are and not insisting that they change themselves. We should be working together to make society easier to navigate for the deaf, or blind, or autistic, or wheelchair bound, or whatever “disability” you think makes it hard to succeed. Change society, not people. mc ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2018, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/979 "2018-09-16T04:22:54Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > I take it you’re not familiar with the Deaf Community. They get VERY angry at the notion of Deafness being seen as a disability. I’m quite familiar with the Deaf Community. I am also familiar with the fierce prejudice and hostility with which they attack any hard’of-hearing person who decides what’s best for **themselves** and their own lives is work to improve upon their conditions as best as possible. I fail to see what any of this has to do with the point you responded to, which was my view that there is significant similarity between parents’ decision to avoid treatment for autism with parents’ decisions to avoid treatment for deafness. Just because a group of deaf adults exists who believe their deafness doesnt impair the quality/functionality of their lives doesn’t mean every hard of hearing person will share that belief. ---
**Author:** ![Ambivalid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a5b964/32.png) [@Ambivalid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ambivalid)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2018, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/980 "2018-09-16T04:45:37Z")
> [@mikecurtis](#): > > and as far as you self righteous judgemental busybodies are concerned, how dare you look down on someone for accepting another for who they are and not insisting that they change themselves. We should be working together to make society easier to navigate for the deaf, or blind, or autistic, or wheelchair bound, or whatever “disability” you think makes it hard to succeed. > > Change society, not people. > > mc Jesus Christ. I see the Euphemism Treadmill keeps on keepin’ on. Now “disability” is verboten? Look man, there is objective fact to disability. I am physically paralyzed from the waist down. There are certain thing things, certain activities, I simply cannot perform. There are certain places I simply cannot go. And there are othere things and activities I _can_ do but in a more time-consuming/accomodated way. It’s is to not recognize reality to say that my physical condition does not put limits on what I can do in/with my life and that my life is not made more difficult as well. “Accepting someone for who they are” is EXACTLY what everyone should be doing. Part of doing this means accepting another person’s autonomy and self-determination. And this is exactly what people like those in the Deaf Community explicitly do not do. ---
**Author:** ![mikecurtis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mikecurtis/32/3284_2.png) [@mikecurtis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mikecurtis)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2018, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/981 "2018-09-16T06:16:49Z")
> [@Ambivalid](#): > > Jesus Christ. . . you can just call me mike > [@](#): > > There are certain thing things, certain activities, I simply cannot perform. There are certain places I simply cannot go. And there are othere things and activities I can do but in a more time-consuming/accomodated way. It’s is to not recognize reality to say that my physical condition does not put limits on what I can do in/with my life and that my life is not made more difficult as well. we all have things we cannot do, and places we cannot go, and if you life is more difficult than mine it’s because we’ve built our society to make it so; not because of your “disability.” > [@](#): > > “Accepting someone for who they are” is EXACTLY what everyone should be doing. Part of doing this means accepting another person’s autonomy and self-determination. And this is exactly what people like those in the Deaf Community explicitly do not do. the “deaf community” (whatever that is) doesn’t give a fuck about cochlear implants or who chooses to use them or not. They do have a problem with calling deafness a disability and is something that needs to be fixed. That hearing is better than not, and anyone who doesnt want to hear is some sort of mental defective; [why wouldn’t you want to hear? are you nuts? your life would be so much easier.](https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2013/08/understanding-deafness-not-everyone-wants-to-be-fixed/278527/) Science is a wonderful thing, and every day there are new discoveries in how our bodies work and in technologies to change from one state to another and anyone should be free to take advantage of those discoveries, or not, with out being judged. Hearing is not better than deafness, seeing is not better than blindness, and walking is not better than rolling. Since this thread is called _living while black_, let’s turn it around. A black person in America today: there are places they cannot go and things that they cannot do. Would you call being black a disability? Would you encourage black people to change their color if there was some sort of “magical cure”? I’m pretty sure your answer would be “no” There is nothing wrong with being black, if their life is harder than mine it’s because we’ve built barriers into our society, and the best way to remedy that is to tear down those barriers, not ask them to change who they are. mc ---
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2018, 6:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611/982 "2018-09-16T06:25:41Z")
> [@mikecurtis](#): > > the “deaf community” (whatever that is) doesn’t give a fuck about cochlear implants or who chooses to use them or not. They do have a problem with calling deafness a disability and is something that needs to be fixed. They’re wrong and stupid in addition to deaf. Deafness is _absolutely_ a disability, to the degree that “disability” means _anything_. What’s next, the blind aren’t disabled? Quadriplegics aren’t disabled? The deaf lack one of the fundamental senses we use to examine the world around us, and this is harmful to the them - the main reason it’s not _more_ harmful is because society takes steps to accommodate for them. > [@](#): > > That hearing is better than not, and anyone who doesnt want to hear is some sort of mental defective; Um… Duh? _Duh?!_ Would you deafen your children intentionally? (And if your answer is yes, _holy shit please never have children you fucking monster!_) > [@](#): > > Science is a wonderful thing, and every day there are new discoveries in how our bodies work and in technologies to change from one state to another and anyone should be free to take advantage of those discoveries, or not, with out being judged. Hearing is not better than deafness, seeing is not better than blindness, and walking is not better than rolling. Then why haven’t you blinded yourself? It’d save us the trouble of reading your bullshit. Why haven’t you cut off your legs? Why haven’t you deafened yourself? > [@](#): > > Since this thread is called _living while black_, let’s turn it around. A black person in America today: there are places they cannot go and things that they cannot do. Would you call being black a disability? …Wow, that’s gross. Fuck you. (And in case you’re wondering _why_ this argument is bullshit, it’s because a deaf person is deaf and suffers from not being able to hear _regardless_ of the actions of others; black people suffer the effects of racism only when other people impose it upon them. It’s why homosexuality is not considered a mental illness. There is a huge difference between “society looks down on us for shitty reasons” and “my body literally does not work”.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611.md?page=48) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/living-while-black-in-america/817611.md?page=50)