# Liz Wheeler has some wacky gun stats, from where? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [April 13, 2021, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liz-wheeler-has-some-wacky-gun-stats-from-where/939920 "2021-04-13T19:03:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 6\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Stoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stoid/32/272_2.png) [@Stoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoid)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2021, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liz-wheeler-has-some-wacky-gun-stats-from-where/939920/1 "2021-04-13T19:03:03Z")
I was just exposed today to a Liz wheeler/OAN video on Facebook dated March 2017. It’s called “Why Women Deserve the Right to an AR15”. In the video, she slings around some truly bizarre statistics with robust and twinkly eyed confidence and a smear of lipstick, but no citations. Nor much in the way of definitions. Liz teaches us that: - Gun -" related" incidents per year total “approximately” 2,581,268 Which break down as - Self-defense 2,549,596 - Assaults 31,000 I want to stop and note that as she was citing these particular statistics the expression on her face was, to my eyes, as good as if she was winking at her audience in acknowledgment of how much shit she was full of. She continued: - Gun owners kill 1500 criminals per year, vs the mere 600 per year killed by the (clearly slacking) police. - Women use guns over 200,000 times per year to successfully save them selves from sexual assault - “Guns are used 80 times more often to save a life than take a life” So I did some very serious googling and configured my queries many different ways, but alas, my efforts turned up absolutely no trace of where she might have faceplanted into such exotic numbers. I’m just consumed with wondering if she actually fished them directly from her own (no doubt impeccably groomed) ass, or borrowed them from someone else’s. So does anyone here have any idea? ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2021, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liz-wheeler-has-some-wacky-gun-stats-from-where/939920/2 "2021-04-13T19:09:10Z")
The 2.5 million self-defense number probably comes from a guy named Gary Kleck who extrapolated from a small sample size: > **[Gary Kleck](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Kleck)** > > Pages for logged out editors learn more > > > Gary Kleck (born March 2, 1951) is a criminologist and the David J. Bordua Professor Emeritus of Criminology at Florida State University. > Kleck was born in Lombard, Illinois, to William and Joyce Kleck. He attended Glenbard East High School before enrolling in the University of Illinois Urbana-Champaign, where he received his BA (1973), MA (1975), and PhD (1979), all in Sociology. There’s a podcast called “Science Vs” that critiques the big self-defense number: > **[Guns | Science Vs](https://gimletmedia.com/shows/science-vs/z3hlvr/guns)** > > The gun lobby says firearms keep us safe by protecting us against bad guys and reducing the crime rate. But, what does the science say? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2021, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liz-wheeler-has-some-wacky-gun-stats-from-where/939920/3 "2021-04-13T19:30:02Z")
In 1987 there were 23,854 suicides by gun. Unless she calls suicide an assault, she must consider it self defense. Or she’s lying. ---
**Author:** ![Bootb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19b73/32.png) [@Bootb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bootb)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2021, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liz-wheeler-has-some-wacky-gun-stats-from-where/939920/4 "2021-04-13T23:29:11Z")
Here’s some more information. It’s HARD to get good figures on this sort of thing, which is why the estimates are all over the place. > **[We know how many people are killed by guns. How many are saved?](https://www.straightdope.com/21343884/we-know-how-many-people-are-killed-by-guns-how-many-are-saved)** ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2021, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liz-wheeler-has-some-wacky-gun-stats-from-where/939920/5 "2021-04-14T01:11:04Z")
It’s too bad my wife is no longer available to ask how creepy he was in high school. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2021, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/liz-wheeler-has-some-wacky-gun-stats-from-where/939920/6 "2021-04-14T01:20:23Z")
This makes no sense at all.