# Log Cabin Republicans Trash Obama's decision to support gay marriage **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 9, 2012, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430 "2012-05-09T21:29:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/81 "2012-05-10T16:38:16Z")
I generally don’t have much of a beef with the Log Cabin Republicans. Gay rights are obviously important to me, but they aren’t the most important thing. If we lived in a world where, somehow, the Republicans and Dems had all the same policy positions they do in real life, but their positions on gay rights were reversed, I’d probably still vote Democrat. So, I don’t mind too much when a queer decides to back the Republican party at the expense of the gay rights movement. At least, nit any more than when a straight person votes Republican. However, having made the decision to place gay rights at the bottom of the list if their concerns, the Log Cabin has forfited the right to criticize other people on this issue. My view on Obama’s declaration isn’t that far off from **magellan** ’s, and I’ve got a lot of problems with Obama’s history with gay rights, but he’s stil done a thousand times more for gay rights than these miserable fucks in the Log Cabin. Criticizing him for this statement, while endorsing Mitt fucking _Romney?_ These assholes need to die in a fire. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/82 "2012-05-10T16:41:55Z")
> [@fumster](#): > > The easy way to go after OBL was to launch a cruise missile. No US soldiers would have been at risk, but we would never be sure he was really dead. Instead, Obama sent in the Seals who shot OBL in the head and took pictures of his body. > > The easy way on DADT was to let the courts decide it, but instead Obama pursued a legislative solution and slowly got the military brass itself on-board. Now DADT is truly dead; it’s been shot between the eyes and it’s not coming back. I agree, and thing that **Der Trihs** is just stretching a point because he does not like Obama (or any politician at all for that matter) ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/83 "2012-05-10T16:45:45Z")
I think they simply have the cart in front of the horse. The position that sexual orientation has nothing at all to do with conservative/liberal politics is correct and sensible. But they want to pretend that is a present fact, and not something than needs to be realized and achieved. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/84 "2012-05-10T16:52:06Z")
> [@fumster](#): > > Well, unless he was lying, Romney said he would not. In response to Obama saying: > > > [@](#): > > > > If we have actionable intelligence about high-value terrorist targets and President Musharraf won’t act, we will.” > > Romney said: > > > [@](#): > > > > “I do not concur in the words of Barack Obama in a plan to enter an ally of ours… I don’t think those kinds of comments help in this effort to draw more friends to our effort” Thanks fumster; I came in to post this exact exchange. **magellan01** , Are you even aware of what Republican leaders SAY IN PUBLIC? The presumptive _candidate_ for the Republicans said he would NOT have made the decision to go after Osama in Pakistan. And you’ll note that I was not Idolizing Obama, nor fawning over him. I said he made a couple of gutsy decisions. That was just too much for you to bear, eh? ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/85 "2012-05-10T17:22:32Z")
> [@fumster](#): > > Well, unless he was lying, Romney said he would not. In response to Obama saying:Romney said: :roll eyes: Go read his whole statement, and others. This is simply bullshit that you really, really want to be true. Only one problem: it ain’t. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/86 "2012-05-10T17:36:12Z")
Well, that certainly settles that! ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/87 "2012-05-10T17:40:13Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > :roll eyes: Go read his whole statement, and others. This is simply bullshit that you really, really want to be true. > > Only one problem: it ain’t. Please find some statements of Romney’s that back up your premise. I’m not going to do your work for you. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/88 "2012-05-10T18:11:22Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > And besides, I dance like a white guy… Fred Astaire, or Gene Kelly? ---
**Author:** ![gamerunknown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/6bbea6/32.png) [@gamerunknown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gamerunknown)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/89 "2012-05-10T18:21:18Z")
There are Christian Marxists too. That said, I doubt they’d criticise Hélder Câmara while urging their party to adopt Leninist views and reject populism. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/90 "2012-05-10T19:26:03Z")
> [@Eve](#): > > Fred Astaire, or Gene Kelly? More akin to Stephen Hawking. But that’s how I roll… ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/91 "2012-05-10T20:02:15Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Meh, they hate themselves more than anyone. Nothing but pity for those poor self-loathing souls. Indifference. I leave them to the hell of their lown making. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/92 "2012-05-10T20:06:59Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > Actually if Romney came out in favor of gay marriage I would first fall out of my seat and stunned surprise, and then comment how amazing it was that he actually took a stand I agreed in for once, giving him full credit. I would still think he is a weasel who should not be anywhere near the presidency, but I would admire his courage in that instance. If Romney did come out for it he’d A: say he had always been for it, B: claim that Obama and Biden had only been for it because of him and C: he was actually behind the Stonewall Riots. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/93 "2012-05-10T20:07:42Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > Actually if Romney came out in favor of gay marriage I would first fall out of my seat and stunned surprise, and then comment how amazing it was that he actually took a stand I agreed in for once, giving him full credit. I would still think he is a weasel who should not be anywhere near the presidency, but I would admire his courage in that instance. I don’t believe he ever took a stand in his life, or at least any where he said plainly what he stood for and then stuck with it instead of fipflopping or lying. Besides, according to the papers (Washington Post etc) he used to enjoy bullying “suspected gays” when in his posh preppy school - and didn’t even have big enough balls to do it on his own, he had his “clique” help him. Plus he’s a Mormon. I’m still furious at the utah Mormons for interfering in California issues (Prop 8). So to hell with Romney. So in short, I agree with your appraisal of him. “Weasel” is too mild a word. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Lowry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e95f7d/32.png) [@Sam\_Lowry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Lowry)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/94 "2012-05-10T21:35:24Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > I generally don’t have much of a beef with the Log Cabin Republicans. Gay rights are obviously important to me, but they aren’t the most important thing. If we lived in a world where, somehow, the Republicans and Dems had all the same policy positions they do in real life, but their positions on gay rights were reversed, I’d probably still vote Democrat. So, I don’t mind too much when a queer decides to back the Republican party at the expense of the gay rights movement. At least, nit any more than when a straight person votes Republican. > > However, having made the decision to place gay rights at the bottom of the list if their concerns, the Log Cabin has forfited the right to criticize other people on this issue. My view on Obama’s declaration isn’t that far off from **magellan** ’s, and I’ve got a lot of problems with Obama’s history with gay rights, but he’s stil done a thousand times more for gay rights than these miserable fucks in the Log Cabin. Criticizing him for this statement, while endorsing Mitt fucking _Romney?_ These assholes need to die in a fire. Right. Words are important and it’s great that Obama said he supports gay marriage. But even more important are actions, and Obama has done a fair amount for gay rights. I posted [this article](http://bobcesca.com/blog-archives/2012/05/the-presidents-lgbt-successes.html) in the thread in Elections, but it seems good to post here as well. It’s a good summary of what Obama has done in regards to gay rights. ---
**Author:** ![Li\_l\_Pluck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ee59a6/32.png) [@Li\_l\_Pluck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Li_l_Pluck)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/95 "2012-05-10T23:57:27Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I can’t believe this controversy. Politics is not like ordering from the takeout window at McDonalds. Obama had faced a ridiculously obstructionist congress, coming from the opposition and his own party, and he has worked step by step to effect changes in the face of staunch opposition. He has come up short a few times, but you just have to ask yourself one question: > > “Will this get better when Mitt Romney is President?” > > This election is a dead heat, and there aren’t any signs that people will come out to support Obama the way they did in 2008, and plenty of signs that people will come out to oppose him like they didn’t in 2008. **So if you want something to complain about, keep complaining, and President Romney will give you something to complain about** (emphasis mine). This. Absolutely this. [QUOTE=tomndebb] The various commentators getting in a huff that he “delayed” the implementation are factually wrong and politically stupid. [/QUOTE] And this, too. Honestly, Obama has pissed me off a few times, too (which I knew he would do when I voted for him), but I do wish that my fellow queens would grow the fuck up, stop being so pissy, try to grasp the political realities that the man has been dealing with, and just shut the fuck up and work to get him re-elected. He’s done more for gay rights than any other president, and they still can’t give him credit? Damn. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2012, 11:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/96 "2012-05-10T23:59:46Z")
Seems to me that the pace of this change has caught a lot of people off guard. Its very interesting when that happens. Remember when we were first encouraged to adopt “Ms.” as the female equivalent to “Mr.”? Compared to changes in racial attitudes, to take a grim example, the speed of our shift in attitudes towards teh gay is astonishing. Maybe as progressives, we are so inured to the glacial and vexing pace of positive change, we get perplexed when good things happen more quickly that we expect. We are suited up for a three-hundred inning game, that’s what we are ready for, the long hard slog. One minute, you’re straining to pull the stubborn mule forward, the next minute you’re hanging onto the rope for dear life, scraping along the road. Which is really a drag. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/97 "2012-05-11T00:04:10Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Criticizing him for this statement, while endorsing Mitt fucking _Romney?_ These assholes need to die in a fire. Have the Log Cabin Republicans endorsed Mitt Romney yet? I don’t think they have. They’ve made statements in the primary that he was one of the more gay-friendly candidates, but I don’t think there’s been an actual endorsement, and in fact, they just criticized him today for coming out against gay marriage and civil unions: > [@](#): > > “Governor Mitt Romney’s statement in opposition to not just marriage but civil unions jeopardizes his ability to win moderates, women and younger voters, especially as a large majority of Americans favor some form of relationship recognition for their LGBT friends and neighbors. Ultimately, the response of the Republican candidates this election cycle will determine not just endorsements by Log Cabin Republicans, but the votes of millions of Americans who are simply tired of the culture wars.” ---
**Author:** ![Enlightening\_Meditation](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ecc23a/32.png) [@Enlightening\_Meditation](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enlightening_Meditation)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/98 "2012-05-11T03:46:47Z")
If I remember correctly… I thought that Obama campaigned on DADT repeal, ordered the top military brass to conduct a study about repeal consequences (national security, soldiers’ input, outline a transition plan, etc) after assuming office, asked the DoJ/courts/whoever to let the legislative process take care of repeal after the military study was finished (the military brass did not want sudden intervention by federal courts), the Republicans and a few Dems filibustered the next defense spending bill that included a DADT repeal amendment (before the military study report had been released, but after the House version of the defense bill passed), then The Senate finally voted to repeal DADT in a smaller bill separate from the main defense spending bill (House did too) during the lame duck session 2010 soon after the military released a report with results of its study of repeal. And that study took a long time…over a year I think. After all that, Obama was finally able to sign the repeal bill. What else could he have done to speed up the process? I don’t think that the Log Cabin Pubs 'trash’ed Obama’s sudden explicit support for gay marriage. Rather, they were ridiculing him for previously straddling the middle…support for civil unions, but not gay/lesbian marriage…to try and please as many voters as possible. They think he should have supported G/L marriage a long time ago. Naturally, I agree that their reaction to a Romney flop in favor of G/L marriage would spawn a favorable reaction from LCRs. I support equal contractual rights among couples of all varieties involving whether you call them marriages, gayrriages, or lerriages. As a straight libertarian leaning independent, I am always happy when the right wing gets outraged. ---
**Author:** ![mister\_nyx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@mister\_nyx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mister_nyx)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/99 "2012-05-11T03:55:27Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > This desire to build up Obama as a hand of guts and decision makes me chuckle. > > As far as OBL, he deserves a pat on the back sure. But, really, the credit goes to the men and women who figured out where he was, devised a plan, and executed it. As President, they needed his approval. He signed off on it. Does anyone really think that there is another member of congress or who wouldn’t have given the same approval? Please. He did the right thing. I’m glad he did and he should be proud of it. But, come on! > > As far as this latest profile in courage, he was FORCED to act by Biden’s big mouth. He and Axelrod must have been fuming mad. The fact is that he always was in favor of SSM, he just knew that the smart political thing to do was to lie about it. > > My point is that even if you think he made the right call on OBL and SSM, trying to paint either as some amazingly courageous thing is laughable. The funny thing is how if you read any of the accounts of the tough decision, the one that the GOP failed to make, you have to force yourself to believe the precise opposite of reality in order to convince yourself that the argument you’re making here is true. Because there is so much evidence that it was, in fact, a tough decision that required real guts to make (as well as, of course, the previous leadership that made it possible at all.) ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [May 11, 2012, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430/100 "2012-05-11T15:41:48Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Please find some statements of Romney’s that back up your premise. I’m not going to do your work for you. So, it’s my job to make sure that you understand what is going on before you form an opinion? Interesting. [Oh, what the hell:](http://2012.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/05/mitt-romney-obamas-wrong-about-my-old-pakistan-quote.php?ref=fpa) > [@](#): > > In August 2007, Obama was under fire from then-candidates Hillary Clinton, John McCain and Joe Biden for stating plainly that he would act unilaterally to get bin Laden if he was found to be in Pakistan and the government there could not be trusted to help. Romney joined the fray himself, telling reporters, “I do not concur in the words of Barack Obama in a plan to enter an ally of ours. … I don’t think those kinds of comments help in this effort to draw more friends to our effort.” He added that troops “shouldn’t be sent all over the world” and that Obama’s remarks were “ill-timed” and “ill-considered.” > > But Romney didn’t leave it at that: Under questioning in a Republican primary debate shortly afterward, he essentially endorsed Obama’s position while attacking him for saying it out loud: > > ROMNEY: It’s wrong for a person running for the president of the United States to get on TV and say, “We’re going to go into your country unilaterally.” Of course, America always maintains our option to do whatever we think is in the best interests of America. But we don’t go out and say, “Ladies and gentlemen of Germany, if ever there was a problem in your country, we didn’t think you were doing the right thing, we reserve the right to come in and get them out.” We don’t say those things. We keep our options quiet. We do not go out and say to a nation which is working with us, where we have collaborated and they are our friend and we’re trying to support Musharraf and strengthen him and his nation, that instead that we intend to go in there and potentially bring out a unilateral attack. > > Romney is right to object to suggestions he took killing bin Laden completely off the table. But since he had to explain himself at the time, the Obama camp has at least a little room of their own to needle him on it. Let the parsing begin. So, now we have a fuller context to judge. But let’s add tho that, shall we, by looking at what others said in response to that same comment from Obama: From Hilary: > [@](#): > > “I am concerned about talking about it. I think everyone agrees that our goal should be to capture or kill bin Laden and his lieutenants, but how we do it should not be telegraphed and discussed for obvious reasons." > > – Then-Sen. Hillary Clinton talking to ABC News about Obama’ threat of unilateral strikes inside Pakistan. From Biden: > [@](#): > > “In order to look tough, [Barack Obama has] undermined his ability to be tough were he president, because if you’re going to go in to Pakistan – which is already our policy, by the way, if there’s actionable intelligence – you need actual intelligence from moderates in Pakistan working with you. Now, if you’re already going to say ‘I’m going to disregard whatever the country thinks and going to invade,’ the likelihood of you getting the cooperation you’re going to need evaporates. It’s a well-intended notion that he has, but it’s a very naïve way of figuring out how you’re going to conduct foreign policy.” And, as a reminder, the quote from Romney: > [@](#): > > "I do not concur in the words of Barack Obama in a plan to enter an ally of ours… I don’t think those kinds of comments help in this effort to draw more friends to our effort.” > > – Then Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney, when asked by reporters on the campaign trail on Aug. 2, 2007 about Obama’s comments. Horrible, just horrible… :roll eyes: Now, tell me, do you think that Biden and Hilary would also have chosen to NOT get bin Laden of represented with the same opportunity Obama was given? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/log-cabin-republicans-trash-obamas-decision-to-support-gay-marriage/621430.md?page=6)