# Loki TV series discussion (spoilers) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** disney-hulu\ **Created:** [January 27, 2021, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625 "2021-01-27T18:06:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2021, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/61 "2021-06-10T16:11:08Z")
My theory is that this Loki and the one doing the killings are the same one. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2021, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/62 "2021-06-10T16:31:42Z")
Casting spoilers: Sophia di Martino has been cast in an as-yet-unnamed role, but there’s a lot of speculation that she’s going to be a female Loki - if so, I’m guessing Girl!Loki is the one killing all the TVA agents. Which doesn’t rule out it also being the same Loki Tom Hiddlestone is playing, of course. If you freeze frame on his TVA file, his gender is listed as “fluid.” ---
**Author:** ![borschevsky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/97f17d/32.png) [@borschevsky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/borschevsky)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2021, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/63 "2021-06-10T16:52:17Z")
I quite liked the first episode. I agree with the speculation that the Loki they’re chasing will turn out to be the same Loki we see here. It’s a bit of a trope in time-travel stories, but it can be quite effective when done well. As with most time-travel stories, I find myself getting caught up (maybe too much) in the mechanics of how things work. Like in the first scene with Mobius in France, one of the agents says this is “the sixth attack in the last week”. What does a _week_ mean in this context? At the end of that same scene, another agent comes through the portal to give Mobius the file on Loki. The impression is that he rushed this information to Mobius, but they’re time travelling, so what’s the need for anyone to rush? Can’t that guy portal over to 1549 any time he wants, from his perspective? So it seems that maybe there’s some kind of synchronization between the time inside in the TVA and events happening in “real” time. It’ll probably mostly be handwaved away, which is likely best for the narrative of the show, but it’s fun to think about. ---
**Author:** ![gdave](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gdave/32/3683_2.png) [@gdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gdave)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2021, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/64 "2021-06-10T17:21:51Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > I do wonder if TVA employees, officers, and agents are actually part of the timeline, or are they outside of it? They may be the only beings with free will, and also the ones most aware of the consequences of exercising it. Where do they come from? I wonder if all of them started out as a variant, being recruited into the ranks as a condition for staying their execution, or “resetting” as they euphemistically call it. That could be the entire reason for the song and dance of a trial, not to determine their guilt, as they are obviously guilty if they are there, but to determine their usefulness to the organization. > [@Miller](#): > > That one guy who’d never heard of a fish seemed to indicate that he’d spent his entire existence behind a desk, so I think the TVA guys - or at least some of them - are specially created beings made just for this job. Yeah, I thought that guy pretty clearly indicated he had literally spent his whole life behind a desk, hence not knowing what a “fish” was. In the comics, All of the TVA personnel are clones specifically created and implanted with skills and personalities to work in specific niches in the TVA. Which seems consistent with what we’ve seen of them in _Loki_. As to the Mysterious Dangerous Variant, Mobius says that it’s Loki, and that makes his interview of Loki make sense - he’s gathering intel on Loki from Loki. But the show is _very_ coy about not revealing the Figure even after that. So, I agree, probably FemLoki. Which would go along with the gender fluid designation, and the comics where Loki had a female incarnation, and for that matter the original Norse myths where Loki at one point became female and bore Sleipnir, Odin’s eight-legged horse. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2021, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/65 "2021-06-10T17:54:54Z")
Sorry, I’ve only just come back to this. As the OP, please feel free to change the title - maybe to just **Loki TV series discussion (spoilers)**. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2021, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/66 "2021-06-10T18:23:04Z")
Change made. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Rata\_Sum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a698b9/32.png) [@Rata\_Sum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rata_Sum)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2021, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/67 "2021-06-10T18:50:08Z")
> [@Uniqueorn](#): > > Lastly, how does Owen WIlson still get work? He is horrible in anything he does (actually, he was okay in Midnight in Paris.) Ah, I was surprised and happy when Owen Wilson popped up. ---
**Author:** ![Noelq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/noelq/32/16438_2.png) [@Noelq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Noelq)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2021, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/68 "2021-06-10T18:51:18Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Casting spoilers: > > Sophia di Martino has been cast in an as-yet-unnamed role, but there’s a lot of speculation that she’s going to be a female Loki - if so, I’m guessing Girl!Loki is the one killing all the TVA agents. > > Which doesn’t rule out it also being the same Loki Tom Hiddlestone is playing, of course. If you freeze frame on his TVA file, his gender is listed as “fluid.” He’s a shapeshifter. Its about as fluid as you can get 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2021, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/69 "2021-06-10T19:25:34Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > My theory is that this Loki and the one doing the killings are the same one. Umbrella’s Number 5 … ish. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2021, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/70 "2021-06-10T22:53:30Z")
One detail I appreciated: the machine that determines if you’re a secret robot, and then destroys you if you are, had a lot of carbon scoring on its inside. Apparently, that machine gets used a lot. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2021, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/71 "2021-06-11T00:43:42Z")
The entire episode was worth it for when Loki looks for his ticket. Enjoyed the episode - looking forward to things as the story progresses. ---
**Author:** ![Rata\_Sum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/a698b9/32.png) [@Rata\_Sum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rata_Sum)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2021, 5:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/72 "2021-06-11T05:02:36Z")
I liked Loki’s, “please don’t be a robot” face as he stepped into the machine. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2021, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/73 "2021-06-11T12:46:14Z")
> [@borschevsky](#): > > As with most time-travel stories, I find myself getting caught up (maybe too much) in the mechanics of how things work. Like in the first scene with Mobius in France, one of the agents says this is “the sixth attack in the last week”. What does a _week_ mean in this context? At the end of that same scene, another agent comes through the portal to give Mobius the file on Loki. The impression is that he rushed this information to Mobius, but they’re time travelling, so what’s the need for anyone to rush? Can’t that guy portal over to 1549 any time he wants, from his perspective? So it seems that maybe there’s some kind of synchronization between the time inside in the TVA and events happening in “real” time. The clock in San Dimas is always running. ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2021, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/74 "2021-06-11T13:17:24Z")
I wondered if Loki was meant to see his own death in the theatre and Mobius simply hadn’t gotten there yet, or if that will be an unexpected bit of information he’ll use down the road? Because they were trying to get him to see the error of his ways, but **not** that he really doesn’t have another choice. How many Variants of how many people do they deal with from time to time? Perhaps a whole Variant team? And now they can simply pluck out anything they don’t like and use it from Netflix or other shows. And I’ll be interested to see what Richard E. Grant is doing. Will he be Evil!Loki? ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2021, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/75 "2021-06-11T15:00:46Z")
> [@Love\_Rhombus](#): > > And I’ll be interested to see what Richard E. Grant is doing. Will he be Evil!Loki? He should totally be EvilOldLoki, in 1790s France, posing as the [Scarlet Pimpernel](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Scarlet_Pimpernel_(TV_series)). ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2021, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/76 "2021-06-11T15:44:10Z")
> [@Banquet\_Bear](#): > > …one other thing: I was sceptical about Head Writer Michael Waldron. He had a lighter resume than Malcolm Spellman (Head Writer for Falcon and the Winter Soldier) and we saw how that turned out. > > [Michael Waldron - IMDb](https://www.imdb.com/name/nm5642271/) > > Only one writing credit prior to Loki. Then gets given the keys to a million dollar TV show and then a movie. Many of the gags & other elements in _Loki_ (Timeline police, apathetic office bureaucrats in charge of running the universe, walk-through security scanners that automatically atomize robots, handheld devices/collars that lets you skip/rewind time) would feel right at home on an episode of _Rick and Morty_ ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2021, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/77 "2021-06-11T15:58:28Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > To establish that Free Will does not exist in the MCU ( other than within the TVA)? Not a good outcome. I don’t think that they invalidate free will. From your point of view, people in the past can only take the actions they took, that doesn’t mean they didn’t have will when it was their present. The TVA’s perspective from the end of time sees the entire universe’s existence this way. They erase people that deviate from the timeline they desire, but the person gets to make the decision. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2021, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/78 "2021-06-11T16:50:41Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > I don’t think that they invalidate free will. From your point of view, people in the past can only take the actions they took, that doesn’t mean they didn’t have will when it was their present. > > The TVA’s perspective from the end of time sees the entire universe’s existence this way. They erase people that deviate from the timeline they desire, but the person gets to make the decision Right. Loki still chose to escape. The TVA was just going to erase him for it. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2021, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/79 "2021-06-11T17:17:50Z")
If we posit a multiverse where all decisions are realized, where there is a universe where you had fruity pebbles this morning, and another where you had eggs and toast, you don’t really have free will, as you were predetermined to do both of those things. If the universe in which you had fruity pebbles is then annihilated, that doesn’t really return that free will to you. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2021, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625/80 "2021-06-11T17:53:15Z")
This is more the opposite. The universes in which you did not choose Fruity Pebbles, all of them and they contain, all the sentient beings, everything, are all erased, just as Thanos erased just half of all of just one universe. For the greater good of course. Only the predetermined sacred choices (major or trivial) are able to be made, by Time Keeper edicts, ruthlessly enforced by a bureaucratic operation. No universe in which an Avenger made a choice other than that determined to be sacred is allowed to continue. Even if it was Stark picking Frosted Flakes instead of Fruity Pebbles. It is only within the TVA where decisions are not predetermined and enforced. Neither the workers of the TVA, or the Time Keepers themselves even, know what this Loki variant will choose to do, or “should” do as part of their chosen path, while within the TVA. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/loki-tv-series-discussion-spoilers/931625.md?page=5)