# Look for the union label **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 2, 2012, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644 "2012-11-02T09:20:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 9:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/1 "2012-11-02T09:20:14Z")
Another example of the ill-effects that come from powerful unions. > [@](#): > > The hurricane-ravaged east coast has been receiving north Alabama help, but crews from Huntsville Utilities learned they’ll be doing work in Long Island, New York instead of in New Jersey. > > Crews from Huntsville, as well as Decatur Utilities and Joe Wheeler out of Trinity headed up there this week, but Derrick Moore, one of the Decatur workers, said they were told by crews in New Jersey that they can’t do any work there since they’re not union employees. > > The crews that are in Roanoke, Virginia say they are just watching and waiting even though they originally received a call asking for help from Seaside Heights, New Jersey. > > The crews were told to stand down. In fact, Moore said the crew from Trinity is already headed back home. When a union’s territory is so jealously guarded that non-union help is refused even under these circumstances, the union influence is not benign. It’s toxic. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/2 "2012-11-02T13:58:23Z")
Lets have some balance then, how about the ill effects from powerful employers? How many of those will make a nice profit out of the misery of those who have pretty much lost everything they ever owned? Unions are a response to the excesses of business, but in turn they can also abuse their own power. So? Are all employers and all unions bad for us? Not at all and this is a supreme example of being selective to confirm a personal bias. One union appears to be doing something pretty awful, its not a stick to beat t he remained of the organised labour movement about the head with - you are just using it as a pretext to put forward another agenda. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/3 "2012-11-02T14:09:56Z")
Is there any confirmation about this story? WAFF-TV seems to be the only source and they are located in Alabama. So far this is a story about someone in Alabama saying someone in NJ told him that someone else in NJ told him that non-union workers weren’t wanted there. ---
**Author:** ![Jenaroph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Jenaroph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jenaroph)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/4 "2012-11-02T14:29:22Z")
From the[Jersey Shore Hurricane News](https://www.facebook.com/JerseyShoreHurricaneNews) facebook page: > [@](#): > > Getting bombarded by questions asking, “How come you’re not reporting the story about the non-union workers from Alabama getting turned away from Seaside Heights?” Here’s why: All media reports that are currently circulating are only going off one source ([WAFF.com](http://WAFF.com)). Jersey Central Power & Light spokesman Ron Morano told News12 that JCP&L has accepted help from all crews. “We have not turned away any help,” he said. “Absolutely not.” Please always consider the source! Vicious rumor, from people who want to believe ill of unions. ---
**Author:** ![howye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9adbd/32.png) [@howye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/howye)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/5 "2012-11-02T14:29:23Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Is there any confirmation about this story? WAFF-TV seems to be the only source and they are located in Alabama. So far this is a story about someone in Alabama saying someone in NJ told him that someone else in NJ told him that non-union workers weren’t wanted there. A quick search on google showed only a scattering of extreme conservative sites repeating the same WAFF-TV report. No independent verification of anything. No actual journalism. Even if true, you have one reported instance of stupidity. Yet, thousands of utility workers from all over the country are deployed across the east coast helping in recovery efforts. This is proof of how bad unions are? There is no debate here. Just uninformed partisan speculation and dick waggling. ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/6 "2012-11-02T14:58:28Z")
Dude, I heard that Obama flew out over the Atlantic in Air Force One and apologized to the hurricane, WTF?!! ---
**Author:** ![leftfield6](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leftfield6/32/18780_2.png) [@leftfield6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leftfield6)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/7 "2012-11-02T15:19:02Z")
See, here is the thing. That story just _sounds_ like something that should be suspect. It just _sounds_ like a story that needs more evidence. Before starting this thread, a few hours of _“hmm, I wonder if the entire story is out, maybe I should hold off on posting until, you know, those things like facts, a corroborating source, or even a contradictory source, come forth”_ would have been a good idea. Now here we are, 6 hours or so after your regurgitation of an unsubstantiated story, and there are still no sources other than WAFF’s sensational report. ---
**Author:** ![Jenaroph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e8c25b/32.png) [@Jenaroph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jenaroph)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/8 "2012-11-02T15:26:42Z")
Did a little digging, and found some other sources with comments on the situation: > **[Huntsville, Joe Wheeler utilities deny claims of union discrimination during...](https://www.al.com/breaking/2012/11/huntsville_utilities_denies_cl.html)** > > Two area utility systems - Huntsville Utilities and Joe Wheeler Cooperative - mentioned in media reports claiming their crews were not allowed to help with storm aid in New Jersey because they were non-union said this morning the story is untrue. > [@](#): > > Representatives with Huntsville Utilities and Joe Wheeler Cooperative, two area utilities mentioned in media reports claiming their crews were not allowed to help with storm aid in New Jersey because they were non-union, said this morning the story is untrue. > > The general manager of the other department mentioned, Decatur Utilities, has been unavailable for comment this morning. One of its crew members was quoted in the initial reports. Now, there’s a quote from the Joe Wheeler that clarifies what happened with them, in their company’s case. > [@](#): > > A spokeswoman for Joe Wheeler Electrical Membership Cooperative said the crews from Trinity also are assisting with storm recovery and, in fact, are unionized. > > “It is not true for us,” she said. “I don’t know how we got lumped in there (in that report). We sent eight guys to Maryland, not New Jersey. They have been there since before the storm but they’ve finished work and are headed home this morning.” > > The crews from Joe Wheeler EMC went to Denton, Md., in anticipation of the storm and worked with Choptank Electrical Cooperative. As for the Decatur Utilities representative that had no comment for the Alabama article, he appeared on Fox Business News this morning, and his official story is a WEE bit different from what appeared in Bricker’s original article. > **[Varney & Co](https://www.foxbusiness.com/shows/varney-co)** > > Stuart Varney takes over the critical market-open coverage with Varney & Co. (9-12PM/ET). The program, which is amongst the highest rated programs in business news, breaks down the latest in financial news and political headlines. A few important points, transcribed: “I did want to clarify, our crews were sent up there, and ended up the Virginia area, in a staging area, they never actually got to New Jersey town that we were headed to to support. We were presented with documents from IBEW that required our folks to affiliate with the union, and that was something that we could not agree to, and it was our understanding, affiliating, that that was a requirement for working in that area.” (in response to the question by the host asking if they drove to Virginia and were handed the papers to sign before continuing to New Jersey): “It was not in person, we were dealing with those documents here, dealing with those officials directly from Alabama.” That’s not exactly the picture created by “they were told by crews in New Jersey that they can’t do any work there since they’re not union employees.” They never drove all the way to New Jersey only to be turned away. They were never told by the New Jersey town, “you’re not allowed to work here”, it appears they assumed that. They were handed the paperwork that they didn’t want to sign (and there’s no report of what that paperwork actually demanded) WHILE THEY WERE STILL IN ALABAMA. They didn’t have to drive up and waste time in Virginia, they did that part on their own. Oh, and another quote from the first Alabama article I posted: > [@](#): > > One of the problems is whenever this kind of thing happens people call and ask, ‘Are you going to send crews out?’ but it’s not a situation where everybody jumps in truck and heads up there. You have to work through trade associations. You have mutual-aid agreements and you’ve got to find a system that needs you and is able to take you." > > He said some systems don’t use the same voltage and may have different configurations. “You don’t just go up there and say, 'Hey, we’re here. We’re going to start putting up poles for you.” There is always another side to the story. ---
**Author:** ![Lightnin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lightnin/32/180_2.png) [@Lightnin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lightnin)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/9 "2012-11-02T16:09:25Z")
So once again we have the Right (in general) and \*\*Bricker \*\*(in specific) politicizing a disaster for their own goals? And once again they’ve misrepresented or exaggerated the situation? That about the long and short of it? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/10 "2012-11-02T16:35:06Z")
> [@Jenaroph](#): > > “I did want to clarify, our crews were sent up there, and ended up the Virginia area, in a staging area, they never actually got to New Jersey town that we were headed to to support. We were presented with documents from IBEW that required our folks to affiliate with the union, and that was something that we could not agree to, and it was our understanding, affiliating, that that was a requirement for working in that area.” So apparently the story is that right-wingers refuse to help storm victims because they would be affiliated with a union. Could a mod change the OP please? ---
**Author:** ![Jas09](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d07c76/32.png) [@Jas09](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jas09)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/11 "2012-11-02T17:37:20Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > When a union’s territory is so jealously guarded that non-union help is refused even under these circumstances, the union influence is not benign. It’s toxic. When an anti-union TV station’s stance is so jealously guarded that it will fabricate, distort, and lie to the public even under these circumstances, the station’s influence is not benign. It is toxic. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/12 "2012-11-02T17:49:45Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > When a union’s territory is so jealously guarded that non-union help is refused even under these circumstances, the union influence is not benign. It’s toxic. Is this a debate or a Pitting? Are you coming back to elaborate or respond? ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/13 "2012-11-02T18:12:03Z")
I can’t tell if this whole fiasco says more about unions, the right wing echo chamber, the spread of misinformation, or **Bricker**. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/14 "2012-11-02T18:37:43Z")
You should be embarrassed by lapping up misinformation like this and then re-spreading it so quickly. Just embarrassed. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/15 "2012-11-02T18:40:20Z")
Bricker needs to stick to what he is good at, and leave spreading baseless propaganda to professionals like Fox News. ---
**Author:** ![3\_20\_59\_or\_bust](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/3/47e85d/32.png) [@3\_20\_59\_or\_bust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/3_20_59_or_bust)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/16 "2012-11-02T18:43:12Z")
Bricker spreading falsehoods about unions? Say it ain’t so. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/17 "2012-11-02T18:43:56Z")
He’s in “good” company. Limbaugh mentioned it on his radio show this afternoon – so you know how true it must be. ---
**Author:** ![redtail23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/3e96dc/32.png) [@redtail23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/redtail23)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/18 "2012-11-02T19:05:17Z")
Am I mistaken, or isn’t **Bricker** the person who always insists that one must wait until ALL of the facts are in before making a judgement, that one should not depend on news reports for information because they’re so unreliable, and regularly scolds people for failing to meet his strict evidentiary requirements? Huh. Imagine that. ---
**Author:** ![drew870mitchell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drew870mitchell/32/3946_2.png) [@drew870mitchell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drew870mitchell)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/19 "2012-11-02T19:43:58Z")
**Bricker** , you just played the fish to this crummy bait of a story. ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2012, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644/20 "2012-11-02T19:51:03Z")
Don’t worry, he’ll be back any minute now. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/look-for-the-union-label/639644.md?page=2)