# Looking for wargame/tabletop miniature recommendations **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 10, 2011, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240 "2011-08-10T19:36:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2011, 6:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/21 "2011-08-13T06:12:00Z")
> [@Bosstrain](#): > > I find it hard to believe no one’s even mentioned chess, Perhaps we assumed the OP was familiar. ---
**Author:** ![Capitaine\_Zombie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e95f7d/32.png) [@Capitaine\_Zombie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capitaine_Zombie)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2011, 7:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/22 "2011-08-13T07:15:05Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > Games Workshop is a complete money sink and produces poor war games at best. That’s the least you can say, but by focusing on an extensive background they managed to completely dominate the market. Since the OP refers and seems to enjoy that mass of background info, maybe he’s looking for direct rivals of GW games. Not “proper” wargames. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2011, 7:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/23 "2011-08-13T07:17:45Z")
> [@Capitaine\_Zombie](#): > > That’s the least you can say, but by focusing on an extensive background they managed to completely dominate the market. Since the OP refers and seems to enjoy that mass of background info, maybe he’s looking for direct rivals of GW games. Not “proper” wargames. Fair enough. I guess I was focusing on the bolded aspects of: > [@OP](#): > > **The wargaming aspect appeals to me more than making and painting figures** , so it would be a definite plus if this was something I could buy a rolebook for and mock up with cardboard cutouts/spare change, **but I would love to hear about any tabletop-type game that dopers have really enjoyed**. ---
**Author:** ![Omi\_no\_Kami](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a88e4f/32.png) [@Omi\_no\_Kami](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omi_no_Kami)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2011, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/24 "2011-08-13T21:02:22Z")
Whoops, I guess I should’ve been more specific… my only hard rule is that it be fun, which is subjective enough to be fairly useless, but in general I’m just as likely to enjoy something rife with outside mythology as I am a bare-bones number-crunching game. For tabletop games, however, I find the number-crunching to be the most fun part-my ideal wargame would probably involve a bunch of preparation beforehand (working out what units to populate my army with, customizing unit equipment with an eye toward emphasizing whatever attributes I’m building my force around, figuring out some initial possible deployments and considering how my prospective army would be able to respond to unexpected twists) before play. So in general I’m a rules and numbers nut, but I can probably get enthusiastic about almost any wargame that’s decently well-designed and fun to play. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2011, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/25 "2011-08-13T22:54:52Z")
> [@Omi\_no\_Kami](#): > > Whoops, I guess I should’ve been more specific… my only hard rule is that it be fun, which is subjective enough to be fairly useless, but in general I’m just as likely to enjoy something rife with outside mythology as I am a bare-bones number-crunching game. > > For tabletop games, however, I find the number-crunching to be the most fun part-my ideal wargame would probably involve a bunch of preparation beforehand (working out what units to populate my army with, customizing unit equipment with an eye toward emphasizing whatever attributes I’m building my force around, figuring out some initial possible deployments and considering how my prospective army would be able to respond to unexpected twists) before play. > > So in general I’m a rules and numbers nut, but I can probably get enthusiastic about almost any wargame that’s decently well-designed and fun to play. In this case I’m going to re-recommend Heavy Gear. The vehicle creation system is, while a bit mathy, sufficiently complete that the same system designs anything from a one-man jetpack to a magnetic-levitation land-based battleship, and everything in between. Typically you agree on a tactical situation and a point total, and then just about anything else goes. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2011, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/26 "2011-08-14T15:05:10Z")
> [@Omi\_no\_Kami](#): > > So in general I’m a rules and numbers nut, but I can probably get enthusiastic about almost any wargame that’s decently well-designed and fun to play. [Case Blue](http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/29285/case-blue) - war game dealing with the southern portion of the Eastern Front in WWII. 3600 counters, 10 maps provide days upon days of accounting fun as you are asked to arm, replace, resupply and fuel each unit. It’s not really my cup of tea, but it’s rated 8.47 on Board Game Geek making it one of the highest rated games on that site. However it’s certainly not for the novice war gamer so I’d recommend trying one of the others I mentioned before investing in this monster. If you scroll down on each of my links you can read reviews from regular players to see if the game is what you’re looking for. Some are out of print but you can find them used pretty easily. ---
**Author:** ![willthekittensurvive](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/91b2a8/32.png) [@willthekittensurvive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/willthekittensurvive)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2011, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/27 "2011-08-14T17:03:26Z")
Maybe not what the OP asked for, but you could check out spartan games and their new game: [Dystopian Wars,](http://www.spartangames.co.uk/galleries/dystopian-wars-gallery) its a steam/diesel punk miniature wargame with [Victorian dreadnoughts](http://forum.spartangames.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=5356.0) versus [Pruisian zeppelins](http://forum.spartangames.co.uk/smf/index.php?topic=7134.0) (both with Carrier-decks mounted on top of the massive ships) versus the Japanese mechanical squid I think the prices are reasonable, 30 euro for basic fleet, 20 euro for the carrier and a lot of small planes,you get a lot of ships and the level of detail is very high(a little bit less fun when you are painting the mini’s) I for one think it should be the official game of the SDMB! ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2011, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/28 "2011-08-14T17:22:13Z")
> [@Sitnam](#): > > [Case Blue](http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/29285/case-blue) - war game dealing with the southern portion of the Eastern Front in WWII. 3600 counters, 10 maps provide days upon days of accounting fun as you are asked to arm, replace, resupply and fuel each unit. As a tabletop miniature player (BattleTech, 40K, WFB, Space Hulk, etc…) and a long time video game player, why in the world would you want to play that game on a tabletop? That sort of detail seems much better organized and managed on a computer, with the bonus that if someone bumps the table, your units aren’t out of place. ---
**Author:** ![Zeriel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/58956e/32.png) [@Zeriel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeriel)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2011, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/29 "2011-08-14T18:27:01Z")
> [@bump](#): > > As a tabletop miniature player (BattleTech, 40K, WFB, Space Hulk, etc…) and a long time video game player, why in the world would you want to play that game on a tabletop? > > That sort of detail seems much better organized and managed on a computer, with the bonus that if someone bumps the table, your units aren’t out of place. As a long-time fan of the Avalon Hill counters and tabletops games, it only took playing V for Victory just once to cause me to NEVER break one out physically ever again (except for GEV/Ogre, but no suitable computer version exists that I’ve found). ---
**Author:** ![Ibanez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/a4c791/32.png) [@Ibanez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibanez)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2011, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/30 "2011-08-16T01:56:56Z")
> [@Omi\_no\_Kami](#): > > Whoops, I guess I should’ve been more specific… my only hard rule is that it be fun, which is subjective enough to be fairly useless, but in general I’m just as likely to enjoy something rife with outside mythology as I am a bare-bones number-crunching game. > > For tabletop games, however, I find the number-crunching to be the most fun part-my ideal wargame would probably involve a bunch of preparation beforehand (working out what units to populate my army with, customizing unit equipment with an eye toward emphasizing whatever attributes I’m building my force around, figuring out some initial possible deployments and considering how my prospective army would be able to respond to unexpected twists) before play. > > So in general I’m a rules and numbers nut, but I can probably get enthusiastic about almost any wargame that’s decently well-designed and fun to play. If your a WWII history fan you’d likely enjoy Avanlon Hill’s [Advanced Squad Leader](http://www.multimanpublishing.com/Products/tabid/58/CategoryID/4/Default.aspx). ASL then. It’s been around for a few decades and has undergone many revisions. If you like number crunching this is it, very detailed and fun. The rule book is a binder. It’s large but there’s a newbies chapter to get you started. I remember playing a Red Barricades (Stalingrad) campaign very big game by ASL standards. The scenario was 12 turns long we were on turn 2, 14 hrs later. Most games though are about from 4-6hrs. What I liked about the Red Barricades module is that the huge map was created based on aerial historical photographs of Stalingrad. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2011, 3:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/31 "2011-08-16T03:39:05Z")
> [@bump](#): > > As a tabletop miniature player (BattleTech, 40K, WFB, Space Hulk, etc…) and a long time video game player, why in the world would you want to play that game on a tabletop? > > That sort of detail seems much better organized and managed on a computer, with the bonus that if someone bumps the table, your units aren’t out of place. I said it wasn’t my cup of tea, but perhaps it’d appeal to a guy who is a self described ‘rules and numbers nut’. I’m trying to think of games _he_ would like based on\* his\* interests. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2011, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/32 "2011-08-16T03:41:53Z")
> [@Ibanez](#): > > If your a WWII history fan you’d likely enjoy Avanlon Hill’s [Advanced Squad Leader](http://www.multimanpublishing.com/Products/tabid/58/CategoryID/4/Default.aspx). ASL then. > > It’s been around for a few decades and has undergone many revisions. If you like number crunching this is it, very detailed and fun. > > The rule book is a binder. It’s large but there’s a newbies chapter to get you started. It’s even easier than that, for little investment in effort and money the [starter kit](http://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/9823/advanced-squad-leader-starter-kit-1) is a good way to get your feet wet. Or decide it isn’t for you. ---
**Author:** ![notquitekarpov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/71c47a/32.png) [@notquitekarpov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/notquitekarpov)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2011, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240/33 "2011-08-17T16:14:13Z")
If you don’t like painting miniatures you could think about board wargames too. Explore this site [BoardGameGeek | Gaming Unplugged Since 2000](http://www.boardgamegeek.com/wargames) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/looking-for-wargame-tabletop-miniature-recommendations/592240.md?page=1)