# Lord of the Rings Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 10, 2010, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867 "2010-08-10T19:56:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 116
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2301 "2010-09-07T01:18:09Z")
**Meeko** , maybe you should play in Open Setup games. That way there wouldn’t be any surprises with regards to the number of players on each team and which roles there are. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2302 "2010-09-07T01:28:49Z")
and i don’t want to hijack this thread but … why is it called open when you know who and how many and closed when you have no clue? seems oxymornic. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2303 "2010-09-07T01:42:20Z")
:? ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2304 "2010-09-07T01:58:48Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > and i don’t want to hijack this thread but … > > why is it called open when you know who and how many and closed when you have no clue? seems oxymornic. Because an Open game has the set-up open for everyone to see. A Closed game has the set-up closed where no one can see. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2305 "2010-09-07T02:01:34Z")
thanks **ed**. that makes sense. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2306 "2010-09-07T02:58:36Z")
> [@USCDiver](#): > > **Meeko** , maybe you should play in Open Setup games. That way there wouldn’t be any surprises with regards to the number of players on each team and which roles there are. **Why can’t everyone be told at the start that a potato is in play? Not the details of the potato, just that one is in play?** But, **Meeko** , you can’t be serious! This “”" potato “”" thing you speak of is a new and fun concept, only half a year to year old. It helps grow the game! But, **Meeko** , no game before screamers had a potato. It’s not that big of a deal. If you are that upset with it, you should try an Open game. \*\* How many closed games have had potatoes? \*\* Perhaps the fact that we had to invent a term for it, impromtu, is the tip of the iceberg on how half baked potatoes are. [Heh.] I actually want to try a Gastard game.\*\* I think that I would thrive in an environment, when I am told to expect anything, everything, and then some.\*\* Who knows, in a Gastard set up, my want to vote Nanook [or a similar player] _in a similar situation to the immediate game_, would be a good thing. Potatoes create an additional faction. That faction halts interaction between players. It is anyone’s guess what the potato does. A downward sprial ripe for in game debate that goes no where fast. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2307 "2010-09-07T03:00:47Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > > [@peekercpa](#): > > > > and i don’t want to hijack this thread but … > > > > why is it called open when you know who and how many and closed when you have no clue? seems oxymornic. > > Because an Open game has the set-up open for everyone to see. > > A Closed game has the set-up closed where no one can see. I’ll bite. \*\* What’s the difference between Closed and Gastard? \*\* ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2308 "2010-09-07T03:30:14Z")
> [@](#): > > I’ll bite. > > What’s the difference between Closed and Gastard? If you don’t already know the answer to that question, you really shouldn’t be here. ---
**Author:** ![Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanook_of_the_North_Shore)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2309 "2010-09-07T04:54:44Z")
While I kinda agree with Chronos, I’ll answer you anyways. Gastard, at it’s heart, means the mod lies to the players. Closed means the mod just doesn’t tell them everything. One example. Hidden/delayed death reveals? Closed set up. Lying death reveals? Gastard. ---
**Author:** ![One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/838e76/32.png) [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/One_And_Only_Wanderers)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2310 "2010-09-07T06:34:19Z")
I really do not see the issue Meeko. Some players have more info than other players. That’s just part of the game. Coming in to a closed setup uyou have no idea what mix of power roles you will encounter. Maybe a new one has been thrown in, who knows? Having an extra game mechanism like the golden snitch or this parchment or whatever is just that, another aspect for us to figure out. If you hate the idea that much then maybe you would prefer open 7-2 games at mafia scum where you know how many scum vs town there are and what power roles are in play. I think you can take it as a given that there will be extra weird sh\*t in most mafia games here, cos most of us _like_ it. ---
**Author:** ![Natlaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a88e57/32.png) [@Natlaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Natlaw)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 10:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2311 "2010-09-07T10:22:45Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > Vote Nanook > > For investigating me and thus wasting it. He should have know I would make a bad claim outing myself if I was scum. **And I’m not even scum!** > > “Mayor Quimby is soft on crime! He released notorious murderer Sideshow Bob from prison! Vote against Quimby this November. Vote for Sideshow Bob” That some suspicious snipping people! Re-added the missing part bolded. Also you’re voting neither **Quimby** or **Sideshow Bob**. I would vote for **Kodos** by the way. > [@Meeko](#): > > **Potatoes** I thought you claimed _Celebron_ not Samwise Gamgee? ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 12:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2312 "2010-09-07T12:04:55Z")
> [@One\_And\_Only\_Wanderers](#): > > I really do not see the issue Meeko. Some players have more info than other players. That’s just part of the game. Some players do have more information than others. Agreed. Those players are given immutable information from the game start. Those who don’t have the information have a reasonable chance to assume given roles. You can play Sudoku with any 9 symbols, but numbers work because of the legacy numbers have with each other. Numbers are tight to each other, well contained. Potatoes are I’m not even sure if potatoes are letters, perhaps they are punctuation. Also the information you speak of DOES NOT include potatoes. **You know this.** You speak of information that is immutable, word of Mod. You speak of information that starts on equal footing with all players. Granted, it pulls from a large pool of parts [roles] but they are all there. \*\* Didn’t we have to discuss Jack of All Trades / Inventor in this game? What did we do there? We went to a bible of sorts. How many times has that same Mafia Scum animation been linked to? Either that site has value, or Potatoes do. \*\* I will go here: **Potatoes hurt newer players.** What noob is going to be absolutely silent once he is given a potato? Didn’t we have someone blab in this game, who admittedly **““knew better””** [Skeezy, was it?] Scum, not having any other information will lynch the blabber. **Potatoes hurt the double e players.** I most certainly thought this term was dead. But, you know INSTANTLY what I mean. While this isn’t the point, I feel I must go here. I will probably NEVER get a potato. Why? Because I am Meeko. A reputation. A reputation I thought was improving. A reputation that yes, drives me to play in games that I probably shouldn’t. [I am still waiting for that one game where I have enough of the game together to play it well.\*] A reputation that pushes things, and plays everywhere, inside “boxes” and out. Will we hand M **ee** ko a loaded potato? P **ee** ker [Have to go here buddy, bear with me] had a loaded Gun, and look what he did. I won’t fuel the double **ee** machine, not if I can’t help it. **I would rather play keep away than Mafia.** \*Experience works because you have he opportunity to learn from past mistakes. That knowledge helps avoid EXACT SAME situations. Potatoes are brand new situations. **The goal post is moving.** If you were thisclose to perfecting your extra point attempt before, well it sucks to be you we will stunt your growth and laugh in your face. * * * * * * * * * **I would like to think that potatoes bestow an ability.** In Potter it was a tie-breaking mechanism. This would effectively make the holder a **double voting townie.** A double voting townie has a Jsexton score, right? The potato might be protection. What is the Jsexton score for a **one shot doctor**? What then do we score **the fact that the holder can choose the next person to hold the item.** Certainly this gets a higher score than a random selection. Is it free choice? \*\* Can you keep a potato, or is the pass compulsory?\*\* If you have the choice here, that should be worth another fractional point. [Can we give fourths?] **God forbid if the potato does different things based on who holds it.** That’s another point, at least. If one person can do one of two things with it? Even worse. \*\* Is there some “This item must go to each player once” requirement?\*\* That would be a tall order. This would be a good test of Memory, **akin to recalling the alphabetical list of items often taken to a picnic, or had at supper last night.** To say nothing about the challenge if everyone [rightfully so] stays tight lipped about when or if they held the item. \*\* Is there some “This item must must reach \” requirement? \*\*Is this information given with the item? Is the information NOT given? \*\* Is there some “Keep this item from \” ?\*\* \*\*Are there multiple items? Can those items interact with each other? Do they “build” something? \*\* I think I’ve made my point. The Potato, best case scenario, is undervalued [Jsexton]. Worst case scenario, it’s a game breaker. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2313 "2010-09-07T12:08:43Z")
> [@Natlaw](#): > > > [@Chronos](#): > > > > “Mayor Quimby is soft on crime! He released notorious murderer Sideshow Bob from prison! Vote against Quimby this November. Vote for Sideshow Bob” > > That some suspicious snipping people! Re-added the missing part bolded. Also you’re voting neither **Quimby** or **Sideshow Bob**. I would vote for **Kodos** by the way. > > > [@Meeko](#): > > > > **Potatoes** > > I thought you claimed _Celebron_ not Samwise Gamgee? Woosh. ☹ ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Natlaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a88e57/32.png) [@Natlaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Natlaw)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2314 "2010-09-07T12:16:59Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > The Potato, best case scenario, is undervalued [Jsexton]. Worst case scenario, it’s a game breaker. How do _you_ know how **Mahaloth** undervalued the parchment to the point is breaks the game? You don’t so you can stop worrying about. Trust me - I’m town (_Glorfindel_ for those who asked) and I’m pretty sure it won’t break the game. However the ink on it might be poisonous but I’m sure you thought of that and will wear gloves when you get it. PS: I’m just pulling your leg. No potatoes were harmed in this writing of post 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Natlaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a88e57/32.png) [@Natlaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Natlaw)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2315 "2010-09-07T12:19:07Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > Woosh. ☹ ☹ [See here](http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Potato): > [@](#): > > The word “Potatoes” was most famously used in the film version of “The Lord of the Rings: the Two Towers” by the hobbit Samwise Gamgee. The little gimp spells the word out “Po-tat-oes” in relation to a question as to what taters were. If one is to turn the volume down on this scene and lip read what Sam is saying he clearly says: “Mo-naked-hoes”. Samwise also reveals to us what the uses of taters are: “Po-tat-oes; boil 'em, mash 'em, stick 'em in a stew”. (Try this with the same potato, it doesn’t work, Sam’s a liar). Clear evidence by the way that Sam in scum. Lynch all liars! ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2316 "2010-09-07T12:25:33Z")
> [@Natlaw](#): > > How do _you_ know how **Mahaloth** undervalued the parchment to the point is breaks the game? I don’t know **ANYTHING** about the parchment. **That’s my point exactly.** ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 12:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2317 "2010-09-07T12:40:41Z")
Well, I suppose it could be worse. He could be quoting Wikipedia. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2318 "2010-09-07T13:12:26Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > > [@Natlaw](#): > > > > How do _you_ know how **Mahaloth** undervalued the parchment to the point is breaks the game? > > I don’t know **ANYTHING** about the parchment. **That’s my point exactly.** well if it makes you feel any better i don’t know anything about it either. other than **red** claims to have received it last night. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2319 "2010-09-07T13:15:43Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > Well, I suppose it could be worse. He could be quoting Wikipedia. Was there any unfinished business for today, in terms of our daily lynch? I was kinda thinking we were effectively done for today. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 7, 2010, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2320 "2010-09-07T13:25:36Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > Well, I suppose it could be worse. He could be quoting Wikipedia. I’ll give you 3:1 odds that the parchment is a random Wikipedia article. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867.md?page=115) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867.md?page=117)