# Lord of the Rings Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 10, 2010, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867 "2010-08-10T19:56:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 118
**Author:** ![GuiriEnEspana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc79bd/32.png) [@GuiriEnEspana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuiriEnEspana)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2341 "2010-09-08T20:22:22Z")
Oops, forgot to vote: **Vote Natlaw** When he claimed to know **Astral** was a hobbit but was reluctant to reveal any more information about his role and other results, I thought he may have had a role similar to **Chronos** and was bluffing about his powers (as he’d effectively be VT, attracting a NK would have been a good play). I was surprised no-one else switched their vote as we had an apparent cop-confirmed Townie against someone several of us suspected was scum (intentionally ignoring deductions made based on PMs not in the public domain). The posted PM looks like a doctored role PM for a watcher more than a cop. I’ve no idea what **Natlaw** ’s intentions could have been except for the obvious: protect a strong scum power role or draw a cop counter-claim (or both). Given the lack of counter-claim to **Suburban** , there may have been a small chance that we didn’t have a cop and so the ploy could have been successful but what’s up with the typos and poor wording? Did scum skim the posts after **Suburban** ’s claim? I briefly entertained the thought that **Nanook** could also have been false-claiming but am now quite comfortable with his claim. I still think there was a lot of info to be gained by investigating **Astral** last Night but I have to trust he did what he thought best. ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2342 "2010-09-08T20:49:37Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > I was surprised no-one else switched their vote as we had an apparent cop-confirmed Townie against someone several of us suspected was scum (intentionally ignoring deductions made based on PMs not in the public domain). That’s probably because his half-hearted claim came less than half an hour before the end of Day 3. I was online, but I was not voting for \*\*Astral \*\*at the time and it was such a bizarre claim, I don’t know what I would have done if I had been in a position to save **Astral** ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2343 "2010-09-08T21:06:03Z")
> [@](#): > > That’s probably because his half-hearted claim came less than half an hour before the end of Day 3. It was the evening before, actually, but still awfully late, considering sleep schedules. And I would be a little leery of **Nanook** ’s claim, too, but it seems highly unlikely to me that we don’t have a real Gandalf, and even more unlikely for the Scum to have knowledge of that (without which knowledge, a false-claim of Gandalf from someone not under pressure seems incredibly ballsy). ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 9:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2344 "2010-09-08T21:20:00Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > That’s probably because his half-hearted claim came less than half an hour before the end of Day 3. > > It was the evening before, actually, but still awfully late, considering sleep schedules. > > And I would be a little leery of **Nanook** ’s claim, too, but it seems highly unlikely to me that we don’t have a real Gandalf, and even more unlikely for the Scum to have knowledge of that (without which knowledge, a false-claim of Gandalf from someone not under pressure seems incredibly ballsy). and that is what is bugging me **chronos**. and i know that no one other than the mods and the spoiled folks have perfect knowledge. but the half arse claim, the timing, the no claim from **astral** and the save all smelled funky to me. and i, as well, did not have a vote on **astral**. and i am leery of **nooks** claim, as well, although in canon i would think that roll would exist. and with no counter claim it starts to feel better and better as time passes. and i know this is monday morning quarterbacking to some extent. but jeebus the stars aligned. **astral** says nada. **nat** makes what turns out to be a suspect claim. and then **wanderer** pipes in with a vote change that lynches town **who he has already admitted he thinks is town**. heebus pleebus. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 8, 2010, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2345 "2010-09-08T23:44:10Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > But there’s no point in letting a claimed detective live if you’re just going to kill off the folks he says are Town. \*\*This was @Peeker, correct? \*\* 'Nuff said. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2346 "2010-09-09T00:45:05Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > > [@Chronos](#): > > > > But there’s no point in letting a claimed detective live if you’re just going to kill off the folks he says are Town. > > \*\*This was @Peeker, correct? \*\* > > 'Nuff said. actually its a tomato ploy. watch your back the bad folks are coming. ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2347 "2010-09-09T01:38:08Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > It was the evening before, actually, but still awfully late, considering sleep schedules. Actually it wasn’t. His insinuation was the night before: > [@Natlaw](#): > > Gotta go to work but please unvote **Astral** - he is just a hobbit. I don’t think a full claims will help here but I strongly advise keeping the names hidden (for the reason mentioned earlier against a mass name claim). > > I hope to get back before Dusk. His actual claim was at 11:33am before the noon lynch: > [@Natlaw](#): > > > [@Chronos](#): > > > > **Natlaw** , if you have some actual hard information to that effect, you really should have shared it sooner or not at all. Posting this late leaves it likely that many folks won’t have time to unvote him, but there’s still plenty of time for Scum to pick up on that and target you. And I for one would like enough information about your implicit claim to be able to judge whether I believe it. > > My information is that I investigated Astral as a hobbit (I don’t know his role, but color wise his alignment would be town (as in he is not _Gollum_)). As said I think revealing his name isn’t a good idea at this time. > > My information is late because I expected **Astral** himself to claim. > > My other result is not useful to reveal now. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2348 "2010-09-09T02:16:50Z")
> [@Natlaw](#): > > \*\* > My other result is not useful to reveal now.\*\* \*\* Does this add credence to a Third Party? \*\* ## 1.Assume Nat is [somehow] an investigator. 2.Assume Nat is Scum. 3.Would Scum waste a night investigating fellow scum?\* ## 4.Assume Astral is scum 5.Assume Nat made a move / gambit to save Astral 6.The statement from Nat that Astral is town moves votes off of Astral 7.The statement that “My other result is not useful to reveal now” is ambiguous. 8.Nat can accomplish the save astral gambit by not saying anything else. 1. A Scum has said “My other result is not useful to reveal now.” 2. **If this statement is made due to the revelation of a third party, the voting changes are less predictable.** Another target for votes is created, but there is no guarantee on how town will vote. [That is, the gambit becomes riskier than intended.] \*\* What if Nat is a lesser dick, that can only know race? Wouldn’t that fit? Wouldn’t that be easier to balance, if scum had a lesser dick?\*\* \*\*Even more so, Comments have been made that Gollum could “hide” as town. Nat would not be able to detect Gollum.Nat also said that _ **scum** _ are after something precious. \*\* Wouldn’t a Third Party be considered “Scum” from the perspective of scum? **Any takers that Gollum is in Game, is a Third Party, and is looking for a Ring shaped Potato as his Wincon?** \*Yes. “Scum wouldn’t do that.” But, if you bought on to the fact that he is an investigator after his questionable PM, then you bought on to the entire package. You chance to piecemeal it is over with. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2349 "2010-09-09T02:20:17Z")
**Can a player hold on to the parchment indefinitely?** Not going to ask if there are other potatoes in the game. Would probably end up being detrimental to town, and I would get a No Comment. And you guys think I’m stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2350 "2010-09-09T02:30:57Z")
> [@](#): > > 1.Assume Nat is [somehow] an investigator. > 2.Assume Nat is Scum. Given those assumptions, then we can safely ignore anything he told us. The simplest explanation for him remaining tight-lipped about his other “investigations” is that the more he tells us, the more chance he has of tripping up, and so therefore he doesn’t want to tell us very much. There may well be a Gollum in the game, and the role may well have some interaction with the Ring that may or may not be in the game, but **Natlaw** ’s behavior doesn’t tell us anything one way or another about it. As for your green question, there’s no chance that **Mahaloth** is going to answer it, because we don’t even actually know that there is a parchment. For all we know, **Red Skeezix** might be lying. I don’t think he is, but still, it’s not the mod’s place to confirm or deny information like that. If **Red** really does have a piece of parchment, then he can ask **Mahaloth** in a PM what he’s allowed or supposed to do with it, and then he can tell us. On a completely separate subject, **Nanook** : In your results for **Meeko** and **Guiri** , did you get a result of “Town”, or “Not scum”? Likewise, in your result for **Natlaw** , did you get “Scum”, or “Not town”? I want to be sure about the possibility of third parties in your results. ---
**Author:** ![Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanook_of_the_North_Shore)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2351 "2010-09-09T02:43:17Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > On a completely separate subject, **Nanook** : In your results for **Meeko** and **Guiri** , did you get a result of “Town”, or “Not scum”? Likewise, in your result for **Natlaw** , did you get “Scum”, or “Not town”? I want to be sure about the possibility of third parties in your results. I was told that Meeko and Guiri were members of the Alliance of Light, and that Natlaw was a Servant of Darkness. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2352 "2010-09-09T02:55:55Z")
\*\*Vote Count: Natlaw(15): Astral, Nanook, Chronos, Innerstickler, Oneandonly, Peeker, Hoopy, Drainbead, USCDiver, Redskeezix, Natlaw, Mhaye, Snickers, Doctorwho, Guiri Nanook(1) Natlaw \*\* ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2353 "2010-09-09T04:08:30Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > As for your green question, there’s no chance that **Mahaloth** is going to answer it, because we don’t even actually know that there is a parchment. It would seem unanimous, potatoes are half-baked. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2354 "2010-09-09T14:49:05Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > so you think that nat didn’t out himself by his declaration of astral? No, I don’t think that. If you did think he outed himself that way, then why didn’t you vote for him yesterDay? [/QUOTE] \ ok, that outing. i mis parsed it along the lines that he had outed himself as a claimed detective. i didn’t pull it forward to the scum thingy. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2355 "2010-09-09T14:50:52Z")
and i totally butchered that freaking quote. what says **chronos** is actually me. the next sentence is the snipped portion from **chronos** ’s original post and the last section is mine. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2356 "2010-09-09T15:14:17Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > I was surprised no-one else switched their vote as we had an apparent cop-confirmed Townie against someone several of us suspected was scum (intentionally ignoring deductions made based on PMs not in the public domain). \ but wouldn’t a switch away from **astral** be making a deduction based on “PMs not in the public domain”? ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2357 "2010-09-09T16:17:29Z")
3:30 today, folks, instead of Noon. Just a reminder. ---
**Author:** ![Snickers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@Snickers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snickers)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2358 "2010-09-09T16:19:07Z")
I’ve been trying to analyze **Natlaw** ’s save of **Astral** , and here’s a WOW on it. Posts are linked; the commentary is mine alone. I tried to give quick summaries, so please correct me if I mischaracterized anything. It concentrates mainly on any actions surrounding **Natlaw** and **Astral**. Later on, after **Natlaw** ’s full claim, I stopped counting votes against him - the reasoning behind these is pretty clear. Vote count [#2063](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12865708&postcount=2063): **ed** = 2, **Astral** = 3 [#2064](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12866034&postcount=2064): **Doctor Who** votes **ed**. [#2069](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12866657&postcount=2069): **Drain** posts WOW on **Astral** , then votes for him. [#2073](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12866749&postcount=2073): **Natlaw** votes **Pleonast**. Vote count [#2076](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12866934&postcount=2076): **ed** = 3, **Astral** = 4 [#2078](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12867235&postcount=2078): **Astral** disagrees with **Drain** ’s reasoning for voting him and votes **Drain**. [#2080](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12867258&postcount=2080): **Natlaw** posts suspicions about **Guiri** , gives a quick defense of **Astral** , then unvotes **Pleo** and votes **ed**. [#2085](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12867717&postcount=2085): **Guiri** votes **ed**. [#2089](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12867953&postcount=2089): **Astral** says he wanted **Plankton** dead too, he just disagreed about when. Vote count [#2091](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12868000&postcount=2091): **ed** = 4, **Astral** = 4 [#2105](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12868475&postcount=2105): **Hoopy** votes **Astral** [#2106](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12868489&postcount=2106): **Inner Stickler** votes **Astral** Vote count [#2108](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12868528&postcount=2108): **ed** = 4, **Astral** = 6 Vote count [#2112](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12868780&postcount=2112): **ed** = 4, **Astral** = 6 [#2113](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12868948&postcount=2113): **Natlaw** makes his half-claim: **Astral** is just a hobbit. [#2116](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12869027&postcount=2116): **MHaye** votes **ed**. [#2124](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12869959&postcount=2124): After a bunch had questioned him, **Natlaw** adds to his claim saying that he investigated **Astral** as a hobbit. Says he doesn’t know his role, but he’s a townie. Revealing his name isn’t a good idea at this time. Info is late because he expected **Astral** to claim by now. Other result is not useful. [#2126](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12869985&postcount=2126): **OaOW** unvotes **Astral** and votes **ed**. [#2129](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12870057&postcount=2129): **Natlaw** says he came out because he didn’t want to waste his investigation. Other result doesn’t confirm a townie. Vote count [#2130](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12870083&postcount=2130): **ed** = 6, **Astral** = 5 [#2133](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12870127&postcount=2133): **ed** lynched. [#2140](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12872514&postcount=2140): **Astral** night-posts that he didn’t expect to survive yesterDay. [#2177](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12878999&postcount=2177): **Astral** says he’s vanilla town, then that he believes **Natlaw** because he is correct - he is indeed a hobbit. [#2186](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12879923&postcount=2186): **Natlaw** posts that he wasn’t blocked: he investigated **Nanook** last Night, **Guiri** on N2. N1 he investigated **Astral** ; he’s Peregrin Took, a hobbit. Posts power section of PM. [#2190](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12880035&postcount=2190): **Astral** confirms that he’s Pippin, then votes **Natlaw** : errors in posted section of PM, saved **Astral** to gain townie cred. [#2191](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12880059&postcount=2191): **Nanook** counter-claims and votes **Natlaw**. [#2194](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12880112&postcount=2194): **Astral** mentions that **Natlaw** ’s let slip that “the scum are looking for something precious.” Says town should pick **Nanook** ’s next target for investigation. Suggests that **Nanook** investigates him. [#2196](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12880137&postcount=2196): **Nanook** posts role PM, then explains why he didn’t claim previously. [#2198](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12880149&postcount=2198): **Astral** says it occurs to him that a godfather would suggest the same thing (that **Nanook** investigate **Astral** ). Can’t begrudge **OaOW** for voting him in response to **Natlaw** ’s turning up scum. [#2200](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12880173&postcount=2200): **Chronos** points out that announcing the investigator’s next target is a bad idea that helps scum. [#2204](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12880192&postcount=2204): **Astral** agrees with **Chronos** ’s reasoning. [#2217](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12880482&postcount=2217): **Astral** agrees with **Hoopy** ’s analysis: scum gets town lynched either way and sneak in **Natlaw** as a confirmed townie. Doesn’t understand why **Natlaw** ’s posted PM section wasn’t proofread with all night to talk about it. My thoughts on the above: –If **Natlaw** ’s an investigator (for either side), why the smudge on **Guiri** in #2080, especially given his later claim in #2186 that he investigated her and she came up town? If he’s a scum investigator, I can see it - smudge the good name of a townie and maybe get a later lynch out of it - but then why later say oop, nope, she’s town"? I think he was trying to preserve cred at this point, but did a pretty bad job of it. –He’s not going to tell us, but I’d love to know the result **Natlaw** got from his investigation of **Nanook** , given his wierd powers section in the flubbed PM. –The interaction between **Natlaw** and **Astral** about the claim is weird. **Natlaw** : Don’t do it! He’s a hobbit! **Astral** : He’s right, I _am_ a hobbit. **Natlaw** : I investigated him; he’s Peregrin Took. **Astral** : Yep, I’m Pippin. If they’re both scum and Pippin is a cover role, this seems a pretty poor attempt at confirmation - they had all Night to coordinate this, and this exchange doesn’t work. If **Astral** ’s town, this exchange makes more sense - he’d be trying to keep his name out of the discussion in case scum would night-kill him later. Better him than Frodo, say, and keeping his role name secret would keep scum guessing. (While a scummy **Natlaw** would want it revealed, although he could simply tell his scum buddies about it at Night, too.) –The whole deal might indicate that scum can’t talk during the Day - **Natlaw** ’s save seems nothing but impulsive. If they can stratagize during the Day, certainly they’d come up with something better than this. Of course, they had all Night to make something of **Natlaw** ’s full claim, too, and we’ve seen what came out of that. –Ultimately, here’s what I think: I don’t think **Natlaw** ’s goal was to save **Astral** at all. I think he did it to a) build cred and b) out the town detective, especially after Night discussion with scum buddies. I don’t think they had a target after **Pleonast** , now they do. ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2359 "2010-09-09T16:20:43Z")
Dammit! I got my mouth all ready for hash and eggs and you ain’t got no hash! ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2010, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2360 "2010-09-09T16:24:09Z")
Oh that was in response to Maha’s announcement of the delayed reveal. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867.md?page=117) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867.md?page=119)