# Lord of the Rings Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 10, 2010, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867 "2010-08-10T19:56:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 126
**Author:** ![Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc8723/32.png) [@Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nanook_of_the_North_Shore)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2010, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2501 "2010-09-13T22:25:51Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > read the canon **coca cola**. > > the middle earthians didn’t march out from minas tirith to the gates to win. they marched to create confusion allowing them to win. that was the only chance they had. > > next time you can get my cards and play the hand differently. What cards? You claimed to be vanilla remember? Or are you now changing your story and claiming a power role? ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2010, 10:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2502 "2010-09-13T22:39:03Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > > [@peekercpa](#): > > > > but i wonder about **the fact that known scum was given a town name** and triangulate back to who the hell else has the same thing going on. and that person has made it very clear that confirms him as town. which i sincerely doubt. > > /snipped and bolded > > I’m not sure I understand this statement, can you explain which “known scum” you are referring to and which “town name” s/he was given? well as near as i can tell **nat** was scum. he had information about another player that certain folks decided to act on. :dubious: we also have another player that claims the same type of information. that player has been coming out with that makes him town. i don’t see where there is any justification for that conclusion. the only difference is that the player who claims has pulled a post death reveal along the lines of: “shoot i knew that”. i don’t see where that buys any townie cred at all. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2010, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2503 "2010-09-13T22:42:13Z")
> [@Nanook\_of\_the\_North\_Shore](#): > > > [@peekercpa](#): > > > > read the canon **coca cola**. > > > > the middle earthians didn’t march out from minas tirith to the gates to win. they marched to create confusion allowing them to win. that was the only chance they had. > > > > next time you can get my cards and play the hand differently. > > What cards? You claimed to be vanilla remember? Or are you now changing your story and claiming a power role? 7 4 o is still a hand to be played depending on how the flop comes. especially if you are sitting big blind and the deal is coming through. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2010, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2504 "2010-09-13T22:51:54Z")
[oog] i’ve just got say this after potter. i think we should get together and have fajitas and watch some house after this puppy is over. i’ll buy a case of diet cokes and provide the eats. if you want booze you have to bring your own. woot woot. **chronos** is invited as well. he can sleep in the garage with **ed** or he can cuddle with the durn chinchilla. [/oog] ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2010, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2505 "2010-09-13T23:03:25Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > and i really don’t give a crap about what **chronos** says (although i read every bit of his posts because i think that is important). but i wonder about the fact that known scum was given a town name and triangulate back to who the hell else has the same thing going on. and that person has made it very clear that confirms him as town. which i sincerely doubt. Seriously? “[K]nown scum was given a town name”? Which known scum was given a Town name? And why in the WORLD would the Scum not have killed Aragorn on Night 1 if they already knew who he was?! This makes no sense. You’re getting my vote tomorrow? ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2010, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2506 "2010-09-13T23:09:47Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > well as near as i can tell **nat** was scum. he had information about another player that certain folks decided to act on. :dubious: Um, none of the rest of us know that \*\*Astral \*\*is town, but apparently you have some sort of information and it seems quite perfect… and there’s definitely a syndrome going on here somewheres. ---
**Author:** ![Astral\_Rejection](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/258eb7/32.png) [@Astral\_Rejection](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astral_Rejection)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2010, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2507 "2010-09-13T23:21:55Z")
Well, _I_ know I’m town. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2010, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2508 "2010-09-13T23:26:14Z")
> [@USCDiver](#): > > > [@peekercpa](#): > > > > and i really don’t give a crap about what **chronos** says (although i read every bit of his posts because i think that is important). but i wonder about the fact that known scum was given a town name and triangulate back to who the hell else has the same thing going on. and that person has made it very clear that confirms him as town. which i sincerely doubt. > > Seriously? “[K]nown scum was given a town name”? Which known scum was given a Town name? And why in the WORLD would the Scum not have killed Aragorn on Night 1 if they already knew who he was?! This makes no sense. You’re getting my vote tomorrow? uh, wouldn’t this be **nat**? i mean if **astral** flips scum i will kind of retrench but apparantly tomorrow is kind of a done deal. how the fuck do you folks know that i will even be around tomorrow? ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2010, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2509 "2010-09-13T23:31:44Z")
> [@Astral\_Rejection](#): > > Well, _I_ know I’m town. 🙂 Quiet you! ---
**Author:** ![USCDiver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/uscdiver/32/354_2.png) [@USCDiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/USCDiver)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2010, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2510 "2010-09-13T23:47:01Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > how the fuck do you folks know that i will even be around tomorrow? I don’t KNOW, but it would seem quite silly for Scum to kill off an unconfirmed Town when we have so many others who are much more confirmed, especially when you are so good at confusing people. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2511 "2010-09-14T00:09:19Z")
By the way, does anyone have a link for **peeker** claiming vanilla? I must confess that my usually-extensive notes aren’t nearly as extensive this game. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2512 "2010-09-14T00:31:19Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > By the way, does anyone have a link for **peeker** claiming vanilla? I must confess that my usually-extensive notes aren’t nearly as extensive this game. i think that may have led to some of the consternation. i don’t think i have claimed anything other than boromir. other than the fact that i kind of knew who faramir was. and the fact that i wanted to be oblique on his handshake is kind of a semi claim, i guess. little brothers can be so problematic at times. fuck **meeko** thinks i am claiming a power role. but if you must know what i am then … you’re going to have to kill me. ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2513 "2010-09-14T00:45:04Z")
> [@USCDiver](#): > > > [@peekercpa](#): > > > > how the fuck do you folks know that i will even be around tomorrow? > > I don’t KNOW, but it would seem quite silly for Scum to kill off an unconfirmed Town when we have so many others who are much more confirmed, especially when you are so good at confusing people. kind of like the **ed** lynch? go back and read the end of that Day and my comments. we end up at the same damn place but with another town dead. fucking scum are driving the bus at this point and i don’t like it. and i ask this with total sincerity. how do i confuse? i purposely ask questions of those folks that take stances. but if folks don’t post there is no opportunity. i really do think that **wanderer** , **hoopy** and **chronos** are potential scum. but fuck it, they play the fragging game. **vote cucuy** because i am sure of one thing his/her input has been neglible and is therefore the greatest sin, anti game. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2514 "2010-09-14T01:25:04Z")
\*\*Vote Count: Astral(6): Chronos, USCDiver, Meeko, Innerstickler, Snickers, Drainbead Peeker(2): Oneandonly, Nanook Cucuy(1): Peeker \*\* ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Who](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Doctor\_Who](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Who)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2515 "2010-09-14T17:00:03Z")
Okay my thoughts. Sorry for the info dump. I’ve been reading along on my phone all weekend, but have been at work and unable to post. Here you go: **Vote Astral.** I think it’s more than likely Astral is scum based on the fact that Natlaw knew his role name. And (even though I think Astral will turn out to be scum), lynching Astral is going to give us a lot more information. If he’s not scum, we can be fairly sure we have some other scum investigative role. Canon-related, I have a theory which I am going to throw out: What if the scum win condition is related to the ring? That is, maybe scum’s goal is not just to outnumber town, but to kill the ringholder? Or somehow capture the ring? The reason I have been kicking this around is that it seems like there has been a push this entire game to throw out role/name information. A subtle push, but a push nonetheless - the subtlety making me attribute it to scum. I will admit, I’m not sure this theory is practically of any use to town and I am still kicking it around… But, in that same vein, I am highly suspicious of Oneandonly’s role claim. I don’t see any point in it. If it’s an actual valid role claim without any independent way to confirm it, then it’s worthless to town. Its only value is to scum. Letting them know, okay, this guy is VT. If I keep thinking this through, it devolves into a ton of WIFOM. So basically, Oneandonly, I have no idea what you were trying to do with your claim unless you were trying to spark more claims. Which I would find scummy. Back to canon, peeker claims to be Boromir. If I could think of two characters from the LotR canon that would be convertible/recruitable, it would be Boromir and Gollum. And I do think peeker has made a ton of noise this game. I know that’s typical for him, but it stands out. Color me suspicious. Now if I can just get up the gumption to go back through peeks posts one by one! On the other hand, I don’t want to just lynch the loud (even though loud is an understatement… if anything peeker is loud like a two-year-old banshee pitching a fit because she can’t ride a merry-go-round). So I’m more inclined to start thinking about lynching the quiet… As far as that goes, I am going to agree with Chronos that we have four semi-confirmed players: Meeko, Guiri, Nanook, and Chronos. Taking them out (and resisting the urge to play favorites by taking myself out), that leaves the following: Drain, Astral, OneandOnly, Snickers, Inner Stickler, Doctor Who, MHaye, Hoopy, Cucuy, peeker, and USCDiver. Pardon me for the obvious statement, but there’s scum in that list. If the game started with four scum, there’s two scum (one of whom I believe is Astral). If the game started with five scum, there’s three scum in that list, and so on and so forth. I am planning to jump into that list and look at some players that I only have the general “you might be scum, you might be town” feeling about. Especially with the Astral lynch seeming fairly inevitable, time to shift focus and start talking about the next step (reserving, of course, the right to incorporate information learned from Astral’s lynch and the NK). I’ve gotta think that at least one scum player is sitting back, throwing out a few posts, and enjoying a relative lack of attention. It’s time to turn up the heat… If Astral flips scum, that’s three of them we’ve taken out. Whether they started with four, five, six, or whatever, we gotta be making them nervous. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2516 "2010-09-14T17:20:27Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > and i ask this with total sincerity. how do i confuse? \*\*You sure want to open that can Peeker? \*\* I’m not going to answer you. Not that I want to offend you in any way, shape, or form, but in the sense that I’m pretty sure I can’t look at yours with out looking at mine. It is in the same spirit that I state the following facts - non-pejorative. Looking at mine would paralyze me in my efforts to hold the mirror up for you. I will suggest, however, that as confusing as others find you, you will receive their criticism with as much, if not more, confusion. The long and the short of it, is simply you [apparently] are not wired as they are. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2517 "2010-09-14T17:26:51Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > > [@Chronos](#): > > > > By the way, does anyone have a link for **peeker** claiming vanilla? I must confess that my usually-extensive notes aren’t nearly as extensive this game. > > i think that may have led to some of the consternation. > > i don’t think i have claimed anything other than boromir. other than the fact that i kind of knew who faramir was. and the fact that i wanted to be oblique on his handshake is kind of a semi claim, i guess. little brothers can be so problematic at times. > > fuck **meeko** thinks i am claiming a power role. Knowing someone to be town moves closer to, if not dead center in, Mason territory, no? And then you have all this talk about post restrictions. About stuff you can’t say, and about other stuff that you know first hand from a Moderator PM. I didn’t get any of this, and well, I think I’m 99.999999999999% confirmed as VT. So something doesn’t wash here Peeker, and well, I think it’s you. Should I have added more 9s ? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2518 "2010-09-14T17:31:26Z")
Quoth **Doctor Who** : > [@](#): > > The reason I have been kicking this around is that it seems like there has been a push this entire game to throw out role/name information. A subtle push, but a push nonetheless - the subtlety making me attribute it to scum. I will admit, I’m not sure this theory is practically of any use to town and I am still kicking it around… Except that in retrospect, I think most of that was coming from **ed** and **Pleonast** , both now dead and both Town. It’s hard to see how it could be Scum’s doing that led to that. > [@](#): > > But, in that same vein, I am highly suspicious of Oneandonly’s role claim. I don’t see any point in it. If it’s an actual valid role claim without any independent way to confirm it, then it’s worthless to town. Its only value is to scum. Letting them know, okay, this guy is VT. Scum already knew that he was VT, since he took part in the handshaking way back on Day 1. The information has very little value to anyone, Town or Scum, and I think that **Wanderers** acknowledged that. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2519 "2010-09-14T17:35:44Z")
Quoth **Meeko** : > [@](#): > > I didn’t get any of this, and well, I think I’m 99.999999999999% confirmed as VT. You are not that confirmed. If **Astral** is revealed as the Godfather, and if **Nanook** is killed and revealed as the detective (both of which I expect to probably see soon), _then_ you’ll be confirmed. Until then, you’re maybe 90 or 95% confirmed, which is good enough for practical purposes, but if new information comes up, we’d have to reconsider. ---
**Author:** ![Snickers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@Snickers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snickers)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2010, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/2520 "2010-09-14T17:39:16Z")
> [@peekercpa](#): > > i don’t think i have claimed anything other than boromir. other than the fact that i kind of knew who faramir was. and the fact that i wanted to be oblique on his handshake is kind of a semi claim, i guess. little brothers can be so problematic at times. Um, we all “kind of knew” who Faramir was: \*\*ed \*\*claimed to be Faramir way back in post 967, maybe earlier. See, the key to the difference between your claim and **Chronos** ’ is that \*\*Chronos \*\*told us he knew who Aragorn was way before we even knew there was an Aragorn playing. Your only claimed to know who Faramir was after someone revealed he was Faramir. Then you got this hunch that you were a sort of “half mason” too, based on what you knew of canon. All of **Chronos** ’ posts indicate that he got his information from \*\*Mahaloth \*\*(not that he actually did, he could be lying). All of your posts indicate that you’ve invented this information out of whole cloth. Is it convenient, if **Chronos** is scum, for there to actually be an Aragorn playing and later killed, to validate his claim? Sure. But the way he went about his claim is a lot less scummier than the way you went about yours. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867.md?page=125) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867.md?page=127)