# Lord of the Rings Mafia **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [August 10, 2010, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867 "2010-08-10T19:56:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 67
**Author:** ![Chipacabra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@Chipacabra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chipacabra)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2010, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1321 "2010-08-21T23:46:46Z")
OK, I think **Telcontar** ’s death seems to have confirmed what I was afraid of: There really is only one vanilla PM role format. Telcontar’s didn’t match up because he wasn’t vanilla, scum noticed, scum night killed him. So, yeah. I still think Ed successfully flushed out power roles for the scum to kill. **Special Ed** ---
**Author:** ![peekercpa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8baadc/32.png) [@peekercpa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peekercpa)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2010, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1322 "2010-08-21T23:47:40Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > > [@peekercpa](#): > > > > gd, **ed** where is your role pm again? > > It’s in my inbox > > You know, that’s the kind of answer you’d give. Only you wouldn’t say it in asuch a straightforward manner. > > I might do it more like this: > > ya know, when edkid#3 was 4 years old, she tried to teach her rodent[sup]1[/sup] to get the mail. it was funny until the hairball shit on my paycheck. i still cahsed that fucker though, fcs i couldnt throw away 57 bucks. > But let me just tell you that in posy 967, I stated theat I was not Glorfindel, and was, in fact, Faramir. I posted the actual role PM without my name at all in post 746. > And, don’t you find it ironic that you are complaining about having to sift through all the garbage posts in the game when you have so many that are not game related and/or basically just complaints about other people’s play? ok, fuck it i quit. **maha** sub me out. ---
**Author:** ![Chipacabra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e19b73/32.png) [@Chipacabra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chipacabra)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2010, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1323 "2010-08-21T23:47:54Z")
Bah. **VOTE Special Ed** Use the preview button, Chip… ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2010, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1324 "2010-08-21T23:51:43Z")
**Vote: Astral** for the case against me that was basically filled with factual and logical errors in what I think was an attempt to save a Scumbuddy. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1325 "2010-08-22T00:09:31Z")
**peeker** , I sincerely hope that you’re not asking to sub out just because one person is annoying you. If nothing else, you need to consider the possibility that that one person is deliberately annoying you as part of a Scum ploy. Or, in the (I think unlikely) event that **ed** is Town, he might be annoying you as a side effect of him thinking that you might be Scum. **special ed** , I don’t think that just because something is likely, it must be true. But if I think something is likely, I certainly won’t base a vote entirely on the assumption that that something is wrong. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1326 "2010-08-22T01:01:26Z")
> [@Hoopy\_Frood](#): > > **Could Telcontar self-protect?** Yes. He was a pretty standard “protector”. > [@peekercpa](#): > > **maha** sub me out. No. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1327 "2010-08-22T01:12:49Z")
\*\*Vote Count: AstralRejection(2): Redskeezix, Specialed SpecialEd(2): Chronos, Chipacabra Chipacabra(2): Hoopy, Gadarene \*\* ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1328 "2010-08-22T01:55:20Z")
First off, **peeker** , take a few deep breaths. You’re going all old-school **Meeko** in this game. Second, while I still don’t understand the Glorfindel thing, and think it’s an attempt at breadcrumbing whatever Magic Bag he’s got (although my attempt at figuring it out through Wikipedia was fruitless), it was my misunderstanding of **ed** ’s post that led me to believe he was claiming two separate names. I think **ed** is being plenty weird in this game, mind you, but that one was mostly my fault. A combination of me reading quickly because I wanted to go to bed and there were nearly 200 new posts since the last time I read, and misunderstanding what he said because I’m only familiar with the canon from the movies. Upon reading the beginning of the Day, I see that **Hoopy Frood** noticed the one thing that jumped out at me, which was **Oredigger** seeming mighty certain about the fact that **Telcontar** was not self-protecting–something which required a series of assumptions that most of us wouldn’t necessarily know about. Scum Roleblockers are not unheard of, or perhaps (although we know this to be untrue now, we didn’t then) he couldn’t self-protect for whatever reason. But no, **Oredigger** jumps in with the assumption that **Telcontar** _was not_ self-protecting. I’m going to work on a WoW of **Oredigger** to see if there’s anything else there. I don’t know if this is particularly enough to base a vote on, but it’s mighty suspicious. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1329 "2010-08-22T02:03:20Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > First off, **peeker** , take a few deep breaths. You’re going all old-school **Meeko** in this game. Second, while I still don’t understand the Glorfindel thing, and think it’s an attempt at breadcrumbing whatever Magic Bag he’s got (although my attempt at figuring it out through Wikipedia was fruitless), it was my misunderstanding of **ed** ’s post that led me to believe he was claiming two separate names. I think **ed** is being plenty weird in this game, mind you, but that one was mostly my fault. A combination of me reading quickly because I wanted to go to bed and there were nearly 200 new posts since the last time I read, and misunderstanding what he said because I’m only familiar with the canon from the movies. I’m not attempting to be confusing. I’m also certain that everyone understands that I am not Glorfindel and that I am Faramir. I do not possess a magic bag as I am not holding any information that I can give to anyone. It is not an attempt at breadcrumbing anything. Why would I claim 2 different names when obviously I only have 1 role. I thought Hoopy was close to figuring it out. [oog] As for canon, Glorfindel was a Noldorian Elf who came back to middle earth and was killed by a Balrog at the fall of Gondolin. All of this happened thousands of years before the War of the Ring. Then, oddly enough, he was also an Elf in Rivendell. In the book, he was the one who came to the rescue of Frodo and stopped the witch king and other wraiths by causing the flood of horses. The movie depicted Arwen doing that probably to not have to introduce a new character. Tolkien probably erred in using the name twice. Elves were not named for other elves. So, either Glorfindel was resurrected or Tolkien mistakenly used the same name for 2 different characters.[/oog] ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1330 "2010-08-22T02:18:15Z")
> [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > First off, **peeker** , take a few deep breaths. You’re going all old-school **Meeko** in this game. Snipped. **For the record:** Having to wade knee-deep, up-thread, is a fate I wouldn’t wish on anyone. I “get” it now. But, I wonder if anyone can pull out anything productive from the peeker spam casserole. I wonder if the damage isn’t already done for this game. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1331 "2010-08-22T02:23:07Z")
First off, **Oredigger** is one of our lower-volume posters. I was surprised to see that I got only 11 results, and two came before his confirm post. I’ll start with that one, because it has content. I’m going to quote whole posts here whenever possible, so I’ll put the whole shebang behind spoiler tags. [170](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12793731&postcount=170) > [@](#): > > I think that voting for anti-town actions is a good policy but we need to make sure that the actions really hurt the town more then they help. Take Peeker for instance, he’s been lynched in the past for being a distraction but his stirring of the post did generate a lot of discussion which is good for town. I think that we need to look at the sum of their actions not just a single on when deciding anti-town. [195](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12794050&postcount=195) > [@](#): > > This is certainly shaping up to be an interesting Day 1 since we’ve already had a claim as well as a denial of a win con. I’m not sure what to make of these yet but I wanted to keep them in the front of everyone’s mind for when voting opens up tomorrow. [248](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12794901&postcount=248) > [@](#): > > I didn’t play in Colorless so it isn’t enough for me. What happened? [324](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12797359&postcount=324) > [@](#): > > Besides the search function you can go back to the forum page and click on the post count for the thread which will bring up the number of posts by each player from there if you click on a player’s post count it will bring up all of their posts in the thread. Just don’t try it with Meeko after Day 1 or you’ll crash the board. [643](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12806358&postcount=643) This is the first one that’s too long to quote. He says he’s back and can finally catch up, and focuses on **SP** and **Astral**. Says that **SP** calling **Chronos’** role lame is a smudge. He then highlights an interaction between **SP** and **Astral** that he says makes them both look scummy– **Astral** for alerting the Scum that **Pleo** says has a power role (which seems weak– **Pleo** did a fine job of that himself) or smudging **Pleo** for lying (to which I guess I’d say if someone was lying, it’s not a smudge), and **SP** for using anything **Pleo** did to determine whether to believe **Chronos**. He also points out that **SP** is very wishy-washy regarding **Chronos**. Then he asks **Astral** about the vote/unvote for **Diver**. Finally, he votes **SP** , because of his vote for **peeker** after smudging **Chronos** , but reserves the right to change to **Astral**. [653](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12806459&postcount=653) A response to **Astral** here. > [@](#): > > I guess I’m just taking a different track, and one that the rest of the town seems to be following, which is to ignore Pleo’s claim entirely. Once something suspicious is done I’ll vote for him and continue to ignore the claim but continuing to bring it up only causes the town to have more distractions. If on the other hand you think that it’s an attempt to distract the town then vote for Pleo instead of smudging him. > > What it looks like to me is that you’re bringing up a distraction and saying that someone looks scummy but don’t want to take any heat for doing it. [758](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12810270&postcount=758) Too lazy to C&P this. He’s traveling and can’t spellcheck. [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12821923&postcount=12171217](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12821923&postcount=12171217) > [@](#): > > Damn, I thought something was off but I don’t think we’ve ever hit scum on Day one. Nice work guys. I’d say I was going to reread Day one to figure out eha happened but damn I jus don’t have two days for nonstop reading. A little break here for my commentary. I’m curious as to what he thought was off, seeing as he never said he thought anything was off until now, and was _voting for the dead Scum_! [1302](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12826894&postcount=1302) > [@](#): > > Damn, I wonder why tel didn’t selfprotect last Night. > > Astral is number one on my susupicion list for toDay. Between a suspicious vote that could have been tryig to save a fellow scum and a couple of other posts that pinger me that where I’m pointing. I want to do a reread of him before I vote though. I’ll put somethign together Monday at work and see if I’m still suspicious. God, I hope that coding worked. On the first hand, **Oredigger** has a point in the Town column for having one vote on Scum and keeping it there, but on the other hand there’s some strange stuff there. First off, while he has excuses, he’s lurking like crazy–very few of his posts had actual content in them. Really, the only post that had more than a couple of sentences in it was the one in which he placed his vote. Then there’s the issue of the first couple posts of the Day. The “something odd” post really doesn’t sit right with me. It doesn’t make sense for someone who made an early case against Scum and ended the Day voting for said Scum to make that post. And then there’s the potential PIS issue of who killed **Telcontar** and how. * * * Okay, changing trains of thought. I’m a little less feeling the **special ed** case, because I thought toward the end of the Day that he was actually _trying_ to get himself lynched instead of **SP** , and the fact that **SP** came up as vanilla Scum has slowed down that particular train of thought for me. The other strangeness came up with **Chipacabra** late in the Day, and I’d like to revisit that before I place a vote, as I’m still on the fence regarding **Oredigger**. ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Skeezix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aca169/32.png) [@Red\_Skeezix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Skeezix)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1332 "2010-08-22T02:26:09Z")
> [@special\_ed](#): > > > [@Drain\_Bead](#): > > > > First off, **peeker** , take a few deep breaths. You’re going all old-school **Meeko** in this game. Second, while I still don’t understand the Glorfindel thing, and think it’s an attempt at breadcrumbing whatever Magic Bag he’s got (although my attempt at figuring it out through Wikipedia was fruitless), it was my misunderstanding of **ed** ’s post that led me to believe he was claiming two separate names. I think **ed** is being plenty weird in this game, mind you, but that one was mostly my fault. A combination of me reading quickly because I wanted to go to bed and there were nearly 200 new posts since the last time I read, and misunderstanding what he said because I’m only familiar with the canon from the movies. > > I’m not attempting to be confusing. I’m also certain that everyone understands that I am not Glorfindel and that I am Faramir. > > I do not possess a magic bag as I am not holding any information that I can give to anyone. > > It is not an attempt at breadcrumbing anything. > > Why would I claim 2 different names when obviously I only have 1 role. > > I thought Hoopy was close to figuring it out. > > [oog] > As for canon, Glorfindel was a Noldorian Elf who came back to middle earth and was killed by a Balrog at the fall of Gondolin. All of this happened thousands of years before the War of the Ring. > > Then, oddly enough, he was also an Elf in Rivendell. In the book, he was the one who came to the rescue of Frodo and stopped the witch king and other wraiths by causing the flood of horses. The movie depicted Arwen doing that probably to not have to introduce a new character. > > Tolkien probably erred in using the name twice. Elves were not named for other elves. So, either Glorfindel was resurrected or Tolkien mistakenly used the same name for 2 different characters.[/oog] [oog] Tolkien retconned Glorfindel, due to his goof (he was terribly disorganized). Elves were rebodied in Valinar, but Glorfindel was sent back to Middle earth so that he could appear in The Lord of the Rings.[/oog] I think what ed is trying to say is that he got a second pm by accident, namely Denethor (i’m guessing based on the timing of his magic bag). In the past (Harry Potter), Mahaloth didn’t put the names of the rest of the scum team, or the masons for that matter in their respective PMs. This means that it is possible that as soon as Suburban claimed Denethor, that Ed knew SP was scum. The glorfindel reference is to say that the mod made a goof just like tolkien made a goof (Ie two characters with the same name, two players got the same role pm by accident). ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1333 "2010-08-22T02:26:29Z")
Okay, so that coding was close enough for government work. It’s a good thing I work for the government. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1334 "2010-08-22T02:31:18Z")
> [@Red\_Skeezix](#): > > I think what ed is trying to say is that he got a second pm by accident, namely Denethor (i’m guessing based on the timing of his magic bag). In the past (Harry Potter), Mahaloth didn’t put the names of the rest of the scum team, or the masons for that matter in their respective PMs. This means that it is possible that as soon as Suburban claimed Denethor, that Ed knew SP was scum. The glorfindel reference is to say that the mod made a goof just like tolkien made a goof (Ie two characters with the same name, two players got the same role pm by accident). I’ve always liked how you think, Red. Unfortunately, I’m expressly forbidden from telling you the information that I have. For the record, I will tell you 2 things. 1. I will vote for anyone who claims to be Glorfindel. 2. I did not receive a PM for the role of Denethor. ---
**Author:** ![Drain\_Bead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47774/32.png) [@Drain\_Bead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drain_Bead)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1335 "2010-08-22T02:33:24Z")
> [@Red\_Skeezix](#): > > I think what ed is trying to say is that he got a second pm by accident, namely Denethor (i’m guessing based on the timing of his magic bag). In the past (Harry Potter), Mahaloth didn’t put the names of the rest of the scum team, or the masons for that matter in their respective PMs. This means that it is possible that as soon as Suburban claimed Denethor, that Ed knew SP was scum. The glorfindel reference is to say that the mod made a goof just like tolkien made a goof (Ie two characters with the same name, two players got the same role pm by accident). I can see that now…but if **ed** believes that the Scum have at least one copy of the vanilla PM (and at the very least, without going back and checking, I’m almost certain that **ed** ’s was out by then), why would **SP** have claimed Denethor? Wouldn’t it have been better to claim a character name from the Fellowship who may have been a power role, but claim vanilla, hoping to draw out the true role? Or, you know, pick a random role name and cross his fingers and pray? Heck, claiming Denethor as a non-exclusive Cop meant that he wasn’t even going to get a real Cop, if there is one, to counterclaim. I am confused. The pieces aren’t quite fitting here. ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1336 "2010-08-22T02:37:08Z")
> [@Hoopy\_Frood](#): > > > [@Oredigger77](#): > > > > Damn, I wonder why tel didn’t selfprotect last Night. > > **Snipped and bleached** > > But just for shits and giggles > > Could Telcontar self-protect? The entire fact that Digger asked this, before Frood’s question was asked (by anyone) is kinda pingy. Peeker is kinda pingy. But, it would seem in a game that has gone to far, to fast, to soon… \*\* Vote Ed\*\* I question the logic of a hand shake now. If we could ever have had one. At best, you are a pro-town scum MVP. That being said, I feel Ed is a good first vote in the “Vote soon, vote often” school of thought. **Ed** : What parts of your failed handshake would you have kept, what parts would you have gotten rid of, knowing what you know now? **Peeker** With all due respect, what can we as players do to get you to tone it down, volume and temper wise? \*\* Digger\*\* Planting seeds are we? going to sew a Telcontar tree later, but only after some misdirection? ---
**Author:** ![Meeko](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Meeko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meeko)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1337 "2010-08-22T02:39:47Z")
In a seperate post, because I believe it deserves it’s own post. It’s shouldn’t get lost among my other stuff :: **Pleonast** : Comments observations and thoughts on last night? A PM or two perhaps? \*\* Everyone Else\*\* : In general, can the cannon support two doctor types? ---
**Author:** ![Red\_Skeezix](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/aca169/32.png) [@Red\_Skeezix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Red_Skeezix)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1338 "2010-08-22T02:42:32Z")
> [@GuiriEnEspana](#): > > Based on an initial review of **Telcontar** ’s posts: > > - he seemed unable to make head or tail of the handshaking attempts (even his own) > - he made the initial case on **Suburban** (apart from **Chronos** ’ earlier vote for lack of participation) > - he was the first to unvote **Suburban** after the claim and strongly suggested we let **Suburban** live through the Night - that could be interpreted as an attempt to save a scum buddy underlining added. Please explain the underlined part. ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1339 "2010-08-22T02:43:38Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > I question the logic of a hand shake now. If we could ever have had one. > > At best, you are a pro-town scum MVP. > > That being said, I feel Ed is a good first vote in the “Vote soon, vote often” school of thought. > **Ed** : What parts of your failed handshake would you have kept, what parts would you have gotten rid of, knowing what you know now? Well, I would have done none of it. I’m curious though, since you claimed to be entirely confused by the attempted handshaking while it was occurring, what makes you think it was Scummy? Or is this a case of voting for things that you don’t understand? ---
**Author:** ![special\_ed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@special\_ed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/special_ed)\ **Post date:** [August 22, 2010, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867/1340 "2010-08-22T02:46:18Z")
> [@Meeko](#): > > \*\* > Everyone Else\*\* : In general, can the cannon support two doctor types? It would have to be a very large cannon or two very small doctors There were a few characters who had healing powers in the game. Legoloas was not one of them. Aragorn is the one that instantly comes to mind. Elrond would run a close second. Arwen is also potentially possible especially if you consider the movies as your source. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867.md?page=66) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lord-of-the-rings-mafia/549867.md?page=68)