# Lost 2.14 "One of Them"
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [February 15, 2006, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668 "2006-02-15T19:22:09Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 13
### Author:  [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2006, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/241 "2006-02-20T17:37:23Z")
> [@Jurph](#):
>
> I’m surprised that nobody here has pointed out the last time they saw him in uniform. He played Career Sergeant Zim in that masterful satire of propaganda films, **Starship Troopers**. You know, the one Verhoeven directed.
>
> \>ducks and runs\<
If a clergyman’s outfit counts as a uniform, you would also have seen him as the reverend in **Carnivale**.
---
### Author:  [@CJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CJJ)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2006, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/242 "2006-02-20T21:23:25Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#):
>
> I have to question Locke’s motives here (hardly for the first time). Last week he was saying that they should do nothing to antagonize the Others. This week he agrees to help have one of the Others tortured. Doesn’t he worry that that might piss them off?
Locke, I think, prefers to indirectly criticize Jack decisions/motives (and those of other socially powerful castaways) rather than confront them head-on; he thinks the demostration of dispassionate logic brought to its inevitable conclusion is enough to convince people to agree with him. I don’t believe it stems from some hidden agenda, but to Jack (and us, frankly) such behavior is inevitable going to be viewed as sneaky and dishonest, meant somehow to conceal his true motives (Now, someone is sure to mention that Locke did resort to direct–not to mention violent–criticism when he beat the snot out of Charlie. But in that case, Charlie was already a social outcast with no real social power, so Locke could afford to be direct).
Given this, helping Sayid torture the captured Other makes perfect sense; it is a way to show Jack his idea of raising an army is wrong without directly confronting him on it; as he correctly points out, “the only reason to start an army is to go to war, and that (torture) is a part of it.”
The interesting part is when Locke himself is confronted by Jack, who has no qualms about being reckless and drawing from emotion in pursuit of his goals. Jack is willing to risk the unknown to get what he wants (the combination from Locke); Locke on the other hand is foiled by his own slavish devotion to personal logic, and wilts in the face of direct confrontation from a social equal. He is fully aware of this character flaw, so he tries to act indirectly without understanding this would cause most people to distrust him.
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### Author:  [@Monstre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monstre)
#### Post date: [February 20, 2006, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/243 "2006-02-20T23:33:36Z")
> [@cmyk](#):
>
> here’s my list of possibilities for not pressing the button:
>
> 1. launches a doomsday device that wipes the planet clean.
>
> 2. activates an island-destroying weapon of some sort.
>
> 3. initiates some sort of communication device that calls Opal to say hello.
>
> Any others?
A secret wall panel springs open, and TV’s Frank comes out and attempts to press the button.
---
### Author:  [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)
#### Post date: [February 22, 2006, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/244 "2006-02-22T16:57:52Z")
Sorry coming into this late. I just watched the tape.
I’m surprised nobody mentioned this, it was the first thing I thought of. I figured Sayid’s questions should have gone like this:
“You say you’ve been here for four months.”
“Yes.”
“Living in a cave.”
“Thats right.”
“Who’s been cutting your hair? You have a barber hidden in there with you?”
“Um well ahhh”
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### Author:  [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)
#### Post date: [February 22, 2006, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/245 "2006-02-22T17:01:39Z")
Just a note for _Lost_ fans: Matthew Fox on _The Daily Show_, tonight at eleven.
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### Author:  [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)
#### Post date: [February 22, 2006, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/246 "2006-02-22T17:24:38Z")
> [@Larry Mudd](#):
>
> Just a note for _Lost_ fans: Matthew Fox on _The Daily Show_, tonight at eleven.
He was on Letterman last night. So note for Lost fans, you missed it.
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### Author:  [@Birdmonster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Birdmonster)
#### Post date: [February 22, 2006, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/247 "2006-02-22T17:34:56Z")
> [@Loach](#):
>
> He was on Letterman last night. So note for Lost fans, you missed it.
Wait. I thought he was on a goddamn island? My world is crumbling…
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### Author:  [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)
#### Post date: [February 22, 2006, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/248 "2006-02-22T17:41:39Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#):
>
> Can they get inside the armory without any of the Losties knowing? Because that’s where he is, and if he stays there, only the people who come and go from the hatch will know about him. None of those people are Others, so I don’t think it’s a given that they’ll know where BalloonMan is and that he was tortured unless someone stupidly lets him out of the hatch.
Well, first and foremost, they can’t let Hurley know they’ve tortured the guy. That Charlie already knows is not so good.
On the issue of whether or not they’ve got a mole, there have been several times that everybody left the hatch unattended. Anybody else on the island who knows about it can get in during those times, assuming they leave it again. Also, during the laundry scene, I got the impression they’re letting pretty much anybody in (such as Libby, who some people feel may be the mole).
---
### Author:  [@Kythereia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kythereia)
#### Post date: [February 22, 2006, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/249 "2006-02-22T21:56:18Z")
> [@Loach](#):
>
> “You say you’ve been here for four months.”
> “Yes.”
> “Living in a cave.”
> “Thats right.”
> “Who’s been cutting your hair? You have a barber hidden in there with you?”
> “Um well ahhh”
Didn’t think of that. 😃 To be fair, he could have been using the same grooming products the other Lostaways look like they’re using…
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### Author:  [@Birdmonster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Birdmonster)
#### Post date: [February 22, 2006, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/250 "2006-02-22T22:08:18Z")
> [@Kythereia](#):
>
> Didn’t think of that. 😃 To be fair, he could have been using the same grooming products the other Lostaways look like they’re using…
The perma-stubble shaver? The magical smoke shampoo? Ah yes.
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### Author:  [@Monstre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monstre)
#### Post date: [February 23, 2006, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/251 "2006-02-23T06:04:41Z")
> [@Birdmonster](#):
>
> The perma-stubble shaver? The magical smoke shampoo? Ah yes.
The sea urchin hairbrushes… The ranch dressing skin cleanser…
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### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [February 23, 2006, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/252 "2006-02-23T07:04:57Z")
I noticed something interesting in rewatching the pilot episode tonight…
When the Lostaways were discussing the TCM sounds, someone said “it sounded familiar”, which I thought was kind of strange. Then, as I was listening to the sounds in the flashbacks of the plane as it was breaking up, you could hear sounds very similar (although not exactly the same) as the TCM. In particular, you could hear the stacato, matalic clicking sound that always preceeds the high whining TCM sound.
Anyone else notice this, or want to go back and listen? Not that this is some great revelation, but I think it’s evidence that the TCM was responisble for bringing the plane down.
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### Author:  [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)
#### Post date: [February 23, 2006, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/253 "2006-02-23T07:33:30Z")
> [@John Mace](#):
>
> Anyone else notice this, or want to go back and listen? Not that this is some great revelation, but I think it’s evidence that the TCM was responisble for bringing the plane down.
Yup. It’s also visible swooping in _very_ quickly during the chaos of the immediate aftermath of the crash, when the engine explodes.
Like Jon Stewart said in summation when Matthew Fox was on _TDS_ tonight, “Tivo it and watch it frame by frame. You’ll pick things up.” _twitch_ 😃
I didn’t watch straight through, because I want to watch the first two seasons in binge mode when the second season becomes available, and I’ve already seen the pilot episodes twice – but I did notice another bit of delayed significance when Kate feigned ignorance with the handgun and Sawyer smiled and said “I know girls like you.” “Yeah, exactly like me.”
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### Author:  [@middleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/middleman)
#### Post date: [February 23, 2006, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/254 "2006-02-23T16:46:57Z")
I flipped over to the pilot last night and I didn’t remember the pilot looking that bloodied!
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### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [February 23, 2006, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/255 "2006-02-23T17:01:45Z")
> [@Larry Mudd](#):
>
> Yup. It’s also visible swooping in _very_ quickly during the chaos of the immediate aftermath of the crash, when the engine explodes.
I don’t think so. I’ve looked at that scene in slow-mo on HiDef, and that is just engine smoke, not TCM smoke.
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### Author:  [@Monstre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monstre)
#### Post date: [February 23, 2006, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/256 "2006-02-23T18:17:49Z")
> [@John Mace](#):
>
> I don’t think so. I’ve looked at that scene in slow-mo on HiDef, and that is just engine smoke, not TCM smoke.
I think the bit being referenced is one that’s been talked about before, and after looking at the relevant frames (frame by frame), I didn’t see it as the TCM either – just a piece of debris. I think I did a capture of the individual frames (as JPGs) at one point – I’ll have to check my laptop and see if I still have the images.
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### Author:  [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)
#### Post date: [February 23, 2006, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/257 "2006-02-23T18:21:12Z")
> [@Kythereia](#):
>
> Didn’t think of that. 😃 To be fair, he could have been using the same grooming products the other Lostaways look like they’re using…
At least our islanders had a whole planes worth of cargo to sort through. The Ballooney had two peoples personal baggage in an aircraft that they had to conserve weight in. Now the Losties have running water and electricity so there is no excuse to not be reasonably groomed (yes I’m looking at you Hurley). Mr Gale looked like he shaved yesterday and had a nice haircut less than a week ago.
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### Author:  [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)
#### Post date: [February 23, 2006, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/258 "2006-02-23T19:04:14Z")
> [@John Mace](#):
>
> I don’t think so. I’ve looked at that scene in slow-mo on HiDef, and that is just engine smoke, not TCM smoke.
Engine smoke that swoops down in a perfectly-defined arc _towards_ the engine?
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### Author:  [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)
#### Post date: [February 23, 2006, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/259 "2006-02-23T19:12:32Z")
> [@Monstre](#):
>
> I think the bit being referenced is one that’s been talked about before, and after looking at the relevant frames (frame by frame), I didn’t see it as the TCM either – just a piece of debris.
[Here’s a link](http://oak.cats.ohiou.edu/~ms322801/lostturbineenhanced.gif). Yeah, it’s more compact than other shots of the TCM we’ve seen, but it looks different each time, and its form and speed change radically. When it withdraws from Eko it goes very quickly and compresses into a very small space, after being slow and diffuse for so long.
I can’t think of anything else that it might be – its path is so deliberate and totally unlike what you’d expect from flying debris.
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### Author:  [@middleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/middleman)
#### Post date: [February 23, 2006, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-14-one-of-them/344668/260 "2006-02-23T22:06:14Z")
If that hasn’t been doctored with, it is pretty good evidence that the TCM was present on the beach.
Notice midway through that, after descending, it changes course and begins an upward climb.
Gravity doesn’t work that way.
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