# Lost 2.17: "Lockdown" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 29, 2006, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423 "2006-03-29T16:50:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/181 "2006-03-31T02:23:44Z")
> [@Antigen](#): > > Oh, come on people! Have you all forgotten that plenty of _other_ things [glow under UV light](http://chemistry.about.com/cs/howthingswork/f/blblacklight.htm)? > > No need for special pens, when the guy in the hatch comes already equipped with one, so to speak. 🙂 With changes in the “ink’s” pH causing the different colors. Eat nothing but Dharma candy bars for 3 days = Blue Eat nothing but Dharma cereal for 3 days = Pink Eat nothing but Dharma ranch dressing for 3 days = White I’m with ya ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 2:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/182 "2006-03-31T02:28:01Z")
Based on the new intel from the map, lots of questions. Is the island itself a construct? Maybe I’m being obtuse, but if it’s actually an octagon, that certainly suggests that it’s not naturally occurring. That plus the isolated location and the electromagnetic activity seems all too convenient. The map seems to have answered the question about the polar bear-- they are doing zoological research and trying to deterritorialize the polar bear through gene therapy and extreme climate change. How did the polar bear get loose? That must have been an accident, right? Might the sharks also be part of this experiment? “Hic sunt dracones”? Are these crazy phenomena all part of the “incident” that has led to the heightened security measures? Maybe the lockdown is the Dharma Initiative’s way of protecting its employees while keeping the experiment going? Or maybe they don’t have a choice about leaving people there because they can’t land a plane to evacuate them? I noticed the incident is described on the map as “AH/MGD incident”… Alvar Hanso ??? Maybe AH himself was on the island when it happened? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Rachael\_Rage](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/71c47a/32.png) [@Rachael\_Rage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachael_Rage)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/183 "2006-03-31T02:36:24Z")
> [@Antigen](#): > > Oh, come on people! Have you all forgotten that plenty of _other_ things [glow under UV light](http://chemistry.about.com/cs/howthingswork/f/blblacklight.htm)? > > No need for special pens, when the guy in the hatch comes already equipped with one, so to speak. 🙂 :eek: Ewwwwwwww! ---
**Author:** ![Rachael\_Rage](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/71c47a/32.png) [@Rachael\_Rage](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachael_Rage)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/184 "2006-03-31T02:42:26Z")
> [@Airblairxxx](#): > > Or maybe whomever was drawing this didn’t want the other person in the hatch to know that he was doing it. Leaving **Antigen’s** insightful, if icky, revelation for a moment…why are we assuming that the map can only be worked on when the blast door is down? As someone suggested earlier, might the map-maker have found access the door where it rests most of the time? That is, up? ---
**Author:** ![Antigen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/848f3c/32.png) [@Antigen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antigen)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/185 "2006-03-31T02:47:45Z")
> [@vaderspal](#): > > :eek: Ewwwwwwww! WOOOOOOOO! He’s map-drawing like a motherf… ---
**Author:** ![RikWriter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/49beb7/32.png) [@RikWriter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RikWriter)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/186 "2006-03-31T04:21:24Z")
> [@vaderspal](#): > > Well, if that’s true (that the smoke-monster and the TCM are one and the same), then IMO that’s a gigantic cop-out. The entire first season emphasized the HUGENESS of this thing, and it pulls trees right out of the ground! And it casts a lumbering, very monster-like shadow on the cockpit of the plane! Although I (reluctantly) agree that the Eko episode _appears_ to prove this, I’m convinced there has to be more to it. Or at least that there was initially, until the writers chickened out because they couldn’t think of something that was five stories tall and invisible, without it being silly. > > Am I all alone in this? A smoke monster is amorphous and can be as big as it has to be. It would also cast any sort of shadow that it wanted. I doubt the writers are concerned with such things as the earlier depictions of the TCM being somewhat incongruous with the smoke monster…this is, after all, a TV show. They’re probably just trying desperately to remember everything they’ve written over the last two seasons. ---
**Author:** ![Askia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/96bed5/32.png) [@Askia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askia)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/187 "2006-03-31T04:36:51Z")
> [@vaderspal](#): > > Leaving **Antigen’s** insightful, if icky, revelation for a moment…why are we assuming that the map can only be worked on when the blast door is down? As someone suggested earlier, might the map-maker have found access the door where it rests most of the time? That is, up? Except that map maker would need a black light up there, too, so he doesn’t overwrite on other notes and make the thing more illegible than it is. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 4:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/188 "2006-03-31T04:48:48Z")
Color me clueless, but I _just_ got the pun in the episode’s title. :smack: “Lockdown” = “Locke down”. Which he was, for most of the episode. Color me double-clueless if this had already been noted. :wally ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/189 "2006-03-31T05:06:42Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > Based on the new intel from the map, lots of questions. Is the island itself a construct? Maybe I’m being obtuse, but if it’s actually an octagon, that certainly suggests that it’s not naturally occurring. That plus the isolated location and the electromagnetic activity seems all too convenient. I think it’s an artificial island. The arcane argument for my theory is based on candy bars. No, seriously! Just about the only branded goodies in the Dharma pantry are the Apollo bars. I’d let that slide if the hatch wasn’t Swan station, opposite Arrow station. The arrows of Apollo are associated with plague and sickness, and of course the “sickness” is an important point. And swans are strongly associated with Apollo, particularly his birth. Apollo was born on the island of Delos, which was neither land nor sea, but a _floating island_, surrounded by a huge flock of swans. Later it is said that he called on giant swans for transport. The other hatch we’ve seen is “The Staff,” and its symbol is the Rod of Asclepius. What happened there? A plot to kill a woman and raise the child she was carrying. Apollo knocked up Coronis, but had her killed when a little bird told him that she was running around behind his back. Apollo took her unborn child to Chiron to raise. That child was _Asclepius._ Less arcane: After they had been on the island for weeks, they had to move further up the beach because the “tide” was suddenly rising. There’s no way a natural tide could do that, and even if the timing made any kind of sense, the tides are supposed to be quite slight in the approximate area the island is. The only thing that makes sense is that it’s not the _ocean_ that’s changing, it’s the island. It’s moving, or it _was_ moving. ---
**Author:** ![Odinoneeye](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/97f17d/32.png) [@Odinoneeye](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odinoneeye)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/190 "2006-03-31T06:51:35Z")
Most of my thoughts have already been expressed, so I just want to say… Damn cool episode. That’s all. ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/191 "2006-03-31T06:58:02Z")
Wallllllllllllllllllttttttttttttttt appeared on Thursday’s “My Name is Earl”. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/192 "2006-03-31T08:57:32Z")
Larry Mudd: Interesting observation. If there’s also a station called “the flame,” does that tie in with the legend of Prometheus, whose fire came from Apollo? I so can’t wait for Season 2 to come out on DVD. These threads keep me a little less clueless, but I really need to see these episodes. ---
**Author:** ![BlackKnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/eb8c5e/32.png) [@BlackKnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BlackKnight)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/193 "2006-03-31T11:00:27Z")
> [@Hampshire](#): > > And the 815 Walnut Grove Road doesn’t exsist. Neither does 815 Walnut _Ridge_ Road, which is where Henry is apparantly from. (It appears that there is a Walnut Ridge Park and a Walnut Ridge Lane in Wayzata. I think it’s neat that the writers took the time to come up with a very realistic fake address for Henry.) From what I can read on Henry’s card: [BRN] [???] [220] [M] [A?] [C-4] [03] [0? - 11 - ?4] [T] The first is eye color, then height, then weight. (He might be 270 instead of 220.) Then it’s sex. Then license class? I _think_ his says “A+”. Either that or “A1”. I don’t know what the next category is, but it’s definitely C-4. '03 is the year it expires. Then it’s birthdate, possibly '64. The only thing that seems to be of interest is that his license expired in '03. Oh, and his driver’s liscence number is: M-152-006-421-000 (I think. Some of the numbers are very blurry.) Best screencap I can get: [Here](http://www.zombieninjapiratemonkeys.com/images/cardogale.JPG) ---
**Author:** ![N9IWP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/n9iwp/32/3154_2.png) [@N9IWP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N9IWP)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 12:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/194 "2006-03-31T12:49:13Z")
Since I have a MN driver’s licence, I can tell you that the box after class is “Issued” (mine says F2). In amy licence, the expiration date is MM-DD-YY, not just the year. More info: [http://lostpedia.com/wiki/Henry\_Gale](http://lostpedia.com/wiki/Henry_Gale) (scroll down) Note that if you click on the licence pic, you get a blowup: [http://lostpedia.com/wiki/Image:Henry\_Gale\_MN\_License.jpg](http://lostpedia.com/wiki/Image:Henry_Gale_MN_License.jpg) Brian ---
**Author:** ![yellowval](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/919ad9/32.png) [@yellowval](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yellowval)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 2:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/195 "2006-03-31T14:12:47Z")
They actually did a pretty good job of reproducing the old-style Minnesota license. And he definitely would have had the old style if it expired in '03 (I also have the old style yet; expires in September). The one thing I can’t figure out is “issued.” Henry’s says “C4.” Mine says “12” (I think). The biggest difference between mine and his is that his is in better shape than mine. Burying a license is obviously a better way to care for it than putting it through the wash half a dozen times. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/196 "2006-03-31T14:23:58Z")
> [@Larry Mudd](#): > > Less arcane: After they had been on the island for weeks, they had to move further up the beach because the “tide” was suddenly rising. There’s no way a natural tide could do that, and even if the timing made any kind of sense, the tides are supposed to be quite slight in the approximate area the island is. The only thing that makes sense is that it’s not the _ocean_ that’s changing, it’s the island. It’s moving, or it _was_ moving. Re: Apollo-- this may be way out there, but I’ve been thinking for a while that the show is playing with an Apollinian/Dionysian dichotomy between Sawyer and Jack. Anyone else know what I mean, or have I just read too much Nietzsche? Kate certainly seems to be attracted to both. If the island is artificial, and it moves, in essence it’s one big ship, right? How does it have a water table (as noted on the map) then? Maybe it’s a construct and the tides are controlled via the weather experimentation station? The machinery necessary to do that might be very complex, but it’d be less complex than a movable island. Can electromagnetics influence water flow? ---
**Author:** ![UncleRojelio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unclerojelio/32/3160_2.png) [@UncleRojelio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleRojelio)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/197 "2006-03-31T14:28:38Z")
> [@Rubystreak](#): > > Can electromagnetics influence water flow? Of course! Haven’t you ever seen _The Hunt for Red October_? ---
**Author:** ![AndyPolley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/54ee81/32.png) [@AndyPolley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AndyPolley)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/198 "2006-03-31T14:45:24Z")
Has anyone considered that the food drop was done by balloon? Perhaps the original Henry Gale was trying to drop supplies when he crashed (or was forced down.) That would explain why no one heard a plane. ---
**Author:** ![UncleRojelio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unclerojelio/32/3160_2.png) [@UncleRojelio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleRojelio)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/199 "2006-03-31T14:59:24Z")
> [@AndyPolley](#): > > Has anyone considered that the food drop was done by balloon? Perhaps the original Henry Gale was trying to drop supplies when he crashed (or was forced down.) That would explain why no one heard a plane. Yeah, but it is kinda hard to drop supplies accurately from a balloon as they are at the mercy of the wind and they are highly visible, even at night from the light of the burners. The best bet is a cargo craft gliding in and kicking the pallet out the back. ---
**Author:** ![AndyPolley](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/54ee81/32.png) [@AndyPolley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AndyPolley)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423/200 "2006-03-31T15:30:24Z")
> [@UncleRojelio](#): > > Yeah, but it is kinda hard to drop supplies accurately from a balloon as they are at the mercy of the wind and they are highly visible, even at night from the light of the burners. The best bet is a cargo craft gliding in and kicking the pallet out the back. I have to agree with everything you’re saying, but… 1. It didn’t seem that pinpoint accuracy was needed with the drop. 2. It’s still less visible than a supply plane of some sort. 3. They’re only at the mercy of the wind if the Hanso foundation can’t manipulate or predict the weather. 4. You’re still probably more right than I am. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/lost-2-17-lockdown/350423.md?page=11)